The Gospel Message in Genesis 5?

David P. Moore

Hi all,

It has recently come to my attention the 1996 essay by Chuck Missler that says that the English meaning of the Hebrew names in Genesis 5 spell out the Gospel message: http://www.khouse.org/articles/1996/44/. I have been aware of Missler through radio and TV programs, and heard his views on the end times, but was not aware of this article by him.

I immediately went to Logos to research this, as I always do when I have questions like this, and after looking at several dictionaries and lexicons, I can't seem to come to the same conclusions that he has. In fact, at one point he says that the lexicons and dictionaries don't go deep enought to get the true meaning of some of the names. So the fact that he is basically asking the reader to disregard standard dictionaries makes me wary. While I would love to agree with his conclusions in his essay, I'm not sure if this is proper exposition (I should say here I am an layman, so I'm not sure).

My question is, is anyone aware of any Logos resource that might can help me with name meanings? I already have aleady been using the Exhaustive Dictionary to Bible Names, among other basic dictionaries. just looking to dig deeper into this a little, so I can make up my own mind.

Ben

I'll leave the theology out of this.

 

From my perspective (5 years of a PhD program in Semitics at UChicago) this person does not grasp Hebrew very well. Names are particularly difficult to translate, and old names even more so.

In the first example, the root they want to translate as death simply can't be, for technical reasons. (I can elaborate if necessary.) As the ABD and other resources point out, it's probably a different root meaning "man", common to W. Semitic (like Hebrew), though it becomes quite rare.

I can't help you with the Logos resources, really. The Anchor Bible Dictionary often provides a brief scholarly analysis. The standard work on Hebrew names is still only in German (and not available in Logos.)

-Die israelitischen
Personennamen im Rahmen der gemeinsemitischen Namengebung - Martin Noth

Ron

FWIW, this discovery isn't original to Missler.  When researching it myself, I found a sermon/book (I'm not sure which) from 1968 by Ray Stedman that contained the translated genealogy as well: http://www.raystedman.org/old-testament/genesis/adams-book

Lester Busald

I listen to Missler a lot from his podcasts.  I had heard him talk on this a while ago.  I also used Logos to look up some of the words and found some to be what he said and some not.  For instance:

Enoch:  Missler says it means teaching or commencement.  I found it to mean to mean initiated or dedicated.

Seth:  Missler says it means appointed.  I found it to mean appointed.

Enosh:  Missler says it means mortal, frail, miserable.  I found it to mean man, In the psalms and book of job in most cases it suggests frailty, vulnerability and finitude of man in constrast to God.

Methuselah:  Missler says it means comes from two root words,  muth = death, and shalach = to bring or to send forth.  I found it to mean man of the dart.

Math:  מֹת,מֹת [math /math/] n m. From the same as 4970; TWOT 1263; GK 5493 and 5494; 22 occurrences; AV translates as "men" 14 times, "few" twice, "few + 4557" once, "friends" once, "number" once, "persons" once, "small" once, and "with" once. 1 male, man. 1a males, men. 1b few men (in prose). 1b1 less emphasis on sex. 1c men (poetic). 1c1 less emphasis on sex.


Shelach:

7973

שֶׁלַח, שְׁלָחִים
[shelach /sheh·lakh/] n m. From 7971; TWOT 2394a; GK 8939 and 8945; Eight occurrences; AV translates as "sword" three times, "weapon" twice, "dart" once, "plant" once, and "put them off". 1 weapon, missile, sprout. 1a missile, weapon. 1b sprout, shoot.
So from these I see he has some words that are correct and some that are not??? 
I do listen quite a bit to missler and like what he says.  I think the main point in all this is to check everyone out, to make sure they are speaking the truth about scripture.  If we don't agree or just don't know we as christians need to search the scriptures and I think Logos can help us do just that.



4962

George Somsel

David P. Moore said:

Hi all,

It has recently come to my attention the 1996 essay by Chuck Missler that says that the English meaning of the Hebrew names in Genesis 5 spell out the Gospel message: http://www.khouse.org/articles/1996/44/. I have been aware of Missler through radio and TV programs, and heard his views on the end times, but was not aware of this article by him.

I immediately went to Logos to research this, as I always do when I have questions like this, and after looking at several dictionaries and lexicons, I can't seem to come to the same conclusions that he has. In fact, at one point he says that the lexicons and dictionaries don't go deep enought to get the true meaning of some of the names. So the fact that he is basically asking the reader to disregard standard dictionaries makes me wary. While I would love to agree with his conclusions in his essay, I'm not sure if this is proper exposition (I should say here I am an layman, so I'm not sure).

My question is, is anyone aware of any Logos resource that might can help me with name meanings? I already have aleady been using the Exhaustive Dictionary to Bible Names, among other basic dictionaries. just looking to dig deeper into this a little, so I can make up my own mind.

You can take it pretty much as gospel that anyone making an attempt to find the gospel in its full-blown sense in the OT is a bit fruity.  Such an approach does a distinct disservice to the progress of revelation.  Many will pay lipservice to the concept of progress in revelation, but in the end it really doesn't amount to much progress but rather a plugging in of a few names and facts which are adumbrated in the person's view.  It amounts to a kind of Bible Code view which one supposedly can discipher if he has the key.

David P. Moore

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/151129#Comment_151129

Thanks, all. I think this goes to show that it pays to study the Bible so one can make up his or her mind about things like this. I'm going to conclude that the summation of the Genesis 5 essay is stretching it a bit.

Ken Shawver

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/151726#Comment_151726

David, I have found the same thing you have found out as well. The names didn't exactly line up. But one thing Chuck Missler does espouse is for you - as the individual - to not take his word for it but study it out and find out God's truth yourself. Be a Berean and search out the scriptures to find out what is said is true.

Acts 17:11 (KJV) - Paul Speaking of the Bereans...

These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

As with any man, you may not agree with what they say, but if it lines up with God's Word then you can take it to the bank. Logos is a great tool for helping you track down these types of comments made.

Happy hunting [:D].