Treasure Hunt - Dear Faithlife: What about an international alternative?
The Logos Treasure Hunt is only open to Americans. I resume that this is for legal reasons. Lots of Faithlife's paying customers, however, are not Americans. Is there something you can do for us? Thanks!
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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I second the motion.
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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My sentiment exactly!
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Even though I live in the states I think it would have been fair to add everyone even overseas into this contest but I guess Faithlife has their reasons on why they precluded the international folks.
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... I'm thinking that international law and the legal system is the US are a complete mystery ...
How can we help?
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I don't think it could ever happen because of legal issues but I'd love it if there was an international alternative.
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
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Every country has its own laws regarding contests and giveaways, including some very restrictive ones (the EU is known for being very restrictive), some that disallow international ones, some that disallow such things altogether. It would be impossible to abide by every single country's laws in doing something like this, so nearly every company that ever offers a special giveaway contest like this says it's for U.S. residents only, as it isn't worth the cost and legal hassle to make it work for every country in which they have customers. Sometimes companies are able to offer a special giveaway just for residents of some other country besides the U.S. Faithlife should do that once in a while, to keep all their international customers happy.
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Rosie Perera said:
Every country has its own laws regarding contests and giveaways, including some very restrictive ones (the EU is known for being very restrictive), some that disallow international ones, some that disallow such things altogether. It would be impossible to abide by every single country's laws in doing something like this, so nearly every company that ever offers a special giveaway contest like this says it's for U.S. residents only, as it isn't worth the cost and legal hassle to make it work for every country in which they have customers. Sometimes companies are able to offer a special giveaway just for residents of some other country besides the U.S. Faithlife should do that once in a while, to keep all their international customers happy.
If the whole thing is made difficult on account of being a giveaway, couldn't the end product be obtained at the cost of $0.01 thus circumventing the "giveaway" rule and not really preventing anybody from taking part.
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Rayner said:
If the whole thing is made difficult on account of being a giveaway, couldn't the end product be obtained at the cost of $0.01 thus circumventing the "giveaway" rule and not really preventing anybody from taking part.
I'm not sure if that could get around the rules but I'd be willing to pay that price to win. [:)]
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
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Faithlife is able to distribute discounts and whatnot by way of Logos Coupon Codes. I don't see any reason why Faithlife couldn't use coupon codes to duplicate/substitute for the part of the Treasure Hunt that's relevant to all but the people who win Platinum or Gold.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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Rosie Perera said:
Every country has its own laws regarding contests and giveaways, including some very restrictive ones (the EU is known for being very restrictive), some that disallow international ones, some that disallow such things altogether.
Strangely, and despite the UK's tenuous relations with the the rest of the EU, I am unaware of any restrictions placed on folk (or corporate entities) giving away stuff that is
a. legal for us to possess (i.e. Faithlife would not be able to offer an assault rifle as a prize - thank goodness), and
b. legal for Faithlife to give away (i.e Faithlife would not be able to send anything on the US list of goods prohibited for export)
I don't think either of these apply.
tootle pip
Mike
Now tagging post-apocalyptic fiction as current affairs. Latest Logos, MacOS, iOS and iPadOS
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Mike,
the point Rosie was making did not mainly related to giving away things, but to organization of lotteries. These are regulated for various reasons (some of them being customer protection from fraudulent schemes, protection of state-owned lotteries or taxes on lotteries, purportedly also management of game addiction). At least in Germany, but potentially in other jurisdictions as well there are "consumer protection" groups whose existence centers on sueing corporations that don't adhere to every bit and iota of what could be perceived as customer protection regulations.
Mick
Have joy in the Lord!
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SineNomine said:
The Logos Treasure Hunt is only open to Americans. I resume that this is for legal reasons. Lots of Faithlife's paying customers, however, are not Americans. Is there something you can do for us? Thanks!
Thinking this over, and Mike's comment about legally giving away something, Faithlife probably could set up a second mail address where international customers (and not-yet customers) could work with to receive the clues and take part in the fun, and then at the end (while not being eligible for the base packages draw or any other benefits that are assigned on a first-come base or randomly) join in what every participant gets: The mystery prize.
Of course, they might want to check with their lawyers, but giving away to everyone would probably not jeopardize compliance with any international laws. After all, we get the free book of the month, too.
Have joy in the Lord!
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NB.Mick said:
the point Rosie was making did not mainly related to giving away things, but to organization of lotteries.
I stand to be corrected but my understanding was the to be classed as a lottery a draw had to be...
a. Random (amongst entrants).
b. entry must be by paying money (or monies worth)
To be a competition there must be an element of skill involved, in which case the winner (from those who have shown the requisite skill) can be by draw. You can be charged to enter a competition.
I imagine that the treasure hunt would fall in the competition category?
tootle pip
Mike
Now tagging post-apocalyptic fiction as current affairs. Latest Logos, MacOS, iOS and iPadOS
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Is it possible to do an international treasure hunt just for fun, like when we were doing as kids? So no giveaways, but just the fun to find things?
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From the carping and grousing I heard, it didn't sound like a lot of fun to me. I don't do Facebook or Twitter or any other kind of social media, so I just use my time in other pursuits.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Mike Binks said:
Strangely, and despite the UK's tenuous relations with the the rest of the EU, I am unaware of any restrictions placed on folk (or corporate entities) giving away stuff that is
No, there are significant limitations on corporate giveaways in the UK.
- Any giveaway that has an element of luck is not permitted without a gambling licence. Quizzes are allowed, however. That's why you very often see contests where you have to answer a ridiculously easy question in order to enter.
- Any giveaway where your odds of winning can increase with a purchase is not permitted without a lottery licence. That's why when you get giveaways on cereal packets, they always say "no purchase required", and set up complex postal services where you can enter without purchasing the cereal.
None of these would prevent Faithlife allowing UK users to entering the Treasure Hunt, but the point is that without expensive British legal advice about what's permitted and what isn't permitted, then Faithlife won't know, and will have to err on the side of caution and exclude us. (And that's assuming there are no US laws which forbid international competitions in some circumstances.)
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Mark Barnes said:
Any giveaway where your odds of winning can increase with a purchase is not permitted without a lottery licence. That's why when you get giveaways on cereal packets, they always say "no purchase required", and set up complex postal services where you can enter without purchasing the cereal.
There must be some law like that in the U.S. too (or at least in certain states), because I've seen that "no purchase required" notice on sweepstakes and such. I wonder if the laws governing lotteries and contests and the like differ from state to state in the U.S. If so, it's already got to be enough of a legal nightmare for companies like Faithlife to comply. There are probably lawyers who specialize in this sort of stuff. But anyway, all this to say, I'm sure that if it were easy for them, they'd be more than happy to expand this Treasure Hunt to the whole world.
Patrick Rietveld said:Is it possible to do an international treasure hunt just for fun, like when we were doing as kids? So no giveaways, but just the fun to find things?
Now there's a fun idea. That's something that users could start on their own! Anyone interested could set up a Faithlife group, and post clues (which you'd need to use Logos to find the answer to). It would need to be general enough that you wouldn't have to own some expensive multi-volume collection of commentaries to be able to find answers. But it would have to be clever and difficult enough to not be too boring. I'd do it, but unfortunately I don't have enough time.
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I remember years ago... I think it was over a decade ago... There was a contest over at Accordance pick out all the songs from this email and the first correct one will get a free copy of Expositors Bible Commentary... I was the first to respond and was correct... I already owned it and was allowed to have the New International Biblical Commentary NT (Now retitled Understanding the Bible) instead. I do not know if they were following the law, but they did know I was in Canada. Being a small giveaway they may not have known the laws or did not follow proper protocol. I had never considered it may have been illegal...
-Dan
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I totally agree with SineNomine.
However, I am an American but living overseas. I am starting to feel what it is like not being American.
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HOW do you play the treasure hunt?
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SineNomine said:
The Logos Treasure Hunt is only open to Americans. I resume that this is for legal reasons. Lots of Faithlife's paying customers, however, are not Americans. Is there something you can do for us? Thanks!
Everyone who participates will receive the mystery prize regardless of where they are, so you will want to enter no matter what! As far as base packages go though your second statement is correct, there are lots of different laws that circulate around giveaways.
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Kaleb Cuevas said:
Everyone who participates will receive the mystery prize regardless of where they are, so you will want to enter no matter what!
Just double-checking this.
The "Official rules" have:
ELIGIBILITY: The Logos Treasure Hunt Contest (the “Contest”) is open to legal residents of the contiguous United States, Alaska, Hawaii and the District of Columbia, over the age of 18, with daily access to the Internet during the Giveaway and subsequent prize-award period unless otherwise specified by Faithlife Corporation (“Sponsor”)
I expect this has stopped a number of non-US citizens participating at all.
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Graham Criddle said:Kaleb Cuevas said:
Everyone who participates will receive the mystery prize regardless of where they are, so you will want to enter no matter what!
Just double-checking this.
The "Official rules" have:
ELIGIBILITY: The Logos Treasure Hunt Contest (the “Contest”) is open to legal residents of the contiguous United States, Alaska, Hawaii and the District of Columbia, over the age of 18, with daily access to the Internet during the Giveaway and subsequent prize-award period unless otherwise specified by Faithlife Corporation (“Sponsor”)
I expect this has stopped a number of non-US citizens participating at all.
It has stopped me.
@Kaleb, do I understand you correct that you want international participants to join regardless of the "legalese" and if so, is there a preferred way to point out our non-eligibility to you (such as in the email subject / email body text / by using a different mail address you set up for this purpose)?
Note that your invitation is gladly received, but we don't want to jeopardize FLs legal position in case somebody investigates the thoroughness with which y'all adhere to the rules you yourselves (or your legal counsel) set up.
Have joy in the Lord!
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NB.Mick said:Graham Criddle said:Kaleb Cuevas said:
Everyone who participates will receive the mystery prize regardless of where they are, so you will want to enter no matter what!
Just double-checking this.
The "Official rules" have:
ELIGIBILITY: The Logos Treasure Hunt Contest (the “Contest”) is open to legal residents of the contiguous United States, Alaska, Hawaii and the District of Columbia, over the age of 18, with daily access to the Internet during the Giveaway and subsequent prize-award period unless otherwise specified by Faithlife Corporation (“Sponsor”)
I expect this has stopped a number of non-US citizens participating at all.
It has stopped me.
@Kaleb, do I understand you correct that you want international participants to join regardless of the "legalese" and if so, is there a preferred way to point out our non-eligibility to you (such as in the email subject / email body text / by using a different mail address you set up for this purpose)?
Note that your invitation is gladly received, but we don't want to jeopardize FLs legal position in case somebody investigates the thoroughness with which y'all adhere to the rules you yourselves (or your legal counsel) set up.
Please note if you do enter for the giveaway and live outside of the United State you will only be entered for the mystery prize and not the base packages. Due to the nature of the mystery prize it does not violate any giveaway laws that we are aware of.
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Thanks Kaleb!
And solving the puzzles was great fun!
Have joy in the Lord!
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Kaleb Cuevas said:
Please note if you do enter for the giveaway and live outside of the United State you will only be entered for the mystery prize and not the base packages.
So Faithlife posted one thing about eligibility and meant another? Or is it just that people aren't being penalized for breaking the rules?
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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