Timeframe for full implementation of Logos 4 Mac?

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This post has 103 Replies | 13 Followers

Posts 1
Peter Gott | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 1 2009 3:29 AM

Hi,

The question I have that I can't seem to find an answer for is if I get logos 4 now, will I receive the finished Mac version of the software when it is done? Or is it limited to the Alpha or Beta?

Thanks

Posts 2212
Damian McGrath | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 1 2009 3:31 AM

Peter Gott:
The question I have that I can't seem to find an answer for is if I get logos 4 now, will I receive the finished Mac version of the software when it is done? Or is it limited to the Alpha or Beta?

You will have access to the v4 for Mac engine... This engine is now free for the Mac, so you will have access to it when it is finished.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 1 2009 4:17 AM

Peter Gott:

Hi,

The question I have that I can't seem to find an answer for is if I get logos 4 now, will I receive the finished Mac version of the software when it is done? Or is it limited to the Alpha or Beta?

Thanks

You also get a full license for the Windows version, which is operational—although not completed—even now. I don't understand why you cannot find an answer to your question since it has received wide publicity and has been discussed multiple times on this forum.

Posts 79
David Hilty | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 1 2009 4:40 AM

Bob Pritchett:

As soon as possible! :-)

It's still very hard to predict when the Mac port will be at feature parity with Windows, especially since the Windows version keeps improving in parallel.

But we don't have to duplicate the features, just code the UI layer. For some features this is trivial, and one bit of UI coding "lights up" many things at once. In other features, the UI is the big part, and has to be largely redone.

The big unknown is "platform issues". There are different performance bottlenecks (and bugs) in Mono than in Microsoft's .NET, and we're still finding them. Some we fix, some we work around, and some we hope the Mono team will fix once we report it with a test case.

Overall, though, progress is good, and we're even beefing up the team. We added a developer in the last couple weeks, and hope to move another to the team in the next few weeks.

If you PROMISE not to hold me to it... I'd GUESS that you'll have good, stable build within two months that performs well on core behaviors, like reading, searching, and the Passage Guide. I'd [WILD GUESS] say we're six months from "most people can't tell the difference" between Mac/Windows functionality.

Feel free to post your priorities here. We're basically working library, reading, searching, Passage Guide, Exegetical Guide, Bible Word Study Guide, tool windows (Information, Power Lookup, Copy Bible Verses, Explorer, Cited By,...) , etc. in that order. When we hit a weird platform-specific bug that won't affect everyone (problems with Syriac text display, for example) we're putting it aside to return to later. (In the hopes that the platform may have a fix for it by the time we get back to it.)

-- Bob

Thanks  Bob, this is the kind of information I was seeking.

Just out of curiosity, where does the home page functionality fit into that schedule?

 

Posts 31
Clive Walters | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 1 2009 8:09 AM

I am sure we are all grateful for this offering. I hope it gives a bit of peace to enable the maximum effort on rollout with minimum fire-fighting. Thank you Bob - just keep your neck covered up!

I understand that real Mac programmers of the caliber needed here are not as easy to find as those of the PC platform. 

So, a smaller pool - and though many might be very smart, there are just not enough to go round. Congratulations for being able to beef up the team.

Clive

Posts 60
Adam Crafton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 1 2009 12:41 PM

Interesting. . .I posted a timeline last week that was 2 months to beta then another 4-6 months for GA (May 2010) and a logos staffer responded (politely) that my timelines were probably too long.  I didn't think so then and don't know.

If Bob is saying six months then. . .we should plan on 6-9 months - seriously.  This is not a knock on him or anyone just recognition that stuff happens in dev.  We will get more and more stability over time for sure but we are probably now looking, IMO, at Aug/Sep for gold code with parity.

Posts 218
Dennis Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 7:01 AM

If the new product wasn't fully ready for release then why did they announce it and begin selling it. They should have waited till it was fully tested and through development instead of trying to cash in on the Christmas season.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 7:16 AM

DennisRMiller:

If the new product wasn't fully ready for release then why did they announce it and begin selling it. They should have waited till it was fully tested and through development instead of trying to cash in on the Christmas season.

That poor horse has been beaten in multiple threads in practically every Logos forum. Bob has responded, beta testers have responded, and others have responded. I don't mean to be overly harsh, but that question has been answered in depth many times. As these threads usually seem to run through 5+ pages of posts, I won't repeat it all here. I'll give you my condensed version.

Logos released L4 for Windows (Whether that was premature or not is another question). Mac users have a history of complaining (at least some of us do) about the Mac lagging behind the Windows version. My personal feeling was that Logos thought it easier to let us play/work with the Alpha version than to put up with "where's my version" all over again. Big Smile Note that I am smiling as I say this.

Personally, I am pleased that Logos released the Alpha to us. We can watch the progress (and it has been impressive), we have feel that we have a part in the development (by testing, submitting bug reports, and posting logs), and we can even have an input in the design of the final product.

I honestly don't intend to insult you or to offend you, but I have read this same question more than twenty times, and L4 has only been out for one month. Surely, this forum needs a better search engine!

Posts 79
David Hilty | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 10:13 AM

JackCaviness:

DennisRMiller:

If the new product wasn't fully ready for release then why did they announce it and begin selling it. They should have waited till it was fully tested and through development instead of trying to cash in on the Christmas season.

That poor horse has been beaten in multiple threads in practically every Logos forum. Bob has responded, beta testers have responded, and others have responded. I don't mean to be overly harsh, but that question has been answered in depth many times. As these threads usually seem to run through 5+ pages of posts, I won't repeat it all here. I'll give you my condensed version.

Logos released L4 for Windows (Whether that was premature or not is another question). Mac users have a history of complaining (at least some of us do) about the Mac lagging behind the Windows version. My personal feeling was that Logos thought it easier to let us play/work with the Alpha version than to put up with "where's my version" all over again. Big Smile Note that I am smiling as I say this.

Personally, I am pleased that Logos released the Alpha to us. We can watch the progress (and it has been impressive), we have feel that we have a part in the development (by testing, submitting bug reports, and posting logs), and we can even have an input in the design of the final product.

I honestly don't intend to insult you or to offend you, but I have read this same question more than twenty times, and L4 has only been out for one month. Surely, this forum needs a better search engine!

Yeah, I agree with Jack.  I wasn't being critical that they put the product out, they already explained why they did that.  I was just looking for a general timeline for the expected progress.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 10:27 AM

David Hilty:
I was just looking for a general timeline for the expected progress.

I was surprised that Bob gave you as complete answer as he did. I appreciate his input and hope that, six months from now, everyone will remember that he said it was a wild guess. Of course, if we have parity with Windows by then, everyone will hail him as a genius—Well, almost everyone. Geeked

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Ted Hans | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 10:40 AM

JackCaviness:
I was surprised that Bob gave you as complete answer as he did. I appreciate his input and hope that, six months from now, everyone will remember that he said it was a wild guess. Of course, if we have parity with Windows by then, everyone will hail him as a genius—Well, almost everyone. Geeked

 

Like you i also am surprised that Bob gave a time frame to the question. I hope everyone will remember he said "If you PROMISE not to hold me to it... I'd GUESS ........" and " I'd [WILD GUESS]". 

Somehow if history is anything to go by, i pray Logos for their own sake delivers within that time frame.

Ted

 

 

Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ

Posts 10
Franz Lippi | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 10:57 AM

As a former electronic engeneer who wrote some SW I can see the pinch Logos is in.

As for priorities - what I REALLY miss is that I can read my Logos3 notes, sermon files and personal books in Logos4!
Transferring user created information into a new version should be a thing to consider before a new version gets out, we are talking about xxx work hours

If that not possible then there should be way that if you bought Logos4 (Platin in my case) that new these resources should be available in Logos 1.2.2 Mac (there was a statement in the Logos website that indicated that) and Logos 3 Win.

--Franz

Posts 320
Luuk Dondorp | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 11:35 AM

You can get most of your new resources in the L3 format lbxlls: ftp://ftp.logos.com/lbxbooks/

There you will find the resources from the basepackage Platina and lower.

Download the specific file(s) and put them in your resoures folder. Synchronise your licences and restart Logos for Mac 1.2.2

Easy and very Logos.

 

Luuk

 

Posts 1
Jeremy Hill | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 11:39 AM

Umm, why would they sell me an upgrade when it's not finished.  Am I missing something.  I spoke to a guy over the phone, and he sold me on the upgrade, then I start using it, and it's an Alpha version.  I can't use hardly anything I need.


Did I miss something, or is it possible that it's installed wrong?  I mean I can't do word by word greek, I can't figure out how to even use the 4 alpha version.  I wouldn' care if I didn't pay 164.00 to upgrade.

Does anyone have any insight?

 

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 3 2009 11:57 AM

Jeremy, 

I cannot speak to your conversation, but here is what I can tell you.

Your upgrade entitles you to use the L4 windows version which is complete and can be run on Fusion on your Mac.  All work in the windows L4 will sync. with your mac L4 so no work or time will be lost as the Mac is fully developed.

You can also download and use the Mac 1.2.2 (if you add it to your shopping cart the price comes up as $0).  You can do study in this native Mac version.

Blessings,

Joe

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 67
Andrew | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 5 2009 9:51 AM

Thanks Bob - you asked for people to post priorities.  Here are mine, and I think I speak for many (I'm a pastor / teacher):

- macros so I can type a verse in Word for Mac, and right click to copy the text of that verse without all the footnotes etc - REAL handy for sermons, handouts, papers etc

- study notes - I have several hundred in my Windows version, but switched to Mac and ??? HELP!  I love my Mac, and Logos' goal of feature parity has me holding on here.  Study notes please!  

Even if only these 2 issues were available for Mac users (and I'm sure you're already aware of this) I think they are common and simple enough to get Logos a lot of mileage in the Mac camp.  Even my old free program had these basic features!  I've got hours of study that I can't access!

Hope this comes across ok, we really appreciate all you do, Andrew

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 5 2009 1:50 PM

Andrew Micklefield:
- macros so I can type a verse in Word for Mac
My preference is Pages pleas. Mac software should focus on Mac software not windows software ported for Mac.

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Posts 67
Andrew | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 5 2009 1:56 PM

if these features worked for pages, i'd happily switch to accommodate logos.  no prob there joe.

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 5 2009 2:15 PM

Good to know Andrew.  Since Pages '09 works with EndNote X, I dumped MS Word and would prefer not to go back :-)

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 67
Andrew | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 5 2009 5:38 PM

Endnote X? is this a program that has promise for Logos integration, possibly enabling some of the features I'm hoping for?

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