Bug:Double Click Lemma
Why does double-click biblical Greek lemma open top prioritized lexicon at some times and not others?
Works with this layout
but not this one
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
Comments
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I need to know exactly which lemma you are clicking on to give you an answer. I suspect it has to do with tagging. That is if you are using a Greek text or a translation with a reverse-interlinear where the word is aligned it should work; otherwise it should not. I can't tell which you are doing.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:
I need to know exactly which lemma you are clicking on to give you an answer. I suspect it has to do with tagging.
appangello in the first case and koinonia in the second case. But, I have the same level of success with other lemmas consistently though with polar results in each respective case. Success with first layout failure in the second layout.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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Beloved,
You mention that you are using different layouts.
It looks to me that the lexicon is the same in both cases.
When the lexicon takes up half the screen the title of the lexicon is given as A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature, Third Edition.
When the same lexicon takes up less than half the screen its title is abbreviated to BDAG.
Stephen Miller
Sydney, Australia
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Beloved said:MJ. Smith said:
I need to know exactly which lemma you are clicking on to give you an answer. I suspect it has to do with tagging.
appangello in the first case and koinonia in the second case. But, I have the same level of success with other lemmas consistently though with polar results in each respective case. Success with first layout failure in the second layout.
Sorry I wasn't clear, I need to know what resource you are clicking on and whether in the main text, interlinear, footnote ... You need to be working with a Greek text or a reverse interlinear English text for it to work (basically, there are a few other required conditions.)
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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I cannot get the NA28 to fail. I don't have your other Greek text. Have you done a right click on the word in it to verify that it has the tagging for lemmas?
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:
I need to know what resource you are clicking on and whether in the main text, interlinear, footnote
Lemma of the interlinear section or the context menu lemma neither works in the ESV and good morning MJ.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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What lexicon does get opened in the second case?
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Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
Sorry I'm confused.
In the second case you seem to have BDAG open to the correct place.
What am I missing?
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Graham Criddle said:
Sorry I'm confused.
In the second case you seem to have BDAG open to the correct place.
What am I missing?
I opened it by selecting BDAG from the context menu with lemma selected.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
MJ. Smith said:I need to know what resource you are clicking on and whether in the main text, interlinear, footnote
Lemma of the interlinear section or the context menu lemma neither works in the ESV and good morning MJ.
Please clarify if using Lemma (dictionary entry) or Manuscript (conjugated or declined form).
Screen shot shows lemma context menu in ESV for a declined form of κοινωνία (second line under Bible reference)
BDAG has lemma index. 1 John 1:3 has κοινωνία in the manuscript, which matches lemma so can double click in ESV to open BDAG to the dictionary entry. 1 John 1:6 has the declined κοινωνίαν that is not indexed in BDAG
Screen shot of context menu in ESV for manuscript shows declined κοινωνίαν form is only indexed in analytical lexicons:
My highest prioritized lexicon is Lexham Analytical Lexicon to the Greek New Testament that has all word forms indexed.
For example, κοινωνίαν is the Nominative, Accusative, Singular, Feminine declination of κοινωνία
The Analytical Lexicon also has cognate words (synonyms) and Louw-Nida semantic domains
FYI: BDAG is number six in my lexicon prioritization for κοινωνία so screen shot shows my second and third lexicons that have discussion entries:
Some discussion lexicons to consider:
Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament (3 vols.)
Vine’s Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Please clarify if using Lemma (dictionary entry) or Manuscript (conjugated or declined form).
I am using the dictionary or lemma form of the Greek words. The double-click feature is not working for any lexicon tagged to the ESV, interestingly enough the NA28 supports this feature in both layout cases. Thank you KS4J for entering the fray.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
Please clarify if using Lemma (dictionary entry) or Manuscript (conjugated or declined form).
I am using the dictionary or lemma form of the Greek words. The double-click feature is not working for any lexicon tagged to the ESV, interestingly enough the NA28 supports this feature in both layout cases. Thank you KS4J for entering the fray.
Apologies since "any lexicon tagged to the ESV" terminology is confusing.
ESV has reverse interlinear word tagging that has manuscript, lemma, morphology, ..., but not any lexicon; right click uses word tagging for contextual lookup. FYI: for learning Greek, recommend not showing inline interlinear in an English Bible.
Learned double clicking in inline interlinear column causes Logos (or Verbum) to reposition surface text when the inline interlinear word is not in the third line from the top.
For example, clicked fellowship in 1 John 1:3 followed by scrolling up in ESV so fellowship does not appear (did not scroll past a chapter boundary, which would change interlinear column selection):
Double clicked fellowship column in ESV inline interlinear:
ESV surface text was repositioned to show inline interlinear word. All rows in inline interlinear have the same behavior, except blue hyperlinks for Louw-Nida Semantic Domains.
Right click on inline interlinear column shows lemma contextual menu, which could be used to open one of top five prioritized lexicons with headword indexing that has lemma.
Double click on fellowship in ESV surface text opens a resource with English headword indexing:
FYI: personally prioritized Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words before English dictionary resources.
Double click on κοινωνίαν in NA28 surface text opens a resource with Greek headword indexing: (my highest prioritized lexicon)
Another Logos (or Verbum) Tool to consider is Information, which can be configured to update on Hover or Click:
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Another Logos (or Verbum) Tool to consider is Information, which can be configured to update on Hover or Click:
Really appreciate your detailed discussion and suggestions to improve my study. If I cannot resolve this issue I encounter in the second layout will certainly adopt your advice regarding Information Panel.
What remains to be explained is why the lemmas jump to the corresponding entries in the lexicons in the first example layout, but not the second. I simply do not understand this behavior and see it as a bug in the program because it is not consistent with my expectations.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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Okay ignore everything between your original post and here.
We all missed the obvious. In your first layout the text and the dictionary are part of the same link set. In the 2nd layout they are not linked.[:$]
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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LOL!!![:D]
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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One final observation. Still, when I select the lemma either in the interlinear panel or the context menu BDAG fails to jump to the corresponding lemma with the lexicon and bible linked. However selecting the text results in a jump to the corresponding Greek lemma. This is still behavior unbecoming and not what I observe in the first layout example???
Edit: After careful review of the behavior in the corrected layout, it is observed that the behaviors of both layouts are congruent. The double-click function jumping to the headword in a lexicon is true only when the word is selected in the main text. I have learned something new. I hope that I've not been too much of a burden to the forum.[:$]
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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While I suspect I know the reason, I don't have the BDAG to test to verify. We need someone who actually reads Greek well and can check that the lemmas match between dictionaries to sort the next level out.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:
While I suspect I know the reason, I don't have the BDAG to test to verify. We need someone who actually reads Greek well and can check that the lemmas match between dictionaries to sort the next level out.
See my edit above.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.3.2 1TB SSD
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