more flexibility in theology topics

Larry Craig · 2024-12-30T16:30:58+00:00

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this is my second post on this. I haven't used the theology guide much, but the last two times have been a major disappointment.

the first time I tried to study the parousia using the guide. But the guide took one of the views of the parousia that I was trying to see if that was the right view.

This time I wanted to study salvation: what the theology books would say is the plan of salvation, what exactly a person must do to pass from death unto life.

I type in 'salvation,' but it limits the search to four predetermined paths, none of which answers my question.

I'm sure there is a workaround, but there shouldn't need to be workarounds, when it should just do what it should do better.

thank you

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Jonathan Bradley

In the Theology Guide, when you say it "limits the search to four predetermined paths," I assume those are the results that begin to auto-fill in the search box when you type in Salvation. The Theology Guide in Logos primarily basis its information from their in-house "Lexham Survey of Theology," so a lot of it is limited by term. If you open the Lexham Survey of Theology, it brings up a lot more information.

When I search the auto-fill of "The Holy Spirit and Salvation" and then click on the hyperlink at the top for "Lexham Survey of Theology," I get a lot more information, including information on how Augustine sees it, and how the catholic, reformed, and dispensational traditions see it.

Personally, I like using the Factbook for searches like this because it will often grab its information from more than just the one source, and still bringing up a lot of the same options as the Theology Guide.

Also, if you're a subscriber and have the smart search option, you can type in the question "What must a person do exactly to pass from death unto life" (without quotations) and get a decent response, both from the AI-generated summary and other books and resources. The only downside is that it often gives a lot of resources that one doesn't own, so you can't see them in full. (And remember, always check AI responses, be it on Logos or ChatGPT or something else, sometimes they are way off, lol).

I hope this helps some.

Larry Craig

thank you

I did find help doing a book search using AI and asking a question.

But this is the theology guide. this is Logos' theology guide.

I think it needs work, and this is one area it can improve.

Oh, I did click on the Lexham Survey, when I could find it, and it had nothing.

thanks again

MJ. Smith

@ Larry Craig

the first time I tried to study the parousia using the guide. But the guide took one of the views of the parousia that I was trying to see if that was the right view.

I am usually the one knocking the theological guide so it feels odd to be "defending it" but it is important to know what it is doing because it does do what it is intended to do - identify the systematic theology sources for a topic in your library.

First, comes the manual: Thompson, Jeremy. Lexham Systematic Theology Ontology: Dataset Documentation. Bellingham, WA: Faithlife, 2019. which provides the buckets into which Logos classifies systematic theology. Here one must simply accept the terms and categories that Logos uses as those are the only bucket names Logos recognizes.
Second, comes the LST: Ward, Mark, Jessica Parks, Brannon Ellis, and Todd Hains, eds. Lexham Survey of Theology. Bellingham, WA: Lexham Press, 2018. This created a bit of pushback when it was first released as it is not a neutral, accurate, or comprehensive as many hoped. However, when one's terminology is far from the Logos terminology, this is often where one must go to find the Lexham-speak. This is the source of recommended reading and topic sections of the guide.
Third, comes the tagging of the systematic theology resources in your library to fill the buckets. If only one view is presented, that is the result of your library not a fault in the process.
Fourth, comes the cross-references Brannan, Rick, and Peter Venable. Systematic Theology Cross-References: Dataset Documentation. Bellingham, WA: Faithlife, 2015. Here, I have never used this as my primary source of information rather than using standard Catholic references so I don't know the quality of the data.

Think of point 3 - the tagging of the systematic theology books to find the like topic across time and denomination as the core of the function. How well it works is completely dependent on your library. Think of points 2 and 4 as reflecting the normal Logos bias with the usual blind spots.

Larry Craig

thank you, MJ

You go above and beyond, as always.

I did find what I wanted quickly doing a book search of my theology books. It seems there really isn't much that deals with my question. Surprisingly.

I have 30K+ resources in my library. If Logos can't find what I'm looking for in my library, then I think it's just not trying hard enough. Or it needs to be tweaked. Which is my assessment.

I want to do more work with my systematics, so I look forward to using the guide a lot. But, like I said, my two enquiries turned up empty. That's not a good sign.

thanks again

NichtnurBibelleser

Checking on my german Verbum, "Parousie" search in the Assistant yielded results from the resources mentioned by @MJ. Smith:

Screenshot (7).png

But opening the Systematic Theology Cross-References: Dataset Documentation rendered me a bit unhappy:

Under "Modern Catholic" resources "Ott, Ludwig, Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma" is listed but actually unavailable in Logos:

Screenshot (8).png

Instead, the more recent Dogmatic by Müller is missing here. It would be great if these two works could be integrated.

Larry Craig

I don't understand.

you opened the Assistant? What is that?

I want to study the Parousia. Most Christians say that it is the Second Coming. But the NT seems to show this as a first century event.

When I used the theology guide, it automatically searched for the second coming. I think it should pull resources specific to the parousia.

NichtnurBibelleser

@Larry Craig : You initially referred to the "theology guide". This should correspond to "Dogmatik-Assistent" in my german Verbum, which I wrongly translated as "Assistant".

NB.Mick

@NichtnurBibelleser your screenshot is a bit tricky since the guides you are showing ("Assistenten" in German UI) are not part of Werkzeuge/Tools, but of Assistenten-Studienhilfen/Guides which clearly is selected in your Logos menu bar.

NichtnurBibelleser

Sorry, I'm a bit rushing today.

Set to english it says "Theology Guide" as in the OP:

Larry Craig

yes, thank you. But your guide searched for the second coming. I want to search for the parousia. Maybe that isn't the second coming.

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1351324#Comment_1351324

Hm. I just simply googled it. The first hit (possibly bought) comes from Merriam Webster:

noun. par·ou·sia ˌpär-ü-ˈsē-ə pə-ˈrü-zē-ə variants or Parousia. in Christian theology. : the time when Jesus Christ will return to judge humanity at the end of the world : second coming.

NichtnurBibelleser

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1351324#Comment_1351324

Maybe you find a Word Study helpful (I opened an english resource in the right column):

Larry Craig

I don't see any way here to respond to a particular person. Am I missing something here?

Yes, I see that article in Kittel. thank you. that is a good article.

unfortunately you didn't find that through the theology guide, which was the point of my original post

NichtnurBibelleser

unfortunately you didn't find that through the theology guide, which was the point of my original post

Now I get it. Takeaway for me: Concerning expressions which appear (also) in the bible: Do a Word Study or consult Biblical Dictionaries before consulting the Theology Guide.

Larry Craig

yes, I am seeing that, but Logos has a theology guide. I want them to make it better.