LOGOS 4 - attractive but feels cumbersome

I am a recent purchaser of LOGOS 3 and when the upgrade came out I was excited Smile I could only imagine how much more I would be able to do. Sadly, that has not been my experience Crying . I have a difficult time trying find anything. None of the books I have read have their highlights in them any longer, nor the underlining I so meticulously did. The workspaces I had in the previous version are lost. And that's just the when it comes to some of my study lists.

As a pastor I became very excited about the ability to use the software to track not only prayer requests, but answers to prayer that have (in the two weeks I've had LOGOS 3) become a reason for celebration in our small group and youth group, as well as in our congregation. They're gone. The prayer section is TOTALLY left out of LOGOS 4.

In two days I did my research and study for a sermon in LOGOS 3, I'm still having trouble even finding my way around LOGOS 4 after 4 days.

Sigh. I know this is still a work in progress, but this feels like it was released much too early and with a major shift in the way it is formatted. I'm struggling. I'll keep plugging away, .... because I have to.

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Mark Smith

If it is any comfort, most (all?) of us in the beta program went through what you are experiencing: a period of feeling a bit lost and also somewhat frustrated over what was missing.

At least you have version 3 to fall back on while you play with 4.0 in any extra time you have.

It is true that 4.0 is incomplete. I can't defend Logos' decision to release it this way, but that's what they did and you are not alone in feeling a bit disillusioned with 4.0.

I'd say that 4.0 will ultimately be close to what 3.0 was in most areas and much better in some. I am hopeful for it. However it is not all that we hope it to be right now.

There is a listing of the items Logos 4 will one day include on the Logos web site. It's pretty extensive.

Workspaces are gone. Layouts are in. Every workspace we had will have to be redone for 4.0. I don't like that collections cannot be imported. Eventually (hopefully soon) notes and highlighting will be able to be imported. 4.0 is here but right now it probably doesn't feel like an upgrade to you. It doesn't to me and I've been working with it for about 2 months.

Don't give up, but if frustrated use 3.0 and wait for some of the features you want in 4.0 to be added. 3.0 is the best Bible study software available for a PC. I'm sure Logos wants 4.0 to maintain that reputation. You haven't made a bad choice, but like many of us need extra patience.

Jacob Hantla

I am a recent purchaser of LOGOS 3 and when the upgrade came out I was excited I could only imagine how much more I would be able to do. Sadly, that has not been my experience . I have a difficult time trying find anything. None of the books I have read have their highlights in them any longer, nor the underlining I so meticulously did. The workspaces I had in the previous version are lost. And that's just the when it comes to some of my study lists.

As a pastor I became very excited about the ability to use the software to track not only prayer requests, but answers to prayer that have (in the two weeks I've had LOGOS 3) become a reason for celebration in our small group and youth group, as well as in our congregation. They're gone. The prayer section is TOTALLY left out of LOGOS 4.

In two days I did my research and study for a sermon in LOGOS 3, I'm still having trouble even finding my way around LOGOS 4 after 4 days.

Sigh. I know this is still a work in progress, but this feels like it was released much too early and with a major shift in the way it is formatted. I'm struggling. I'll keep plugging away, .... because I have to.

Notes will be imported very soon.

Workspaces are easier to make now and wouldn't really be importable since the reports are all different.

I too am very disappointed about the prayer functionality being delayed (it'll be out early next year).

As for not knowing your way around, it took me about a week to feel comfortable and a month to feel totally proficient. Now I can't imagine going back. I didn't have the benefit of the videos though. I have gone to http://www.logos.com/videos and have found that page would have been extremely helpful to understand the basic workflow of the app. I would encourage you to go there.

Also, if there is a specific task that you are trying to accomplish, just ask here on the forums and I'm sure you'll be helped through it in no time.

I was worried that Logos4 was a step backward for the first week or so I used it. I'm now using Logos4 100% of the time.

Floyd Johnson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/29240#Comment_29240

If it is any comfort, most (all?) of us in the beta program went through what you are experiencing: a period of feeling a bit lost and also somewhat frustrated over what was missing.

I would have thought that the purpose of a Beta Test would be to get the program to a point where it would no longer be frustrating to new users. Though I do believe that LOGOS is among the best Bible programs, I think they tend to want to lead us rather than listening to us. I have read several posts over the past two or three days where Beta Testers have said they asked for features or for changes, but were told by Bob that they would not be happening. I have seen some where they are being promised in the future. I also have read that much of what the Beta Testers asked for has been implemented on the current version of the program.

Frustrated - yep. From what I read, so have been many of the Beta Testers. But there is hope - updates have promised. Logos has a good reputation. So be frustrated, but also be patient. Change is coming.

Blessings,

Floyd

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/29285#Comment_29285

I would have thought that the purpose of a Beta Test would be to get the program to a point where it would no longer be frustrating to new users.

Floyd, You're correct. But there was a problem. The release date was set eons ago, and was pretty much set in stone. Now then I can assure you that during the 2 months, the logos coders must surely have worn letters off their keyboards - the product released is way better than beta1. And it's largely stable, and is certainly as stable as any newly released software I've used, from OS' to wordprocessors. That said, we've already had four service updates, and the coders show no signs of stopping.

I think they tend to want to lead us rather than listening to us. I have read several posts over the past two or three days where Beta Testers have said they asked for features or for changes, but were told by Bob that they would not be happening.

There were also several issues where Bob responded with more or less of a, "since you all seem to want that feature, here you go." So they did listen, we didn't all get our way - (cough, handouts, /cough) But I am positive they listened carefully, and they still are.

Juanita

In two days I did my research and study for a sermon in LOGOS 3, I'm still having trouble even finding my way around LOGOS 4 after 4 days.

Sigh. I know this is still a work in progress, but this feels like it was released much too early and with a major shift in the way it is formatted. I'm struggling. I'll keep plugging away, .... because I have to.

John, when I first opened L4, I got the sinking feeling in the bottom of my stomach like I had lost my Mom in a store when I was four. That went on for several weeks. I had just finished Camp Logos II about six months ago and felt really good at using L3 just to have L4 come along and be so totally different. I want to encourage everybody here who is having a bad experience with L4 so far, I believe it will get better in time and it really has gotten much better in the past week. Who helped me? The Holy Spirit. And I really believe Bob has great vision and is oriented towards the future in a way I could not be. I am growing to love L4; the videos and Help file have been necessary and even fun.[:)] God Bless

Michael Hite

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/29814#Comment_29814

I agree with Thomas on much of this. I was a Beta Tester too and we all need to realize that just because we want a feature, it doesn't mean that it is immediately doable. Are there items missing that we need? Certainly - and if we keep communicating that I am confident they will be added if possible.

I also want to echo the idea that first experiences with the software are confusing. I am finding that if you were a dedicated user of Logos 3, Logos 4 is a struggle at first. There is a mindset shift that must occur in how you approach the new version. It doesn't do much of anything the way the old version did and that causes frustration - no doubt! I must say that I didn't like it at all when I first started with it in Beta. John's comment that he was having a difficult time finding "anything" is a familiar feeling for me. After working with it for awhile now though I must say there are a number of things that I like much better about Logos 4 than L3. It has made many things much easier and more accessible. Is it perfect - no way! Will it get better - absolutely!

Hang in there John - check out the new training videos - they are a BIG help. More features will come. I know it is a drag to be without them now.

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/29240#Comment_29240

Hi Mark,

You're spot on, & thanks for saying what I've been thinking... I'd like to comment on (not criticize) one point you made:

Workspaces are gone. Layouts are in. Every workspace we had will have to be redone for 4.0.

I've done that for my workspaces. Yet, after unchecking the "Load Home Page at Startup" box, I'm finding that I pretty much don't use my workspace any more. Logos brings it up in the configuration I last left it. I'm finding that that's what I really wanted to accomplish when I defined my workspace to begin with! Only now, I don't even have to remember to save it. It's already saved...

My biggest problem is having to relearn how to work in this wonderful software Logos has given us. But life on the L4 side of it is going to be ALL good & is already pretty good. And it keeps getting better.

Blessings!

Bill

John A. Murphy, Jr.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/29866#Comment_29866

Okay, I need to take away some of my frustrated rant from earlier. I have turned off the home page at startup and that feels much more comfortable. Rather than having all this various (and seemingly random) information thrown at me as the program opens, I now see Home, Library, and Search Buttons, and then File, Guides, Tools and Shortcuts tabs. Much less intimidating and much easier to get around. I'm enjoying LOGOS again.

In my defense, I'm presbyterian. And you know what the presbyterian said about changing a lightbulb. "Change that lightbulb? My grandmother put in that lightbulb." LOL Have a great day everyone.

Blessings to you all.

Randall Hartman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30167#Comment_30167

I once bought a pair of $300 shoes. Man, at first I really regretted it! That money could have went so many other places. Besides, I already had shoes that were OK. And, at first, they hurt my feet so bad I almost limped. But, yep. Now they are my very favorite pair of shoes. The only way anyone can have those shoes is when they pry them off my cold dead feet!

J. Morris

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30170#Comment_30170

In my defense, I'm presbyterian. And you know what the presbyterian said about changing a lightbulb. "Change that lightbulb? My grandmother put in that lightbulb." LOL Have a great day everyone.

Blessings to you all.

LOL! Take it from a rural SE Kansas Independent Baptist pastor... I know what your feeling.... [;)]

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30167#Comment_30167

I'm finding that that's what I really wanted to accomplish when I defined my workspace to begin with!

Right now that's what I'm doing, too. But I didn't like much of the 3.0 Passage guide so I started creating a workspace for each new major Bible study project I had that had the resources open that I was most likely to use. I then opened my Psalms workspace or my Ephesians workspace and got to work.

Eventually I will probably do this in 4.0. I've just done a couple so far. No rush to get the others done right now. Besides with some of the new features and ways to do things in 4.0 I'm not sure everything I want in a workspace layout yet.

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30262#Comment_30262

Hi Mark,

I didn't much like the defaults on the PG, either... so I created MY PG... and I've included all the stuff I really use from PG, EG, & BWS. I like My PG well enough that I floated it & have included it as part of my default layout. For basic research, when they fix all the issues with touchpads, I'll be MORE productive than I was in L3...

I take your point on a workspace for each Bible study. When I start using L4 for Bible studies, I'll do the same--just as I did for L3. They're just too different from sermon prep & will drive me back to layouts. 2 things are taking the edge off, though. I'm in a new pastorate as of 10/15, & so my new office / church doesn't have:
a) high speed internet; and
b) a portable projector.

Without those, I'm not using Logos during the Bible study, only beforehand to print a few research notes for the week's chapter.

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30498#Comment_30498

I'm in a new pastorate as of 10/15

Best wishes in the new church.

my new office / church doesn't have:
a) high speed internet; and
b) a portable projector.

Well I hope you'll be able to have both very quickly.

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/30584#Comment_30584

Thanks, Mark!

Blessings to you...