I am in the same boat. My sales guy said he would send an email of the training and it is just basic Logos 10 training. I can't find anything on how to use the subscription features.
At this point, Pro and Max have the same *new* features. Max includes the full Logos 10 feature set and Pro does not. We have been told that there will be new features for Max that are not included in Pro at the time of the real launch but exactly what those are has not been announced during the early access period.
Hi Shawn, they mentioned if i subscribed for 2 years i get to keep the non-AI and cloud features. But, I did some search in my logos library, but i can't find any non-AI feature that is included in the subscription? I emailed and asked them as well.
For those who are trying the Logos Pro/Max 30 days trial, it seems odd that I am not told where to locate these new features? My logos library just updated. I see the smart search, and sermon features. But, the difference between each trial costs even more, yet I have no idea how to use or access any language features that they claim. In the event, perhaps I have missed out on a tutorial available, can someone point to me where are these features?
Not all of the new features that are going to be in the subscriptions are out yet, as this is still early access. The full release will be sometime in the fall, presumably in October, if they keep to the two-year release cycle.
Some of the other features are in the Sermon Editor/Builder, and I have been having fun with those.
Also, some of the listed features have changed on the subscription page, like how it used to say an AI-powered Bible Study builder, but now it doesn't. (when I find the screenshot I have of the before, I'll post it).
So, some of the features are available, and some are not. Right now, it's a waiting game until the full version is released.
Thanks for the input, Justin. I guess their Q and A does somewhat cover this. However, it seems odd that there's a fallback license for non-AI feature, but there is no where to be found? With this knowledge it seems hard to understand why anyone would subscribe to the Max, as the Max and Pro are almost exactly the same (Max has the translation feature) for quite a bit more every month.
I hope Logos can release or tell us what these non-AI feature will be (as I am interested in the Bible studying, language and study breath portion), if not it will hard for me to justify my continual Max subscription.
I hope Logos can release or tell us what these non-AI feature will be (as I am interested in the Bible studying, language and study breath portion)
A list will be available before Fall (per M Barnes, Logos).
Also, some of the listed features have changed on the subscription page, like how it used to say an AI-powered Bible Study builder, but now it doesn't.
Marketing language is notoriously unreliable. For example, Bible Study has "Dozens of datasets and tools to help you uncover fresh insights" for all the tiers. Original Languages is "Advanced" for Max and "Intermediate" for Pro.
We really need a definitive list of features and datasets for each tier.
But, I did some search in my logos library, but i can't find any non-AI feature that is included in the subscription?
Instant switching between light and dark mode. A true steal to keep for paying 2 years of subscription fees. [:#]
Anyway, there will be more, we've been told. At this point I'm almost convinced to subscribe, but will wait and observe for a bit of time first.
Including some of the perks from FL Connect would really improve the vale that the new subscription schemes offer (such as FL TV, cashback, free ebook).
Send a monthly check in a self-addressed stamped envelope (SASE) and eventually we will send you...something. Surprise!
But, I did some search in my logos library, but i can't find any non-AI feature that is included in the subscription? Instant switching between light and dark mode. A true steal to keep for paying 2 years of subscription fees.
Instant switching between light and dark mode. A true steal to keep for paying 2 years of subscription fees.
That is an Early Access feature, but don't forget that the subscriptions have L10 features that can be kept after 2 years.
Also, some of the listed features have changed on the subscription page, like how it used to say an AI-powered Bible Study builder, but now it doesn't. Marketing language is notoriously unreliable. For example, Bible Study has "Dozens of datasets and tools to help you uncover fresh insights" for all the tiers. Original Languages is "Advanced" for Max and "Intermediate" for Pro. We really need a definitive list of features and datasets for each tier.
I found that screenshot of what the list of coming features looked like before...
Before the fall..[:D]
That is marketing language. A list is what you see in the product page for a Feature set.
There are no "full versions" after L10, which will be "gone" by Sept 6th. If you are not a Logos 10 Bronze, Silver or Full Feature owner by that date you will miss out on a healthy subscription discount. We need a proper list of available features to aid decision making (particularly regarding features that can be kept after 2 years on subscription). But we will not know what features are planned and available between October 2024 and October 2026.
Purchase L10 now and the subscription discount could see you ahead (financially) of non-L!0 owners after as little as 2 years, and you will go further ahead after that. Just do the math with your L10 price and the discount subscription price.
You need to click the Plus sign on the bottom left where its says "Included Books". From there it's the usual grouped list like any base package library, which can be filtered to not include owned books:
As a consumer and owner of the Logos 10 Full Feature Upgrade who has zero interest in any of the A.I. features of the new Logos subscriptions as well as zero interest in any of the included books in the subscriptions, considering that these subscriptions are being offered now at discount prices for a limited time, and considering that I can't find any complete summarized information upfront about all of the non-A.I., non-book features in the subscriptions (features that you'll own after 2 years of subscribing that we're not being given information about right now), that's disturbing and concerning to me. When it came to the Logos upgrades every 2 years, you knew everything offered upfront, so you knew of everything you were paying for. So in light of all of this, for me to purchase a subscription means paying for what I don't know beforehand of everything I'll get and be able to keep after subscribing for 2 years, and it brings a risk of buyer's regret. To be offered a discount for the subscription right now for a limited time, and you don't know now of all that you'll get that you can keep after subscribing for 2 years? No way. I don't like this at all.
They're not upfront because it's a lame idea to begin with. At best, whoever runs Logos now is incompetent. You don't need services to run the type of AI for texts and searching these relatively small libraries. All new processors are capable of doing that level of AI client side. Even phones. Even Apple goes out of their way to make their customer experience "on the phone" as much as possible and hasn't joined this bandwagon of server centric processing fully.
At worst, whoever is leading this is a scumbag business major type, who cannibalizes every industry he enters. No different than any other scumbag in charge of secular tech companies. Software as a service is a scam. And he thinks Christians are soft hearted dupes who pull out their wallets when a supposed authority asks them to. Which is sadly correct in many cases.
They're not upfront because it's a lame idea to begin with. At best, whoever runs Logos now is incompetent. You don't need services to run the type of AI for texts and searching these relatively small libraries. All new processors are capable of doing that level of AI client side. Even phones. Even Apple goes out of their way to make their customer experience "on the phone" as much as possible and hasn't joined this bandwagon of server centric processing fully. At worst, whoever is leading this is a scumbag. No different than any other scumbag in charge of secular tech companies. And he thinks Christians are soft hearted dupes who pull out their wallets when a supposed authority asks them to. Which is sadly correct in many cases.
At worst, whoever is leading this is a scumbag. No different than any other scumbag in charge of secular tech companies. And he thinks Christians are soft hearted dupes who pull out their wallets when a supposed authority asks them to. Which is sadly correct in many cases.
Ken, while I can understand your frustration and completely understand your point, let’s keep it civil. Not everyone is as tech savvy as you or others may be. And, having it all aggregated into one place, into one piece of software, is kind of nice.
Remember Phil’s post about Forum Guidlines, “Please treat each other with the love, courtesy, respect, and kindness that you would if you were sitting in your living room together.”
Also, Ephesians 4:29, “Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.”
-Jon
They're not upfront because it's a lame idea to begin with. At best, whoever runs Logos now is incompetent. You don't need services to run the type of AI for texts and searching these relatively small libraries. All new processors are capable of doing that level of AI client side. Even phones. Even Apple goes out of their way to make their customer experience "on the phone" as much as possible and hasn't joined this bandwagon of server centric processing fully. At worst, whoever is leading this is a scumbag. No different than any other scumbag in charge of secular tech companies. And he thinks Christians are soft hearted dupes who pull out their wallets when a supposed authority asks them to. Which is sadly correct in many cases. ] Ken, while I can understand your frustration and completely understand your point, let’s keep it civil. Not everyone is as tech savvy as you or others may be. And, having it all aggregated into one place, into one piece of software, is kind of nice. Remember Phil’s post about Forum Guidlines, “Please treat each other with the love, courtesy, respect, and kindness that you would if you were sitting in your living room together.” Also, Ephesians 4:29, “Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.” -Jon
My conscience is clear. There's no corrupting talk from me. I'm calling out a scam - or at best, it is incompetence. Since Faithlife relies on .NET, maybe they're too tied to the hip to Microsoft.
In any case, money is the root of all kinds of evil. Software subscriptions are a clear example. And I pray that it does give any readers some grace: the grace of a warning to avoid this. I'd feel worse if I didn't give the advice. This decision didn't come from God or any good place and it didn't come from prayer.
That means Premium would come out to around twelve dollars a month.
I'm still working on setting aside ten dollars for this one book on Elijah...
Language has to be relied upon to aid in successful marketing, so it must be shaped to suit the will of the marketer.
Could you please open that up? I'd kind of like to start cherry-picking now.
It's an idiocy, dude. Not to mention we could do a good deal of the searching ourselves.
Logos doesn't seem to care that we can't all hedge our bits and assume that we're going to be around for 2 years to see this course of I can pay off in the way they claim it's supposed to. Anywho, it occurs to me that if this feature set is subject to constant updating, we could be talking about a revolving door library. They're not setting up for a commitment on either party's part, which seems to violate the concept of a business-consumer relationship. What would it take for Logos to reverse course on this?
Maybe part of the idea is that, from their perspective, the subscription model provides a basis for the company to quickly switch gears, and thus not be bound to a commitment to a vision of actual quality.
It's just that I noticed that the legacy libraries are never the same twice.
Has there been any statement as to whether or not there will be dynamic pricing on the subscriptions?
I think there has been, but I was unable to find the post, as there have been literally thousands of posts about the new subscriptions. I doubt there will be dynamic pricing on the subscriptions beyond the discounts for those who own the full feature set versus those who don't. I don't pretend to know all that goes into how they would figure that out, but it seems like it would be too complex for a subscription base. I'll keep on looking for the post that I think (and hope) exists.
-Jonathan
Has there been any statement as to whether or not there will be dynamic pricing on the subscriptions? I think there has been, but I was unable to find the post, as there have been literally thousands of posts about the new subscriptions. I doubt there will be dynamic pricing on the subscriptions beyond the discounts for those who own the full feature set versus those who don't. I don't pretend to know all that goes into how they would figure that out, but it seems like it would be too complex for a subscription base. I'll keep on looking for the post that I think (and hope) exists. -Jonathan
And as usual, I found the post minutes after I posted this. Here's the URL to where it is... https://community.logos.com/forums/p/223375/1301847.aspx#1301847
and here is the post:
Disclaimer: I have not seen the exact list of licenses included in the various tiers. However, I hope I can give you some clarity on your question. We are thinking about subscription tiers as access to the software features and platform (very similar to "feature sets" of the past). Meanwhile, the plan is for libraries to remain purchased and licensed the same as today (transactional, permanent licensees). Because features are powered by some books/datasets, there may be a small number included in the subscription merely to power the features. There is no dynamic pricing on those, however they are not significant contributors to the subscription price so it's a bit moot. If there sufficient customer interest, we may offer subscriptions to libraries in the future but that isn't a focus right now. I hope that helps.
Disclaimer: I have not seen the exact list of licenses included in the various tiers. However, I hope I can give you some clarity on your question.
We are thinking about subscription tiers as access to the software features and platform (very similar to "feature sets" of the past).
Meanwhile, the plan is for libraries to remain purchased and licensed the same as today (transactional, permanent licensees).
Because features are powered by some books/datasets, there may be a small number included in the subscription merely to power the features. There is no dynamic pricing on those, however they are not significant contributors to the subscription price so it's a bit moot.
If there sufficient customer interest, we may offer subscriptions to libraries in the future but that isn't a focus right now.
I hope that helps.
Hmm... So there's a discount for people who own the full Logos product and feature set, but not prorating for people who own some of the books and some of the features?
The potential for redundancy needs to be addressed, and not to overstate the matter, but it seems as though, if this were about meeting the needs of individual users, there would be algorithms in place to help make sure customers don't pay for the same things twice.
People who own a bronze feature set will get a discount on the cheapest subscription, people who own a silver feature set will get a discount on Logos pro, and people who own the full feature set will get a discount on Logos Max. People who do not own a Logos 10 feature set will not get a discount but could buy one dynamically priced during this sale.
Mark has said the reason they are not doing traditional dynamic pricing is that books might be added or taken away from subscriptions and subscribers do not generally want their price to fluctuate from month to month. As new features are added, if Logos continues to calculate dynamic pricing the way they have in the past (percentage of features owned) your cost would gradually increase.
The thing is, that's a very high bar to clear, particularly as this is supposed to be in the service of the consumer, and as I've said, it's not exactly like Logos has gone out of its way to make sure everybody knew about this since they announced it.
The other thing is that we don't know what the full price of each of these subscriptions is going to be, and we apparently won't know until after the opportunity to buy the features we want up front and outright is taken off the table.
I figured they might rotate the books.
👀 They wouldn't even offer a discount to those with Starter.
If there isn't going to be a more reasonable measure taken as to the cost of the subscriptions and what they offer going forward, it would behoove who those of us who don't have full feature packages and can't afford them at this point to make a point of buying access to as many of the features we want as possible while we have the chance and in light of what we do know, especially as the standing regular price of the subscriptions is not yet known to us and won't be until it's too late.
What you're saying is quite true, on the smaller packages. But I would opine that 'features' are kind of like options on cars ... one really doesn't need most. Better to see which are actually needed, and then decide. The nice thing about subscriptions, is they easily cancel. Maybe you need a feature for a couple months. Maybe not. Having used Logos for 15 years, there's almost no difference in my use, between L7 and L10 (I use both). I do have the later features, but little value.
