Collectors Not Best Value?
In trying to explain dynamic pricing to this thread, I started doing the math on the percent discount on each base package, by cost/value. Here are the calculations in Excel. The disturbing thing this points out is that the discount gradually rises until I reach platinum, then gradually declines. By this math, if I had "climbed the ladder" by buying Platinum, and then upgraded to Collector's, I would have paid a total of $10,416.24 - almost $400 dollars less! (Calculation: Cost of Platinum+Percent Not Owned*Cost of Collectors = Cost of Platinum+((Value of Collector's-Value of Platinum)/Value of Collectors)*Cost of Collectors)
If I had "climbed the ladder," starting with Platinum (using the same formula).
I would have paid $2149.95 for Platinum, $1127.49 to upgrade to Diamond, $1379.98 to upgrade to Portfolio and $5593.34 to upgrade to Collector's, for a total cost of 10250.96. That is a difference of $548.99. Since Faithlife collects 6.75% sales tax, I am a total of $586.05 worse off than if I had ordered differently. I was always under the impression from sales people that bigger was better and I was rewarded for jumping over smaller packages with a better deal, but this does not appear to be the case.
Can someone please help explain this to me?
| Cost | Value | Savings (1-cost/value) |
| 294.95 | 3177.61 | 0.907179 |
| 629.95 | 6695.41 | 0.905913 |
| 999.95 | 10640.39 | 0.906023 |
| 1549.95 | 16502.68 | 0.906079 |
| 2149.95 | 23343.29 | 0.907899 |
| 3449.95 | 34675.82 | 0.900508 |
| 4979.95 | 47968.14 | 0.896182 |
| 10799.95 | 99502.96 | 0.891461 |
The effect would still occur, of course, for jumping from Starter (the second highest discount) to anything short of Platinum. The numbers are just so much smaller that the effect is less important. Buying Starter before Gold would save only about $3.50.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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My excel document showing my work is attached.8372.L6 Base Packages.xlsx
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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I imagine part of the answer has to do with the difference in resources. When a BP is discounted bij 90 percent, some resources will be added to the package at 50 percent of their normal value and some at 1 percent of their normal value. Higher packages have more current, valuable resources.
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Additionally, are you sure the prices you give are correct? I think there is more price difference in upgrading than what you propose.
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Justin Gatlin said:
I would have paid $2149.95 for Platinum, $1127.49 to upgrade to Diamond, $1379.98 to upgrade to Portfolio and $5593.34 to upgrade to Collector's, for a total cost of 10250.96. That is a difference of $548.99.
I don't remember the prices of ALL the base packages when I purchased them, I do remember doing the math the first few times and found the price to be pretty consistently (within a dollar or two) to be ~ bigger package - owned package = cost of bigger package. So if the bigger package cost (IE price out the door)100$ and the package I own cost 50, then the dynamic price of the package I wanted would be right around 50$.
FWIW I paid 2200$ to go from portfolio to collectors. By that point I owned the largest of several of the denominational packages(baptist, reformed, P&C, Lutheran, Verbum Master, Biblical Languages, chaplain, orthodox gold, anglican silver) and the Classic commentaries and studies bundle which would have made the math much more complicated.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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Justin Gatlin said:
Can someone please help explain this to me?
I did the same calculations when L6 was released, and came to the same conclusion. It's always been the best strategy is to buy packages with the biggest discount first. But my dynamic pricing for Portfolio was so low ($13.23!), it didn't make any difference to me personally.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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I don't know how all the calculations take place, and why. When I went from 3 to 5, I kind of got "snookered" (is that even a real word?). I had several side-grades I had to make to get "everything" that L5 was supposed to offer. So, I ended up paying much more than I probably should have had to.
Now, somehow I ended up with the L6 engine. I'm not fond of it, any more than I am of 4 or 5. When L6 came out, it was offered to me for the usual $500-600 for the bronze or gold. But, somehow, during Christmas and the 15% off sale, it ended up being close to 75% off. I can't say I'm thrilled with paying and paying and paying for never ending upgrades for a Bible. But, at the same time, I feel somewhere along the line, all the money I am throwing at this program will eventually pay off.
My point to all this is probably more cynicism than anything else. The more books and the greater the discount, makes me (anyway) feel like I'm getting such a great deal, I can't help but fall for upgrading, cross-grading, side-grading, and getting "such a great deal", that I totally forget the fact I have more books and product than I will ever want, need, or use.
My other point, which still probably makes you wonder what the heck does this have to do with anything, is, there will be ways to manipulate or find cheaper ways to purchase books, packages and upgrades than what is initially offered. Had I gone a different and perhaps a smarter route, I might have gotten all the way to L5 cheaper than I did. So, because I paid more than I was anticipating, I feel I got "snookered". Now you discovered a potential "loop-hole" and you might see that going a different route next time will get you more for less than the advertised price. Congratulations! You're learning to be a smarter shopping.
Unless of course, you're like me (just with a bigger budget) and you're buying packages that are completely meaningless, just to brag you have a huge library. That sits0 -
My take on the high end has always been one of diminishing returns. Not numerically, but one that you've got more resources than fit within most frameworks. If you are immersed in academia, you sure could find it to be useful. Most everyone else will probably do better in picking bundles that offer a better return to their studies.
The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter
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I wonder if this calculation is skewed by averaging discounts. Could it be that the Platinum package contains books which Logos can provide a higher discount on? And Collectors package may contain additional books which have a smaller discount. Unless somebody does the actual upgrade, I wonder if the upgrade cost calculated in the spreadsheet is really correct.
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Armin said:
I wonder if this calculation is skewed by averaging discounts.
You bring up a good point - are all resources in a base package (or bundle) discounted evenly from their regular price? My assumption has always been that they are. But it's definitely the case the FL's expenses (royalties) for different resources varies within a base package. If I already own precisely 50% of the content-value of a particular base package, and a friend of mine (somehow) owns precisely the opposite 50% of that package, and we both upgrade, FL will make more money off of one of us than the other, unless the royalties even out by fluke.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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It is hard to check manually for base packages unless you are a new customer, there is just a lot in it. But it is easy to check for regular bundles. Everywhere I have checked % Owned * Regular Price = dynamic price.
I think some salespeople have misrepresented (to me) that as "bigger = better value." I can't see why it would be possible to get a better price by ordering smaller bundles first. The bigger bundles should be priced to the best discount. Being several hundred dollars worse off is disconcerting.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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There's something that might play on value that defies even numerics. The bigger base packages move further and further from content that is commonly purchased and costs more to prepare and become less profitable. Something has to give and that's eventually what makes for what you see at the top package level.
The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter
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mab said:
There's something that might play on value that defies even numerics. The bigger base packages move further and further from content that is commonly purchased and costs more to prepare and become less profitable. Something has to give and that's eventually what makes for what you see at the top package level.
That's what I always assumed was happening. Even in very large packages, they may simply not be able to provide the same level of discounts on specialist material that they can on more mass-market resources.
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Those arguments would make sense, if it was not possible to exploit dynamic pricing to get a higher overall discount.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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