Church of Christ Library for Logos Bible Software

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Posts 934
Matthew | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 8:46 AM

Daniel,

I would be interested in seeing such a package be developed and would be very interested in purchasing it depending on the number and quality of the resources that would be included. Here is a starter list of resources I would like to have access to in Logos. It is by no means complete, but I wanted to at least put it out there to see if others have interest as well.

Apologetics Press Articles

Many of these articles are probably already available in the various publications put out by Apologetics Press that are also on this list.

http://apologeticspress.org/APTopicsList.aspx?pub=1

http://apologeticspress.org/ContactUs.aspx

Apologetics Press Books

While they do not do this for their entire catalog, many of their books are offered for free in PDF form.

http://apologeticspress.org/PDF-books.aspx

http://apologeticspress.org/ContactUs.aspx

Bellview Church of Christ Lectureship Books

These are available on CD in PDF form. I believe the electronic copies go back to 1975.

http://www.bellviewcoc.com/lectures.php

http://www.bellviewcoc.com/

Bob Winton Outlined Commentaries

Commentary set covering the Old and New Testaments. Unfortunately, I could not find direct contact information for Bob Winton, whom I **believe** self-publishes. The best I could do was find a link to a vendor. However, I **believe** the vendor's list of available volumes may not reflect all of Bob Winton's writings.

http://www.tuckersbooks.com/cobw.php

Christian Courier Articles

These are mostly (if not exclusively) written by Wayne Jackson and are available for free.

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles

https://www.christiancourier.com/contact

Complete Library of Foy E. Wallace

This is actually the tile of a CD that includes the following works by Foy E. Wallace:

A Review of the New Versions

The Book of Revelation

Bulwarks of the Faith

The Christian and the Civil Government

Commentary on Romans, Galatians & Ephesians

Current Issues

Evaluation of the New International Version

God's Prophetic Word

The Gospel For Today

The Instrumental Music Question

Mission and Medium of the Holy Spirit

The Neal-Wallace Discussion

Number One Gospel Sermons

The Plain Truth About the Revised Version

The Story of the Fort Worth Norris-Wallace Debate

Sermon on the Mount and the Civil State

The Present Truth

King James Version of the Bible

A Large Photographic Section

Articles Appearing in Gospel Magazines: Gospel Advocate Editorials (1930-1934); Gospel Guardian (1935-1936); Bible Banner (1938-1949); Torch (1950-1951)

The copyright says Foy E. Wallace, Jr. Publications, but I have not found a specific website for the publisher (and am not even sure if they are still in business). The link provided below is simply for an online vendor.

http://www.ceibooks.com/reference-materials/church-history/biographies/complete-library-of-foy-e-wallace-cd-rom/

Discovery Magazine

A monthly Christian evidences magazine by Apologetics Press for kids. Issues are already available online for free in PDF format.

http://apologeticspress.org/DiscoveryArchiveIndex.aspx

http://apologeticspress.org/ContactUs.aspx

Florida School of Preaching Lectureship Books (South Florida Avenue Church of Christ)

These are available on CD in PDF form. I believe the electronic copies go back to 1994.

http://www.fsop.net/Lectureships/booksandmedia.html

http://www.fsop.net/contact.html

Fortify Your Faith

Publisher affiliated with Christian Courier (see above). Books for sale on Christian Courier link here. The website appears to be undergoing maintenance right now, but I **believe** this is the publisher Logos would need to contact regarding obtaining the rights of any of the many books published by Wayne Jackson.

http://www.fortifyyourfaithbookstore.org/

Freed-Hardeman University Lectureship Books

These are available on CD in PDF form. I believe the electronic copies go back to 1953.

http://www.fhu.edu/lectureship/index.aspx

http://www.fhu.edu/lectureship/contactus.aspx

Focus Press Articles

I would suspect that many of these articles would be included in Think Magazine (see below) .

http://www.focuspress.org/Articles.html

Gospel Advocate

Publishes a wide range of material affiliated with the churches of Christ, including a complete New Testament commentary set. Some of their material appears to be available in digital format already.

http://stores.gospeladvocate.com/

James Burton Coffman Commentaries

Commentary set on covering both the Old and New Testaments. As far as I know, these are currently available electronically in two formats. They can be viewed online for free one chapter at a time or they can be purchased for use with Theophilos. Looks like Abilene Christian University Press is the publisher.

http://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bcc/

http://www.theophilos.com/products.htm

http://www.acu.edu/campusoffices/acupress/

Memphis School of Preaching Lectureship Books (Forest Hill Church of Christ)

These are available on CD in PDF form. I believe the electronic copies go back to 1982.

http://www.msop.org/lectures.php

http://www.msop.org/foresthill.php

National Christian Press

Publisher with the rights to various books by Thomas B. Warren.

http://www.nationalchristianpress.net/NCPcatalog.pdf

http://www.nationalchristianpress.net/about.html

Power Lectureship Books (Southaven Church of Christ)

These are available on CD in PDF form. I believe the electronic copies go back to 1989.

http://southavencoc.org/?page_id=173

Reason & Revelation

A monthly journal by Apologetics Press on Christian evidences for adults. Issues are already available online for free in PDF format.

http://apologeticspress.org/APArchiveIndex.aspx?pub=1

http://apologeticspress.org/ContactUs.aspx

Sain Publications

Publisher affiliated with the churches of Christ. I do not readily see any resources already available in PDF format on their website, so I have simply provided the link to their catalog.

Http://sainpublications.com/catalog/

Schertz Church of Christ Lectureship Books

The Schertz lectureship was previously known as the Denton Lectureship. This is important to know because the Schertz/Denton lectureship books work together to form a set. Each year the lectureship has focused on one or more specific books of the Bible. When the books are taken together, they essentially form a commentary set. I know that there is a CD available with these books in electronic form, but I do not know how far back they go.

http://www.schertzcofc.org/lectureship/2013/lectureship2013.htm

http://www.schertzcofc.org/

Science Vs. Evolution (Vance Ferrell)

This is not affiliated with the churches of Christ as far as I know. It is just a resource that I have found to be helpful and that I included here because it is available online for free. It is actually an expanded version of another book by Vance Ferrell called The Evolution Cruncher (which is available for free in PDF from the same website).

http://evolutionfacts.com/sci-ev-PDF/sci_vs_ev_PDF.htm

Shenandoah Church of Christ Lectureship Books

These are available on CD in PDF form. I believe the electronic copies go back to 1987.

http://www.shenandoahcofc.org/lectureship.html

http://www.shenandoahcofc.org/index.html

Spiritual Sword Lectureship Books (Getwell Church of Christ)

From what I can tell, these books are not available to the public in PDF form. I would **assume** they still exist in digital form somewhere, but I cannot confirm this, as I have not spoken to anyone at the Getwell Church of Christ about it. This is the same congregation that puts out the Spiritual Sword quarterlies (see below), and those are available on CD as PDFs. If the Spiritual Sword lectureship books are also in a digital format somewhere, they could potentially go back to 1976.

http://www.getwellchurchofchrist.org/the-spiritual-sword-lectureship

http://www.getwellchurchofchrist.org/locations/church-building

Spiritual Sword Quarterlies

A 48-page quarterly that addresses a wide range of topics. While not free to download, the website indicates issues are available digitally on a CD.

http://www.getwellchurchofchrist.org/the-spiritual-sword/the-spiritual-sword-quarterlies-topics

http://www.getwellchurchofchrist.org/locations/church-building

Think Magazine

Christian magazine the covers a wide range of topics. Issues are available to download, but they are not free.

http://www.focuspress.org/

TLC Publishing

Publisher dedicated to “Preserving Restoration Movement Materials.” In looking over the website, I found “125+ Debates in PDF.” I do not see any information about who owns the rights to this work, but that sounds like something that would be a welcome addition to Logos.

http://tomchilders.net/store/debates-in-pdf/?menuid=9

http://tomchilders.net/

Truth for Today Commentary Series

Commentary set covering both the Old and New Testaments. Published by Resource Publications.

http://www.resourcepublications.net/index.php?page=series

Truth in Love Lectureship Books (East Hill Church of Christ)

Unlike most of the lectureship books on this list, these are available for free in PDF. The books go back to 1992.

http://www.easthillchurch.org/TIL_Books.html

Valor & Virtue

A Christian evidences magazine by Apologetics Press for teens. There only appear to be two issues so far, but both are available online for free.

http://apologeticspress.org/v2.aspx

http://apologeticspress.org/ContactUs.aspx

Posts 7632
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 10:29 AM

I think the argumentative and inconsistent spirit of some of the younger generation of preachers may not be a good thing to inject in the new Restoration Base Package.

Argumentative: In the sense of them dictating what goes in the package and not allowing others' opinions to count when selecting the "chosen" resources for that base package.  Especially if it's not on par with their particular "school of preaching."

Inconsistent: In the sense that a particular author can be an "Anti-" member of the church of Christ yet he's allowed in the package because they agree with him in most of the things he says (e.g. Homer Hailey [Anti]).  

Hence, a wise recommendation would be to start all over and based the package on the "Restoration Movement" as a whole; not as a "Church of Christ Library" since, based on what the OP has already found out by participating in the forums, he would have to "break down" what "Church of Christ Library" actually means every time someone wants to know what the package is all about.  Is it the Church of Christ estimated 30 AD or the one estimated 33 AD? Is it the one that believes in head covering or the one that doesn't or does it make a difference? Is it the one that allows skits during VBS or is it the one that rejects them because no drama/skits need to be part of any church service? Is it the church of Christ that promotes "Bible Search/Bowl" where they promote competition among different youth groups from different churches or is it the one that doesn't do that? (promoting competition in any form or shape doesn't fly with the conservative groups) Is it the one that doesn't approve selling stuff in a garage sale to raise money for a church activity or is it the one that approves selling lectureship books and their respective DVD's or CD's to raise money to pay for the lectureship?

The point? Those are petty things that shouldn't cause division, yet for some reason if you were taught that way in X school of preaching, then it doesn't fly and you wanna go around "debating" people to "prove your point." I know a lot of young graduates that they make it their job to go to other congregations and if they spot or smell something that is not in agreement with what they believe, then they go around trying to force people to change or they'll get "disfellowshipped." My question is: What happened to the "Autonomy" concept found in Scriptures? The worse part is that type of attitude comes from preachers who are just fresh off of preaching school and haven't even been in the ministry that long and they already want to go around debating and changing things for others.  Maybe a key element that needs to be taught in all schools of preaching should be "Humility." Paul says, "Knowledge puffs up...but love edifies." (1 Cor. 8:1)...And If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet known as he ought to know..."(1 Cor. 8:2).

My hope and prayer is for a Restoration Base Package to come along soon, but not under the terms suggested here...e.g. "Ferguson doesn't fly, but Jack Cottrell does, since in a sense he believes some of the things we believe" and that type of thing.  That approach will only cause more disagreements and we don't need any more of those in the church.

Blessings!

DAL

Posts 4465
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 10:47 AM

As a supplement to what DAL wrote, I'd like to point out that if the Verbum packages contained only works written by Catholics or Eastern Orthodox, they would be noticeably smaller... and probably less useful to most Catholic and Eastern Orthodox owners of those packages.

“God watches over the affairs of those who truly love him without their worrying about them.” - St. John of the Cross

Posts 11332
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:09 AM

OK, DAL. You're getting seriously close to loosing your Denise approval rating.  I've no problem with a lack of humility since I've never actually observed humility (I wasn't born in early 1st century Galilee so as to observe). 

But don't mess with Homer Hailey.  He lost his anti credentials in Las Cruces NM, and was left with great Bible commentaries.  Plus he's from Tucson Arizona, no less!  You can't come from Tuscon and not be great.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 406
Paul C | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:16 AM

Denise:
You can't come from Tuscon and not be great.
Yes, Tuscon is a great place to be from >>>> Far Away From.  Stick out tongue

Posts 7632
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:17 AM

Denise:

OK, DAL. You're getting seriously close to loosing your Denise approval rating.  I've no problem with a lack of humility since I've never actually observed humility (wasn't born in 1st century Galilee). 

But don't mess with Homer Hailey.  He lost his anti credentials in Las Cruces NM, and was left with great Bible commentaries.  From Tucson Arizona, no less!  You can't come from Tuscon and not be great.

LOL Chill Denise! He's actually my favorite commentator.  I got all his commentaries, I just wish I had them in Logos since print books are not my cup of tea anymore.  I still read his Revelation commentary, though I've changed my view and no longer go for the view he takes.  One of my mentors met Homer Hailey and said he was a true gentleman and in GREAT SHAPE too.  I think he said being skinny but muscular at the same time.  Some of his "lectures" are found in the "Florida College Annual Lectureship" available in Logos -- but that probably won't fly as acceptable in the new "Church of Christ Library."

DAL

Posts 1085
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:26 AM

The original poster seems to contemplate a package that would be curated by the group he is forming, but published by Logos.  That model raises a host of practical questions.  Will it be limited to publications that Logos already offers?  If not, who will obtain the necessary permissions from copyright holders?  There are some potential advantages: this group might have the connections to obtain permissions on better terms than Logos might otherwise obtain, and Logos would not take any potential heat for what is (or is not) included.  A simpler model, though, would be for this group to act simply as a focus group or advisory committee to suggest works to include in a potential product that Logos would develop.  In that case, Logos will have to decide whether the group represents a large enough potential customer base to be worth the effort of developing the product.

I do believe there would be a significant amount of interest in package on Restoration Movement history.  That would interest users from all branches of the Movement, and potentially others who might also be interested in that area of church history.  As has been noted, Logos already has a few works by authors with roots in the churches of Christ and other branches of the Restoration Movement.  I for one would like to see them add more, which seems like a necessary first step before a Restoration Movement base package would be practical. If Logos wanted to go in that direction, my personal advice would be to use it as an opportunity to build closer ties with some of the universities affiliated with the churches of Christ and Christian churches by working with them to develop a base package tailored for use by their students.  That would effectively guarantee them a minimum user base, and would over time increase the use of Logos by preachers in those groups.

Posts 406
Paul C | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:34 AM

Tom Wildsmith:
build closer ties with some of the universities affiliated with the churches of Christ and Christian churches
Who decides which universities are Worthy?

Posts 11332
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:35 AM

OK, DAL. My apologies; I lost my head.  I can clearly remember the banging of the heavy weights in the late afternoon.  He exercised outside in his backyard.

However, Tucson and southeast IS just short of heaven.  And ... the home of my favorite Supreme Courst justice-ess.

And Tom's advice is good.  It'd be difficult as MJ and Super .... notes, to tailor right down to the jot/tiddle in the restoration world.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 1085
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 11:44 AM

Paul C:

Tom Wildsmith:
build closer ties with some of the universities affiliated with the churches of Christ and Christian churches
Who decides which universities are Worthy?

Paul, that's not where I was going, and apologize if it was anything I said that left you with that impression.  I simply meant that Logos could choose several that would be willing to partner with them on a project like this.  You wouldn't want all of the schools - there are too many for the partnership to be workable - and some of them may simply not be interested.  As a practical matter it would probably make sense to initially approach a couple of the larger schools affiliated with each of the major branches of the movement.   I suspect that if those schools were willing to work on the project, the consensus package coming out of the process would be attractive to people across the movement.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 2:02 PM

Tom Wildsmith:
use it as an opportunity to build closer ties with some of the universities affiliated with the churches of Christ and Christian churches by working with them to develop a base package tailored for use by their students.

I think this is a very good starting point. Does anyone know what software is promoted in the Theology schools/departments of Abilene, Harding, Pepperdine ... ? I list these because (a) I know people who went there and (b) they'd also be a market for Noet.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 406
Paul C | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 3:11 PM

Tom Wildsmith:
Paul, that's not where I was going, and apologize if it was anything I said that left you with that impression.
I fear it is you who misunderstood "Where I was going" I agree that consulting universities would be a good starting point. The issue here is Which universities are allowed. The OP suggests that all contributors or resources would be JUDGED by his Mutual Admiration Society.
Daniel Lange:
judgment concerning the package resources will preferably be discerned collectively by the church of Christ Library for Logos Bible Software group.
If this were allowed to happen, the resulting package would be so focused, That it might be better for folks of that persuasion to pick their resources individually ... Or start a software company they could totally control.

To demand that the Church of Christ Package only include resources aligned with his Theology, seems dictatorial to me.

Posts 1085
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 4:41 PM

Paul C:

Tom Wildsmith:
Paul, that's not where I was going, and apologize if it was anything I said that left you with that impression.
I fear it is you who misunderstood "Where I was going" I agree that consulting universities would be a good starting point. The issue here is Which universities are allowed. The OP suggests that all contributors or resources would be JUDGED by his Mutual Admiration Society.

If your issue is with the original poster, it might make for a clearer discussion if you'd respond directly to his comments.  My specific suggestion was:

Tom Wildsmith:
As a practical matter it would probably make sense to initially approach a couple of the larger schools affiliated with each of the major branches of the movement.   I suspect that if those schools were willing to work on the project, the consensus package coming out of the process would be attractive to people across the movement.

Is there something about my suggesting that approach that troubles you?  It certainly wasn't intended to be divisive or dismissive of anyone else's beliefs or heritage.

Posts 7632
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 4:43 PM

MJ. Smith:

Does anyone know what software is promoted in the Theology schools/departments of Abilene, Harding, Pepperdine ... ? I list these because (a) I know people who went there and (b) they'd also be a market for Noet.

I don't know which software they might have (if any), but I know WordSearch is one where the Gospel Advocate Commentaries are being sold.  They also used to have (maybe still do) Burton James Coffman OT & NT commentaries on a platform called Theophilus; which is the same platform for the Denton Lectureship books and the Living Word Commentary Series.  For what is worth, Theophilus was a very bad, dysfunctional and not user friendly software; especially when it came to adding resources that used the same platform! Total headache!

Oh and when you called Abeline for "tech support" it seemed nobody knew what to do to unlock additional products.  So I gave up on the software, even though I still have the CD's.  If I want to check Coffman I go to the internet.  If I want to check Gospel Advocate I just do it with the reader app WS has available for phones, since I really don't want to install the CD in my laptop.

Maybe putting this together will not be as easy as we would like for it to be. Sad

DAL

Posts 1085
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 4:56 PM

MJ. Smith:

I think this is a very good starting point. Does anyone know what software is promoted in the Theology schools/departments of Abilene, Harding, Pepperdine ... ? I list these because (a) I know people who went there and (b) they'd also be a market for Noet.

I don't see any of them on the Logos page that lists partner schools.

https://www.logos.com/academic/whylogos?utm_source=logostalk&utm_medium=blog&utm_content=textlink&utm_campaign=academics

Posts 8967
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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 6:30 PM

Tom Wildsmith:
I don't see any of them on the Logos page that lists partner schools.

I see several Restoration Movement schools:

  • Lincoln Christian University
  • Manhattan Christian College
  • Johnson Bible College
  • Dallas Christian College
  • Ozark Christian College
  • Central Christian College of the Bible

These would be Independent Christian/Churches of Christ (instrumental) of the Stone-Campbell heritage.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 7632
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 17 2014 7:14 PM

I think Bear Valley Bible Institute in Denver, Colorado gets Logos for their students and they are non-instrumental.  I'm not sure if MSOP does the same, I think they just get Mac laptops.

DAL

Posts 5
Alex Vaughn | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 18 2014 3:06 AM

Just chiming in here, I would very much like a Restoration Movement base package. Also, I agree that they should consult with universities and presses within the movement to determine, which books to include and at what level (Starter, Bronze, Silver, Gold). They could also do some number crunching to find out how many Logos users have identified themselves as Church of Christ/Disciples of Christ (and I think I'm missing a group in here), and what books we have in our libraries. I do agree also that there are a shortage of Restoration Movement books available in the Logos collection. Actually, I wish that they were faster in getting books into the Logos format once they are published (Although, I understand that it is a tedious process.)

I believe the problem involves a combination of issues. (1) Logos cannot negotiate (and to determine what one works in/out) with one large authority or even publishing house for everything in the Restoration Movement. (2) Most(?) universities part of the Restoration movement are not partner schools, which would automatically create a larger base of users within the movement. (3) The aforementioned fragmented nature of the movement: The Churches of Christ, the Disciples of Christ, and the Int'l Churches of Christ. Some of them at least also have further divisions within those sects (sad but true). Perhaps getting the top publishing houses (Gospel Advocate in particular), and a couple of the top universities in the movement (as mentioned by Tom W.) on board would help this. Perhaps they could also give/sell some sort of package to their students as well (Dallas Theological Seminary and Knox Theological Seminary).

P.S. I came across this listing of Universities/Seminaries via the Association of Theological Schools (They are responsible for accrediting various theology programs.). You can search for seminaries and universities by denomination there. See: http://www.ats.edu/member-schools/denominational-search

Posts 11332
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 18 2014 7:08 AM

For any lazy ones like me:  http://www.ats.edu/member-schools/denominational-search

I assume it's primarily structured toward formal theology schools.  Interesting list.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 18 2014 11:14 AM

Alex, I agree with you to a point. But many of the same issues also occur for Baptists and for non-/semi-denominational evangelicals. So I trust Logos can navigate the problems if they have a product manager dedicated to the area. Watching other groups develop, that seems to be a key.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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