Thoughts on the cost of a subscription
I don't mind the announced subscription structure.
First, Faithlife has long provided services that cost them at least something, for free. All my highlights and comments replicate across my devices that have Logos installed, so it seems they are all stored on a server somewhere. Second, I get a continuing series of updates and fixes on what is a pretty sophisticated piece of software.
I get that I've spent a bunch on books and other resources, but that's for access to those works, which I have in perpetuity. Server-based services other than AI aren't talked about much, but they are tucked in with what we all get from Logos.
I realize prices can change in the future, but, for now, my Premium subscription - at $69.99 per year - is a bargain compared to Netflix at $22.99 per month for a premium subscription (but I have dropped Netflix), or ancestry.com at $39.99 per month for a world explorer subscription (but I have dropped to a "hold" fee of $5 per month), or the digital New York Times at $20 per month, or practically any other subscription service.
Of course if I used Logos less, I would have to weigh $5.84 per month for the annual fee more carefully, but I'm in it hours every day, so it's pretty much the best value subscription I have to anything. I give the New York Times second place - crucial as a source of news, but so much more expensive than Logos.
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Your thinking is well taken. I checked my subscriptions. Most are annual at maybe $7-10 per year (mostly weather). Then, like you, newpaper subscription. And with my new Apple watch, $7/mo to report baro-pressure (weather; hiking in canyons).
So, subscriptions are fine. I guess I haven't seen anything Logos is offering worth subscribing (I have FF). I'm thinking, each month my not-subscribing earns me $13 to buy more Logos books! Works too!
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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My issue when people try to compare subscription services with Logos is that the comparisons can be a little slanted. Logos is not in the "genre" of Microsoft Office, Netflix, or Newspaper subscriptions.... (Yet - if they start offering full subscription options to resources a closer link could be made)
Logos while really in its own "genre" would be closest linked to Amazon Kindle, Play Books, etc... While Amazon does offer subscription options for books (including magazines, newspapers, comics and audio), I have NEVER had to pay a subscription for the "engine" to read them or for any new feature or improvement made to the "engine" - same for Play Books - I buy my resources and am able to read them. Again never paying for a new feature...
Now... Logos does implement a different level of feature in comparison but the reality is other ebook options would be the most comparable "genre" outside of the remaining Bible software options.
Also comparing the lowest Logos package to the highest Netflix package in cost is misleading for cost comparison - Netflix had a plan for $6.99 and honestly with some bundles out there it goes down to $5 per month.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Welll... Don't mean any offense with this.... but ... I didn't compare Logos with other subscriptions because I don't have a "bible genre" subscription to compare to. I did drop Netflix over their "woke and LGBT" (or whatever that's called) selection of movies and their stand on those kinds of movies. Just not for me.
As to Logos subscription. I think it would be fair to compare the "annual or bi-annual charges" to upgrade Logos to "one of the subscription tiers" Logos offers. I looked at it, estimated what it might cost me to upgrade this fall and, in my opinion, I thought the subscription came out cheaper. So, I subscribed to a tier that I thought was appropriate for me.
To me, since I don't know have any "bible programs subscriptions" this is a fair way to evaluate the Logos subscription. I don't think it's fair to compare the subscription of one genre of software to another genre of software. One could be a "need" and the other be a "want"...
For me, I "need" a good bible program. I don't "need" Netflix.
xn = Christan man=man -- Acts 11:26 "....and the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch".
Barney Fife is my hero! He only uses an abacus with 14 rows!
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xnman said:
As to Logos subscription. I think it would be fair to compare the "annual or bi-annual charges" to upgrade Logos to "one of the subscription tiers" Logos offers. I looked at it, estimated what it might cost me to upgrade this fall and, in my opinion, I thought the subscription came out cheaper.
One issue that make above comparison not an apples-to-apples comparison: After 2 years, you are never going to own non-AI/cloud features. Previously, you owned all features you bought every 2 years. So it better be cheaper with subscription model.
I believe in a Win-Win-Win God.
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xnman said:
For me, I "need" a good bible program. I don't "need" Netflix.
I support this type of thinking. Prioritizing my needs helps me deal with 'subscription fatigue'. My must-have 'subscriptions' are water, electricity, and telecomms; everything else (no matter how much I like it or think I need it) is fair game for cancellation. I recently cancelled two subscriptions and I have another coming up for yearly renewal that I'm thinking of cancelling as well. I will be equally ruthless with my Logos subscription if circumstances warrant. At the end of the day, I don't need a Logos subscription to study the Bible. Phew, fatigue dealt with 😌
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BibleGateway Plus is $50 a year for reverse interlinear, study Bibles, and a few abridged commentaries. It still has "limited" ads.
ESV offers a similar subscription for $40/yr - a few study Bibles and commentaries and a very basic reverse interlinear.
Olivetree is $60/yr but ads a couple of reference works.
BibleArc Tools is $100 a year for sentence diagramming and one study Bible.
For all the tools you get, I think a Logos subscription is very competitive with other similar tools
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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Justin Gatlin said:
For all the tools you get, I think a Logos subscription is very competitive with other similar tools
Except, I have Olivetree and works great ... no subscription. In my mind, subscription is fine, if you need it. I doubt most Logosians do. But the Logos marketing will soon imply otherwise,
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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In my opinion they held back a lot feature until the subscription was out. A rogue who thinks evil of it[;)]
Χριστὸς ἐν ὑμῖν, ἡ ἐλπὶς τῆς δόξης·
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I've been on subscription via Logos Now/Connect for several years. Cost wise, it has been no worse than a wash. I can't see it being a bad deal, at least for those who keep up-to-date on feature releases. For those who almost never upgrade, maybe not as much. Or those who don't need features (mainly just read books). And for them, the featureless engine might still be okay.
But feature upgrades are what keep pouring money into the company for continued updates. I want a healthy Logos, (financially and feature wise) and think subscriptions to features is a faith way to go in the future.
It is important for those who are okay with subscription to say so.
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Fabian said:
In my opinion they held back a lot feature until the subscription was out. A rogue who thinks evil of it
Or they spent a lot of time cleaning up bugs before they started building new features again. A rogue who thinks the best of it. [;)]
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:Fabian said:
In my opinion they held back a lot feature until the subscription was out. A rogue who thinks evil of it
Or they spent a lot of time cleaning up bugs before they started building new features again. A rogue who thinks the best of it.
If I check the release notes, I don't see evidence for your position. Also I have still issues I have reported long ago.
Χριστὸς ἐν ὑμῖν, ἡ ἐλπὶς τῆς δόξης·
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I think we all do. Some of them I don't expect to see fixed until the underlying technology is replaced. Some I don't understand why they haven't been fixed but assume if I were privy to the code, I would understand.Fabian said:Also I have still issues I have reported long ago.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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I just cancelled my subscription
Can I still subscribe for 9.99 in about 2 months time or is it gone then
I have the FFS an was subscribed for 12.99 for max
Will them prices be available after the 30th of September
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MJ. Smith said:Fabian said:
In my opinion they held back a lot feature until the subscription was out. A rogue who thinks evil of it
Or they spent a lot of time cleaning up bugs before they started building new features again. A rogue who thinks the best of it.
Also, to be fair to Logos - traditionally we wouldn't have "early access" to new features outside of an invite to the Private Beta. Entering the new "era" of AI enabled features likely absorbed a lot of programming time/effort as well.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
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Danny Parker said:
But feature upgrades are what keep pouring money into the company for continued updates. I want a healthy Logos, (financially and feature wise) and think subscriptions to features is a faith way to go in the future.
It is important for those who are okay with subscription to say so.
Rumor has it they sell books. Maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but for years too. Smiling.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Fabian said:
If I check the release notes, I don't see evidence for your position. Also I have still issues I have reported long ago.
I very much doubt they have the luxury of fixing many of the old bugs ... except when they do a major feature update periodically .... and charge for it. Back with Now, they tried to produce results ... not easy.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Where can I read which specific Features will be available at each subscription tier?
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Matthew m said:
Where can I read which specific Features will be available at each subscription tier?
Hi Matthew, welcome to the forum! As a culture here, we generally create new threads for new topics. But here is the list:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IOXGusuGt5_78fmO3q-GZtXOQrZgT6ampdaWkbBtS-k/pubhtml
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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Assuming I am correct that nothing I currently have will be broken once the transition is made, I think I will be sticking with what I have. The only things I might want to invest two years over to get the Legacy license in the end aren't included in that.
WIN 11 i7 9750H, RTX 2060, 16GB RAM, 1TB SSD | iPad Air 3
Verbum Max0 -
I don’t mind the subscription plan myself… but I do have two subscription questions. (Note: I’m sure these have been answered but all the info I’ve taken in overwhelms this ole brain of mine.)
- Other than saving $20 over time, is there any other benefit to paying for a 1-year subscription?
- Recognizing that the Legacy Fallback clock won’t start ticking till end of October, is there any advantage to purchasing the 1-year subscription now vs then? (I already have the monthly Pro subscription.)
Thanks.
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Ralph Wood said:
Other than saving $20 over time, is there any other benefit to paying for a 1-year subscription?
Probably not, other than only making a single debit rather than 12. [:P]
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Ralph Wood said:
I don’t mind the subscription plan myself… but I do have two subscription questions. (Note: I’m sure these have been answered but all the info I’ve taken in overwhelms this ole brain of mine.)
- Other than saving $20 over time, is there any other benefit to paying for a 1-year subscription?
- Recognizing that the Legacy Fallback clock won’t start ticking till end of October, is there any advantage to purchasing the 1-year subscription now vs then? (I already have the monthly Pro subscription.)
Thanks.
No to both. Other than the two months free, there is no difference in the annual and monthly subscription, with regard to the LFL or anything else.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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What Logos is actually doing is making it so we can no longer buy the specific features we need without paying for a subscription. I don't need every feature they have. But now with their subscription basis, I have to pay for every feature... including sketchy ai features, just to get the sermon builder tool I need.
Beyond that, subscriptions tend to kill quality. If you look at all these major companies who offer subscriptions: Spotify, Netflix, Disney+, and so on; their quality has gone down because they are sitting nicely on perpetual income. Logos looks like it's headed down the same path. Quality will get worse because they no longer have to convince us to buy their new features. Their new features could be trash, but if we want any features, we have to keep the subscription rolling. I am quite sad Logos has gone this direction.
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Daniel Borman said:
I have to pay for every feature... including sketchy ai features, just to get the sermon builder tool I need.
With the Logos 10 Full Feature Set, you will have perpetual access to the sermon editor and manager, even without a subscription. And I think (?) that you could hop over to Verbum and get the FFS there, at least for a few more days. You won't have the AI-powered sermon tools, but you can still create, edit, and manage your sermons - which I find to be one of the most indispensible features of Logos.
Let us know how it goes!
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