Using Logos to answer complex questions
Hi,
I am looking for anyone who could help me in my search to find biblical sources for complex issues. I have owned logos for a year and have quite an extensive library - I love it. I have been able to analyse passages etc. and love the way the data links together. I am wondering if it is possible to get Logos to give me information on complex questions. I am having a conversation with some people at the moment on whether God would ever Judge a nation which includes Christians. I have my own views but I would love to be able to search Logos (or identify a good source) to answer this question from a biblical basis. Is there a way I can perform a set of compound searches such as "search for the meaning "nation" in the same verse that contains "righteous" and the meaning Judgement. I'm guessing at this but any help at all would be appreciated.
Thanks :-)
Comments
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One verse search idea is:
<Person God> <Sense to judge> <Person Nation>
Thankful for Search drop down of choices, which includes using "to" for verb sense:
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Dave Thawley said:
would love to be able to search Logos (or identify a good source) to answer this question
I did a simple Basic search on judge NEAR nation and found this observation by McGee that may be helpful in that it sheds light on why God judges a nation, which would be important to look at while discussing this question:'
"Although God will judge a nation, He is still love, and He still loves—you cannot escape that. The thing which makes the judgment of God so frightful is the fact that God does not do it as a petulant person. He doesn’t do it in a vindictive manner whatsoever. He does not do it in a spirit of revenge or of trying to get even. He does not judge because He has become angry for a moment in a sudden emotional outburst. God judges because He is just. He still loves, but He is just. Since He is just in His dealings, He must deal with sin even in the lives of those whom He loves."
J. Vernon McGee, Thru the Bible Commentary, electronic ed., vol. 3 (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, 1997), 815.
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How did you create the "Bible Grid Favorites - English Bibles" collection?
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Alferd Graham said:
How did you create the "Bible Grid Favorites - English Bibles" collection?
First added BibleGrid tag to a subset of Bibles (English, Greek, & Hebrew), which included all Reverse Interlinears.
Second created collection to filter MyTag:BibleGrid
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Thanks very much for all of this feedback. I genuinely appreciate it and i'm now off to play and find some truth :-)
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Dave Thawley said:
I am having a conversation with some people at the moment on whether God would ever Judge a nation which includes Christians.
You need to be careful in trying to use Bible searches to answer this sort of question. It's a theological question that can't easily be answered by a Bible search.
So, questions you'd need to address in your conversation include:
- What does it mean for God to judge a nation, anyway?
- Does God judge nations today in the same way in which he did in Old Testament times? If not, what's different?
That said, I would have thought that the best place to start would be Abraham (at least if you replace the word 'Christians' with the word 'believers). Think of the conversation Abraham had with God concerning Sodom and Gomorrah. God had judged Sodom and Gomorrah, and Abraham asked if he would carry out his judgement if a certain number of righteous people could be found. In the end Abraham got a promise from God that he would not destroy the city if 10 righteous people were present.
In the end, only four 'righteous' people were found (interpreting the term fairly loosely for now), that is Lot, his wife and his two daughters, and judgement came on the city. So at least in that example, judgement came on a city that included those who trusted God, but God's people were protected from the judgement. That's exactly what happened in Egypt too, just before the Exodus — judgement came on the nation, but believers were protected. You could say the same for Rahab in Jericho.
On the other hand, there are also example of judgement coming on a nation that's full of believers. Think of the judgement that came in David's day (2 Sam 24:15). There's no hint that those who died were only those who didn't believe. In a fallen world, often the innocent suffer, too (which is precisely David's point in 1 Sam 24:17).
I guess what I'm trying to say in all of this is that you couldn't necessarily construct a search to handle all this for you — because whatever data you get back requires some theological reflection.
With all that out of the way, let me briefly say how I might at least generate some data to think about.
If you have Logos Now, the Miracles of the Bible interactive lets you filter at least the miraculous judgements of God and see who is being judged. The one reference to the Israelites there would give you 1 Samuel 24, above. You'd also see Sodom and Egypt — but you'd have to draw your own conclusions, as I've described.
If you don't have Logos Now, the Cultural Concept of Divine punishment would perhaps be where I'd start. An inline search in your favourite Bible for {Section <Culture = Divine punishment>} would quickly get you to the verses that would be most useful.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Mark Barnes said:
You need to be careful in trying to use Bible searches to answer this sort of question. It's a theological question that can't easily be answered by a Bible search.
Hi Mark, Thanks for such a detailed reply, I appreciate your time as well as the time of the other responders). I think this is the depth that was confusing me. There are so many permutations
and each one needs analysis to fully understand it.Mark Barnes said:n the end, only four 'righteous' people were found (interpreting the term fairly loosely for now), that is Lot, his wife and his two daughters, and judgement came on the city. So at least in that example, judgement came on a city that included those who trusted God, but God's people were protected from the judgement. That's exactly what happened in Egypt too, just before the Exodus — judgement came on the nation, but believers were protected. You could say the same for Rahab in Jericho
This is something I quoted in my argument. God said he wouldn't punish innocent people. I also quoted from Ezekiel (8 or 9 ?) where God gets an angel to mark all of the righteous people so when the city was slaughtered, the righteous were not harmed.
Mark Barnes said:If you have Logos Now, the Miracles of the Bible interactive lets you filter at least the miraculous judgements of God and see who is being judged. The one reference to the Israelites there would give you 1 Samuel 24, above. You'd also see Sodom and Egypt — but you'd have to draw your own conclusions, as I've described.
I have subscribed to Now but I am still finding my feet with it. I didn't know it could search like this so I'll have a look at this and see what turns up.
I think after reading and processing your response Im feeling like the search could quickly turn into something like a PhD theirs lol I have plelty of time though (I hope :-)) so I think I may look at this over an extended period of time,
Thanks again
Dave
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