Embarrassing question - Judah and Israel

The best way to figure it out is to read I Samuel - II Chronicles with a good commentary like The Bible Knowledge Commentary (it is in a dozen or so L7 packages)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/857258#Comment_857258

Thanks Robert...I actually have that resource and will open and review it as well...thanks.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/857259#Comment_857259

After reading the Bible books Kingdom of Priests: A History of Old Testament Israel would be a good next book to read.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/857260#Comment_857260

The division was after the death of Solomon. Map below is from:
Holman Book of Biblical Charts, Maps, and Reconstructions

RyanB

Probably not enough time to do it before your class, but I'd highly recommending taking the time at least once to read the bible in chronological order. You can buy a special Bible for this, or make your own reading plan in Logos HERE. I found reading the Bible this way to be very helpful not only for understanding what was going on with Judah and Israel, but also for understanding the role and timing of the minor prophets.

Dave L

This might help understand Israel & Judah. Included is a download link for the Reese Chronological Bible as a personal Book for Logos. But first;

Reese Chronological Bible From an Amazon Customer review.

5.0 out of 5 stars Love the Side-by-side Text for Divided Kingdom

By Amazon Customer on January 7, 2012
Format: Hardcover Verified Purchase

"I agree with the other reviews that a chronological bible is a must for the serious bible student; one of the most helpful Old Testament features is the side-by-side text during the time of the divided kingdom."

"You will get a better historical understanding of parallel events, especially during the fall of the Northern kingdom and then ending with the exile to Babylon. During this period (945-721 B.C.), the left side of each page follows the history of Israel, known as the Northern Kingdom, and the right side of the page Judah, the Southern Kingdom."

https://www.amazon.com/review/R26XJHYU9RIMUC/ref=cm_cr_dp_title?ie=UTF8&ASIN=0871231158&channel=detail-glance&nodeID=283155&store=books

Here is a link of the Reese Chronological Bible in Personal Book form by John Brumett

https://community.logos.com/cfs-file.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Discussions.Components.Files/77/6036.Reese-Chronological-Bible.docx

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/857311#Comment_857311

Thank you Ryan, Dave, and Robert (awesome map...cool beans!). Your replies and book suggestions (some of which I thankfully own) are a blessing. I over J is how I will remember the map and of course read more so I get the important geographical cues properly.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/857338#Comment_857338

I continue to wonder if there isn't some easy way to open the following

1 Bible
1 Map (or book that tracks with maps so while reading Isaiah I can actually figure out where I am geographically...a sort of "Where in the Biblical World Am I" feature
1 Commentary
1 People/Place/Location pronouncer that always works especially when it comes time to read in a public setting and you either need to say it phonetically or have the software actually say the word aloud for you.

To me this seems like something very basic that Logos should have available right off without programming a layout and all the steps (I call them crazy gyrations) that takes.

Here is my most recent attempt. Does it look right to any of you? (Mr. Harner, I went back and added the Holman Book though it is missing from my example below)

Does anyone else beside me this process should be effortless and simple? Having a Biblical map that tracks with you while you read would be so awesome don't you think? I linked all my resources and to date can not find a map that follows along or changes as you go...wow what a resource that would be!

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858528#Comment_858528

Does anyone else beside me this process should be effortless and simple? Having a Biblical map that tracks with you while you read would be so awesome don't you think? I linked all my resources and to date can not find a map that follows along or changes as you go...wow what a resource that would be!

It may be possible, but also possible the costs would be that no one this side of Roger Williams Park could afford it. Lots of elbow grease can set the maps in your mind so you have less need to look at them after a while. I have a dead tree atlas or two I'm planning to read cover to cover in next few months to further solidify land masses in the little gray cells. Spending the time including at minimum a read though Gen-Rev every year pays off after a while.

Justin Gatlin

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858528#Comment_858528

1 Bible

1 Map (or book that tracks with maps so while reading Isaiah I can actually figure out where I am geographically...a sort of "Where in the Biblical World Am I" feature

1 Commentary

1 People/Place/Location pronouncer that always works especially when it comes time to read in a public setting and you either need to say it phonetically or have the software actually say the word aloud for you.

I would make a custom passage guide, with just the sections "Atlas", "Biblical Places" and "Biblical People" (Atlas is usually what I want more than biblical places, but your mileage may vary). Then put that into a layout with a bible and your preferred commentary. When you click on a biblical person or place, it will open the Factbook, which will pronounce it for you.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858643#Comment_858643

Thanks Mr. Gatlin. I will try that out. What a shame one of the new layouts doesn't automatically do this for us at the start menu, right? I know that Bible Explorer tries to do some of this but as I pointed out elsewhere in the forums...it needs to be vastly improved and overhauled along with the confusing menus...seriously.

Addendum: I tried this and incredibly do not find any results under Atlas (though I own some within Logos) other other items on this list.

What gives? See below please:

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858852#Comment_858852

What a shame one of the new layouts doesnt automatically do this for us at the start menu, right?!!!

Don't gripe ... make a suggestion.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858861#Comment_858861

..thanks I did and have...apparently more than once. I am seriously looking for assistance and am finding it in other posts too.

I am just stunned at how challenging doing the most basic of things in Logos really is. I look forward to a from the ground up revamp now that 7.0 has been released.

Blessings,

Joshua

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858852#Comment_858852

under Atlas (though I own some within Logos) other other items on this list.

Under Atlas you get only results from a specific online resource called "Atlas"

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858879#Comment_858879

I look forward to a from the ground up revamp now that 7.0 has been released.

Given the current direction of the betas, I doubt that is in the near future. I would expect the next revamp to be timed to when voice and touch are the primary rather than secondary ways of dealing with the computer.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858880#Comment_858880

MJ...that is amazing. I thought it might draw from other atlases within our library.

(as an aside....)

My guess is reading anyone looking at my posts is either annoyed (sorry) or hopefully smiling recognizing I am in the throes of finally trying to make practical use of Logos (LogosNow to be precise) and seeing how far it has come and well...how much further it has to go.

I also know that my honest confession of ignorance (gulp) is helpful to some when the answers are posted as well and for God's grace there (and the kindness of so many forum posters) I am thankful.

I would enjoy simplicity in menu and functionality but recognize the complexity of that pursuit too. I just feel with each iteration of Logos I need to become a programmer of sorts. Seems silly to me. I am very thankful for what we do have though (Praise God and thank you Logos developers one and all).

Ted Weis

Do you two forget who was in the north and who was in the south and how much each mattered in the Bible?

Here's how I remember it: Israel, Judah, North, South, in the alphabet, I comes before J.

PetahChristian

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858882#Comment_858882

I would expect the next revamp to be timed to when voice and touch are the primary rather than secondary ways of dealing with the computer.

Hello Computer

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858886#Comment_858886

Thanks Ted. I am looking over my first silly post above and have come quite far since then in my understanding. I just read that Israel attacked Judah in the ESV Study Bible and that Bible contains come nice color maps in it too.

I am just dumbfounded by how poor my understanding of Biblical geography is...and for that I can only ask that God gives me enough years to study and correct it as I believe it is vital not just for classes but to aid others when I share info simply with them in the future too.

I comes before J is an excellent way of looking at it. Now keeping track of all those oracles, supposed misguided alliance attempts, and how often people did not rely upon the Lord exclusively when they should have - these are entirely different important matters.

It seems amazing over 2K have looked at this post. Probably tuning it to laugh along with me or see how I am doing trying to make better use of this awesome tool in Logos we have.

Blessings Sir/All

Mattillo

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858898#Comment_858898

I never realized I had a resource titled biblical places maps by logos. It doesn't show under my interactives. Should it?

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858928#Comment_858928

Should it?

No it is not an interactive. You should have a dataset Biblical places that supports Factbook (among other things).

As for this, it is not in my library.

resource titled biblical places maps

Mattillo

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858932#Comment_858932

Interesting. Thanks MJ. Joshin posted a picture of it earlier.

I wonder where I got it from.

Ken McGuire

Were Judah and Israel ever one and how much impact through how many years did they have upon one another?

Yes. They certainly were united during the reign of King David and his son, Solomon. And their was some union of the North and South under their predecessor, King Saul, although for a time David was a rival king. Before that any national unity seems to be whoever recognized a particular charismatic Judge and showed up when they called. And of course, there was the time of the Exodus...

I would strongly recommend a read through of Genesis, Joshua, Judges, 1/2 Samuel, and 1/2 Kings, looking up the various place names as you go along. Back in school, when I did this, it was with the Oxford Bible Atlas (as an undergrad) and the Macmillan Bible Atlas (now Carta) in Grad school. Logos has a Biblical Places tool that should give this info too...

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858947#Comment_858947

I wonder where I got it from.

Doing a search on maps I found it [:$]... no biographic information which is very odd ...

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858950#Comment_858950

I would strongly recommend a read through of Genesis, Joshua, Judges, 1/2 Samuel, and 1/2 Kings, looking up the various place names as you go along.

The best way to learn the Bible is to read it (and read and read . . .)

JJ Miller

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/858898#Comment_858898

I am just dumbfounded by how poor my understanding of Biblical geography is...

No one...no matter how smart or how spiritual, gains such knowledge easily. As others have said, reading and re-reading the historical books in the OT will go far. Bible Atlases give some needed help. And I agree, Kingdom of Priests (book) is a good way to begin to understand.

I still remember how remarkable it was when I learned this historical overview.... and how:

I had been a Christian all of a year or two...and I took a course at my University called "Old Testament Introduction". Raised an atheist, I hadn't heard the OT stories as a child. And by the end of that course, I could "think" my way through the main stories of the Bible. Even though I had been a church goer for two years where the church "preached the Bible" for 40 minutes each week, I had no clue that Israel and Judah were two separate entities... how that happened, why that happened, what happened because of it. And in rather short order, I could now "think my way through the Biblical story". It was an enlightenment... but it paid off big when I now read my NT in a new light.

Thanks for posting this... it is a reminder that we often need to communicate the simple stuff... the stuff we think we all should know (simply because we do), while forgetting what it took for us to see these things in our own journey.

God's richest blessings,

Cynthia in Florida

Hello Josh:

I hope you don't mind a "non-logos" suggestion.

Whenever I study Scripture, I print out a map or two of the region (usually Israel and the middle-east area) . Print out ones with not too much information on it though, just major regions and cities. Then, when I am reading, and I come across a geographic reference, I go to the map and find it on the map. Then, I number it (the number depending on what number reference it is in my reading) and then over to the side, I write what the reference number relates to in my reading.

For instance, I'm currently studying the Gospel of John.

I printed out a map of Israel..

Chapter 1 takes place in Jerusalem, so I put a number 1 at Jerusalem and then over to the side, I put

1. Jerusalem (Ch. 1)

Then, Jesus comes to John the Baptist "in Bethany, on the other side of the Jordan." So, I put a number two at Bethany and write on the side of my map under my number 1

2. Bethany - Jesus comes to John the Baptist (1.28)

He also called Andrew and Peter from there so I added...

2. Bethany - Jesus Comes to John the Baptist (1:28) and Calls Andrew and Peter (1:38)

Later, I read in Chapter One that Jesus goes to the region of Galilee and calls Philip and Nathaniel so I put a number three up in the Galilee region and write on the side of my map...

3. Galilee - Jesus calls Philip and Nathaniel to follow Him (1:43)

Chapter 2 tells me He went to Cana for a wedding, so I put a number 4 near Cana and write on the side of my map

4. Cana - Jesus attends Wedding (First Sign). (2:1)

The reason I don't draw lines is because they get too confusing to follow, but do what works for you.

There are a few reasons this works better than just looking at a map.

First you are actively searching for geographical locations, and you mark your text, thus interacting with it.

Then, you go to your map and "hunt" for the location (although once you do this a couple of times, the locations become easy to find).

Then, you number the region and write down what happened at that region, again, interacting with it.

By writing down what occurred there, you will find you remember the region even better, as "the pencil is the best of eyes."

As a Bible study teacher, and one who writes inductive studies, I have found that my students LOVE doing this and discover so much more than just looking at a map in the back of their Bibles or online...or in this case, on Logos.

Now the reason I don't print out a map with ALL the cities, etc., is that if I do, it becomes too easy after a while. So, I print out a simplified version, and then if there is something I cannot find...I go to a Bible atlas or Logos for a little bit of "research" and write the city or mountain or whatever in the location on my map, thus re-enforcing my learning even more.

I hope this makes sense. If not, I'll scan my map I'm working on now with John and upload it as an example.

Blessings as you embark on this journey. I LOVE studying Scripture this way. I pray you come to experience the joy and sheer fun of learning biblical geography.

BTW...Rick Griffith at biblestudydownloads.org has a fantastic free pdf file on learning biblical geography. See here. http://biblestudydownloads.org/resource/bible-geography/

The PDF document is like the study/manual, (the DOC is the same material but is graphic heavy and takes a while to load). BUT...don't miss out on his FANTASTIC Power Points that go with it. They are filled with graphics, maps, pictures, explanations, etc. ENJOY!