ICC is $19.99 a volume. Worth it? I have a few volumes when they were $2-$3 or so a while ago. I have many commentaries, but not this one. It would cost me a bit to complete it.
Challies recommends a few. I'm going to check best commentaries too
https://www.logos.com/product/136960/challies-recommends-best-new-testament-commentaries
Yeah I have that bundle. One of the things I noticed is a lot of the ICC is old, almost Classic Commentary vintage.
I'm going to grab acts, Romans, and pastoral epistles. The rest seem too dated for me but these seem highly ranked so I'm just likey to run into citations from them later on
Don't forget Matthew, there are a larger number of links to it. It's very well done, ranked number seven at best commentaries. Carson's got a 87.2 score and rated number one. The ICC volume had a score of 80.6.
Marshall on the Pastorals is $17 and change for January monthly sale:
https://www.logos.com/product/4191/a-critical-and-exegetical-commentary-on-the-pastoral-epistles
DAL
I went thru and pulled anything recent and not too minor. Especially the Isaiah group.
One oldie that I earlier missed was Charles on Revelations. For the pseudepigraphic'ers, you might like this one (the same 'Charles').
Fair warning: the package price doesn't include the sale. For me, double, compared to 'New to You'.
Marshall on the Pastorals is $17 and change for January monthly sale: https://www.logos.com/product/4191/a-critical-and-exegetical-commentary-on-the-pastoral-epistles DAL
I passed on the ICC sale. The Marshall volume is not part of the sale but came on sale separately. Other more recent volumes of the series are not included, only the oldies. If you love classic commentaries, these can be takers. There is to be sure value in them but on the whole, they are too dated.
Marshall on the Pastorals is $17 and change for January monthly sale: https://www.logos.com/product/4191/a-critical-and-exegetical-commentary-on-the-pastoral-epistles DAL That is a good deal.
Yes indeed! If I remember correctly, it use to sell for $70 bucks and change, but I guess something changed and they lowered the price to $26 and change.
Maybe I'm mixed up .... possible. But $20 per recent volume seemed pretty good. I picked up 12 with copyrights after 1996. Took some creative search-string creation to root out the oldies.
But the old Rev volume is actualy maybe 7 volumes ... commentary, Charles' translation, the greek, and the Oxy papyri that overlap. Logos wants $90 (if I remember) and $20 was an easy pick for a Charles.
Maybe I'm mixed up .... possible. But $20 per recent volume seemed pretty good.
I agree. I paid significantly more for the post-1975 volumes I obtained not that long ago.
How good is the two-volume commentary on John?
While you're waiting on the 1928 John edition (2-volume), for others, I'll comment on the more recent ICC John 1-4 edition. I wondered.
I'm always suspicious on commentaries on John/Rev. So, I figured for $20, take a chance. Well rewarded. Basically, it's a very deep-dive on the language in chap 1-4. The author spent years on it. The final was supposed to be 2 vols, but he died. And goodness, what a great volume. I'd class it as supplementing ones other more mainstream John commentaries.
Dale Allison commentary on James for $19.99? That's a good deal.
https://www.logos.com/product/49430/a-critical-and-exegetical-commentary-on-the-epistle-of-james
I'll comment on the more recent ICC John 1-4 edition. I wondered. I'm always suspicious on commentaries on John/Rev. So, I figured for $20, take a chance. Well rewarded. Basically, it's a very deep-dive on the language in chap 1-4. The author spent years on it. The final was supposed to be 2 vols, but he died. And goodness, what a great volume. I'd class it as supplementing ones other more mainstream John commentaries.
I'll comment on the more recent ICC John 1-4 edition. I wondered.
Denise, it seems you are talking about McHugh's John set? I don't see it offered @ $20. Or are you talking about Revelation?
I'll comment on the more recent ICC John 1-4 edition. I wondered. I'm always suspicious on commentaries on John/Rev. So, I figured for $20, take a chance. Well rewarded. Basically, it's a very deep-dive on the language in chap 1-4. The author spent years on it. The final was supposed to be 2 vols, but he died. And goodness, what a great volume. I'd class it as supplementing ones other more mainstream John commentaries. Denise, it seems you are talking about McHugh's John set? I don't see it offered @ $20. Or are you talking about Revelation?
Nevermind. I now see it, but initial searches ("icc john") (icc mchugh) etc did not bring up initial volume. Glad I could have this conversation with myself.
I'm going to pick up ten resources during this sale. All have been mentioned except the 2 vol Barrett work on Acts and the 2 vol work on 2Corinthians by Thrall. These are both relatively current offerings and I think merit consideration.
Monthly sales on various volumes may run less but I couldn't pass up R. H. Charles on Revelation. The I. Howard Marshall volume is also tempting me.
I have a few volumes myself when Logos sold them for less than $5, so to answer your question: No, for $19.99 these are not a good deal. Very old too, but still hold some value, but not for $19.99. The only reason I paid $17 and change for the pastoral epistles by Howard it’s because it’s a more recent volume. Also, I read somewhere that he doesn’t believe that Paul wrote 1, 2 Timothy and Titus; so I want to see what his arguments are for drawing that conclusion.
I picked up 12 with copyrights after 1996. Took some creative search-string creation to root out the oldies.
You're right! My mistake.
If you don't mind listing them in this thread (or a link to the customised search url), it would save others from having to duplicate your work.
I passed on the ICC sale. The Marshall volume is not part of the sale but came on sale separately. Other more recent volumes of the series are not included, only the oldies.
Sure? I picked up two on Isaiah by John Goldingay, which were published 2006 and 2014 (I own Marshall's book for a long time). By the way I don't remember ever having seen ICC for $2 or $3
I picked up 12 with copyrights after 1996. Took some creative search-string creation to root out the oldies. If you don't mind listing them in this thread (or a link to the customised search url), it would save others from having to duplicate your work.
As a workaround, the series page on bestcommentaries.com will give publication dates (and sometimes ranks); https://www.bestcommentaries.com/series/international-critical-commentary-icc/
By the way I don't remember ever having seen ICC for $2 or $3
In October 2015 several volumes were on sale for $1.99. But for the newer ICC volumes $19.99 is also a good deal.
I read somewhere that he doesn’t believe that Paul wrote 1, 2 Timothy and Titus; so I want to see what his arguments are for drawing that conclusion. DAL
I read somewhere that he doesn’t believe that Paul wrote 1, 2 Timothy and Titus; so I want to see what his arguments are for drawing that conclusion.
Were you able to confirm this belief? How or why does he believe this?
I read somewhere that he doesn’t believe that Paul wrote 1, 2 Timothy and Titus; so I want to see what his arguments are for drawing that conclusion. DAL Were you able to confirm this belief? How or why does he believe this?
He explores this in great detail - 45 pages - and concludes
Our hypothesis, then, is that the indications are that the PE belong to the period shortly after the death of Paul. They, especially 2 Tim, are based on authentic Pauline materials whose extent cannot now be traced precisely, and they may well have been produced in a group which included Timothy and Titus themselves. The stimulus came from the existence of the authentic letter behind 2 Tim, which was already beginning to face up to the problems of the opposition, and led to the composition of 1 Tim and Tit to deal more explicitly and fully with the problems caused by opposition and heresy in Ephesus and Crete. The letters were intended to give Pauline backing to Timothy and Titus and associated church leaders in their work of calling the congregations back from false teaching and practices. They are examples not of pseudonymity but of allonymity. Their composition was accordingly in no sense deceptive, in that it was known that these were fresh formulations of Pauline teaching to take account of the changing situation. Nevertheless, with the passage of time the origins of the letters were forgotten and they were assumed to be from Paul himself.
I. Howard Marshall and Philip H. Towner, A Critical and Exegetical Commentary on the Pastoral Epistles, International Critical Commentary (London; New York: T&T Clark International, 2004), 92.
I wonder how they rank their commentaries. Where do they get that final number
On a side note, could someone post a little piece of content from the Charles Revelation commentary? There are no samples to look at in logos
https://www.bestcommentaries.com/about/
Any recommendations on the ICC commentaries on Isaiah? Has anyone used them? Are they worth getting or not?
I can't figure out a good way to post a sample from this resource to give you a decent look at the content without creating a very long post - each chapter is huge! It will be well worth your investment at the current rate. Here’s all you get with your purchase:
Mattillo, you'd need to narrow down what you're interested in. Just as example:
- Discusses the overall perspective of the author's theology
- Lengthy discussion of exactly how Rev's grammar operates, differences, why shifts etc. Part of grammar by part. Very detailed.
- When discussing dates, on early leaders, discusses specifics ... Origen, Iraneaus, etc Most comms kind of summarize.
- Of course discussions of the genre (his expertise)
- Verse commentary is typically a verse group, then verse by verse, looking at grammatical choices, etc. This I like relative to my neural nets.
- Lengthy list of the manuscripts etc.
- Apparatus, greek text and translation
- As noted above, Logos includes the papyri etc.
Good point Denise. That was a vague request so my apologies. Could you post what he has to say on Revelation 12? If to large then verses 3-4 or 7-17
Beale includes a lot of parallels from OT, rabbinic sources, etc., in his NIGTC on Revelation. I am wondering whether Charles would not cover much of the same ground or what the advantage might be to have the ICC volume.
Ok, I reduced the font, so you may need to look at the jpg outside. I also included a discussion of jewish 'horns' from ch13 which is interesting. For info, Charles sees John expecting Rome to exterminate Christianity completely, requiring Jesus and the martyrs to start over.
Very interesting. I think this will make a great commentary to compare with Robert Thomas' Revelation. Thank you
I too would like some meaningful response to this question.
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