Question: Biblical Events searching

Schumitinu

As I try to make good use of the different tools in Logos I looked at the Biblical Event Navigator today. I understand that the Bibles are tagged with these events and that we have an entry for each event in the fact book. First of all, if I hover over an event it brings up a pop-up that also lists participants. I like that. However, if I look up the factbook entry, the participants are not listed there. Why not? Or where do they show instead?

Now I wanted to search or single out all the events that had God as a participant. Is there a way to do that? I noticed that Biblical Events can only be searched for in the basic search. And the only hits I have come up with so far are the factbook entries. I already know that there is a factbook entry for them, so that is not helpful. If I combine them for example with <Person God> I don't get any hits at all.

So, is there a way to accomplish my search?
And how can Biblical Events be used in searches?

Dave Hooton

Schumitinu said:

However, if I look up the factbook entry, the participants are not listed there.

You have to go to Participants in the SEE ALSO section, and you see them for any related events by hovering in the Events section.

Schumitinu said:

Now I wanted to search or single out all the events that had God as a participant. Is there a way to do that?

Try e.g. <Person God> WITHIN {Section <Event God floods the earth>}   --->  the {Section} search makes it possible.

Results come from select bibles in either Basic or Bible search.

Schumitinu

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/763200#Comment_763200

Dave Hooton said:

You have to go to Participants in the SEE ALSO section, and you see them for any related events by hovering in the Events section.

Dave, thank you! I don't know how I missed to look in the SEE ALSO section. It is all there, and even more than I expected.

Dave Hooton said:

Try e.g. <Person God> WITHIN {Section <Event God floods the earth>}   --->  the {Section} search makes it possible.

Results come from select bibles in either Basic or Bible search.

I didn't know about {Section} search. Thanks for telling me.

This is good, but still doesn't accomplish my search. But I guess these are limitations we have to live with. To single out the events that have God as a participant (or even better, God as the agent), I had to search for ANY event. But I believe the operator ANY only works in the clause search. But clause search doesn't allow for a {Section} search, right???

Sometimes I find this funny, because the data is all there. But we still cannot search it all. If we have a dataset with all the biblical events, why can I not come up with a query that looks through that dataset and brings up the events that meet the criteria? Maybe FL needs to come up with a Dataset search as a separate search feature.

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/763213#Comment_763213

Schumitinu said:

But I believe the operator ANY only works in the clause search. But clause search doesn't allow for a {Section} search, right???

Yes. But event:ANY person:God leaves a lot to be desired e.g. compare the results in Genesis with a Bible search <Person God> WITHIN {Section <Event God creates the heavens and the earth>} ---> using the Clause result in Gen 2:2, then right clicking in the resource, selecting the Event and then selecting a Search gave me the event name!

These inconsistencies are annoying. We should ask FL for a {Section <Event ANY>} search!

Schumitinu

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/763223#Comment_763223

Thanks Dave for helping me wrestle with this.

 

Schumitinu

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/763213#Comment_763213

Schumitinu said:

Sometimes I find this funny, because the data is all there. But we still cannot search it all. If we have a dataset with all the biblical events, why can I not come up with a query that looks through that dataset and brings up the events that meet the criteria? Maybe FL needs to come up with a Dataset search as a separate search feature.

I thought about this a bit more. Because even if the {Section event:ANY} search would work in clause search, it would still not provide what I think one should be able to do according to the datasets that are provided. So I'm wondering whether the Biblical Event Navigator as an interactive tool could be improved a bit. The factbook is able to pull different information together about an event, such as participants, setting, important objects. I guess it does a cross query with Biblical People, Places and Things etc. So if that can be done, could the Biblical Event Navigator provide some filters, so that the events could be filtered by participants, settings etc.?

This would improve the usability of the interactive tool. But this would still not be the desired outcome. For some things, this might be the end of my study. But often times things like that are just the first step of a study. So after having filtered the events, I still want to come up with a passage list for example that lists the full sections (not just verses where God as a participant and event:ANY go together), i.e. all the verses that make up those events. That passage list then would be the basis for further study.

So L6 provides us to ability to find the details, individual events, or all the participants in one particular event etc. But what I'm missing is to be able to work on a higher level with these datasets. To in a sense first detach them from Bible references so as to search them like a database. And then, since the Bible references are part of the database, as second step pull the references together to work with them. Working with the Biblical Events is just one example. I had to look through older threads that I have started to remind me of similar instances where I wanted to work with a dataset but found myself being very limited. This is too bad since all the information is there already, just not fully accessible.

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/763406#Comment_763406

Schumitinu said:

Because even if the {Section event:ANY} search would work in clause search

I wasn't proposing that for Clause Search

Schumitinu said:

The factbook is able to pull different information together about an event, such as participants, setting, important objects. I guess it does a cross query with Biblical People, Places and Things etc. So if that can be done, could the Biblical Event Navigator provide some filters, so that the events could be filtered by participants, settings etc.?

It is worth suggesting e.g. Uservoice.

Schumitinu said:

So after having filtered the events, I still want to come up with a passage list for example that lists the full sections (not just verses where God as a participant and event:ANY go together), i.e. all the verses that make up those events. That passage list then would be the basis for further study.

Factbook does that in the in the Passages section, but the Passage List concatenates the verse references  e.g. Gen 7:1-24, 2 Pe 3:6 for <Event God floods the earth>. You can get the individual verses with a List generated from a search for {Section <Event God floods the earth>}. Ironically, it does not include 2 Pe 3:6 in a search of complete bibles; yet it is clearly tagged!!

A search to provide all passages in the Events where God is a participant is unlikely due to the very nature of Search, so work from individual events and Factbook. The Clause Search event:ANY  person:God will (hopefully!) provide the passages from which you can get all the events. If your suggestion bears fruit, BEN can provide those events and their passages.