Labels vs Tags vs Community Tags

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jan 6 2015 4:36 AM

Francis:
Clicking on Add label opens a dialog box in which one can enter directly a name for the label, attributes and values. This makes sense since it is not possible to apply visual marking in this case. However, it also brings these labels closer to document tags in the way they work. I suspect that this difference in usability could be the reason for the bug, ie, the normal label search syntax does not work for this modified version, but I can't be sure of that.

I'm not sure what is happening with Labels in Notes that have been added, as they are searchable on other types of annotations.

Dave
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Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 4 2015 10:08 AM

Bradley Grainger (Faithlife):

What if the searched term is a tag? How would you envision the highlighting working for that? Just append the text "Tags: tag1, tag2, tag3" to the end of the note/clipping and highlight the one that was searched for?

In that case I would probably like to see the first few lines of of the note / clipping (as it would be the most likely to jog my memory, give context, etc). Then the tags, with the tag searched for highlighted.

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 5 2015 12:51 PM

While I can conceive that generating previews in the search window might present some challenges, at the very least provide at least a filtered view when one clicks on a user file that has hits. CTL-F has the ability to generate a filtered view, so why not search results from the search window?

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 5 2015 3:33 PM

Francis:
CTL-F has the ability to generate a filtered view

I don't think I ever saw that except in the PB menu. It's normal mode is to just highlight results and enable going there. Inline-Search, however, filters within the resource.

Running Logos 8 latest beta version on Win 10

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 5 2015 4:36 PM

Francis:
However, it also brings these labels closer to document tags in the way they work. I suspect that this difference in usability could be the reason for the bug, ie, the normal label search syntax does not work for this modified version,

The {Label} search can be used for labels added to notes by selection or to highlighting without a defined label. What is the bug related to "modified version", though?

Francis:
Compared to tags, I find it somewhat bothersome to have to wait for the list to populate when I enter a value

It is usually quick but sometimes very slow. The performance should be fixed rather than have an on/off option for auto-complete.

Dave
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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 5 2015 11:44 PM

NB.Mick:

Francis:
CTL-F has the ability to generate a filtered view

I don't think I ever saw that except in the PB menu.

Look at what entries are present in the TOC (first picture) and then compare with when I do CTL-F (second picture):

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 6 2015 12:01 AM

Dave Hooton:
What is the bug related to "modified version", though?

To illustrate, I created this label in one of my notes:

Here are the instructions from the MP training manual:

Here is what happens when I implement them:

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 6 2015 1:57 AM

Francis:

Here is what happens when I implement them:

I thought we had established that searching "Your documents" didn't work! Searching your resources will work, but the MP syntax for searching phrases like Hope in God could be improved by using quotes - see https://wiki.logos.com/Search_HELP#Labels.

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 6 2015 2:01 AM

Dave Hooton:
I thought we had established that searhing "Your documents" didn't work!

Yes, I thought we did. I guess I didn't and still don't understand what you were asking about the bug in the second last post then. 

Dave Hooton:
the above syntax for searching phrases like Hope in God is wrong

So, am I to understand that there are errors in the brand new MP "What's New in Logos 6" manual?!!!? 

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 6 2015 2:08 AM

Francis:

So, am I to understand that there are errors in the brand new MP "What's New in Logos 6" manual?!!!? 

See my correction above. It will work but putting phrases in quotes is always good practice.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 6 2015 2:11 AM

Francis:
Yes, I thought we did. I guess I didn't and still don't understand what you were asking about the bug in the second last post then. 

I was quoting you, asking for clarification!

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 31 2015 5:36 AM

Any news on progress on search capabilities of our documents, notes, etc? Thanks!

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 31 2015 5:52 AM

You beat me to it! I was just heading here to ask the same question!!!

Bradley Grainger (or anybody else at FL): any update you can give us, please?

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I have no update at this time, sorry!

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 1 2015 1:40 AM

Bradley, we are entitled to better than that. Should it be recalled that this feature has been advertised as part of the product that we have bought and yet was delivered incomplete? We are willing to be patient, but there should be enough respect for the customer to provide better information than this. There should not be an indefiniteness either to how long it will take for the incomplete product to be fixed. 

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Francis:
this feature has been advertised as part of the product that we have bought

I was not aware of that.

If you're able, please provide a link so I can verify that the plans for fixing this live up to said advertising.

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 1 2015 9:21 AM

Bradley Grainger (Faithlife):
I was not aware of that.

So here is a rhetorical question: if the library basic search feature worked like this: you'd search for "Jesus" and the result would display as 17,553 hits in 554 resources, but they were not individuated links to the hits, could you -- in good faith -- claim that search capability has been provided? This is what is currently happening with labels and tags.

Hence the question: when will Faithlife deliver what its advertisement has promised?

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Eli Evans (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 2 2015 7:41 PM

Hi, Francis.

Your point about only showing the note file and not the notes in the My Content section is well taken. I want search to show all the hits in my notes, too. As Bradley said, we don't have a detailed timeline on when you could expect this to happen, but I will say that it's high on the 2015 priority list. That's all I'm comfortable saying about it for now, because the code involved is old and complicated and touches core features with long backward compatibility lists. But if all goes according to plan (big "if") we can cross that off our list in an upcoming incremental release. Not a promise, but a strong desire.

But to be fair, that ad copy is about labels applied as annotations to ranges of resource text which are stored as notes. You CAN search for those labels and we show all the hits where they lie in the resources rather than in the note files that they happen to be stored in. You can see this in action in this video (scan forward to about 3'50" and watch from there): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi5Yy-sw9S0 

So that ad copy maybe confusing, but it's not bad faith.

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Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 2 2015 11:43 PM

Thanks Eli for your helpful response. Yes, if this is what the ad means, it sure did not communicate very clearly. But whatever be the case, it must be recognized that the document search feature which has long been delivered in Logos has remained in nearly not functional state ever since. It is nice to be able to label annotations or tag them, but not much can be done of it when they are not searchable.

The bad faith statement was not about the ad, but about search "capability" delivered but in such a state that it can hardly be truly considered capability indeed.

I have a strong vested interest in this. Ever since these features came out, I believed they would be usable. I tagged extensively as I was doing research for my dissertation. But then I realized I could not really search the tags. All this work is sitting practically unusable in my library. I have been waiting for several months now in hopes the situation would change. So, as you can imagine, I am sensitive when it comes to this matter.

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Eli Evans (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 3 2015 11:25 AM

Fair'nuff. Message received, loud and clear. I hope we can get better notes search crossed off both our lists sooner rather than later.

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