Reading plans temporarily disabled
Comments
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My apologies for venting my frustration in an unhelpful and arrogant way.
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Garrett Mercury said:
One thing can be said for sure. the fact that the reading plans are still disabled stretches the meaning of the original posts phrase "for the next few days." Logos has created an expectation that needs to be better managed. Updates regarding this issue would be appropriate.
Garrett -
Have to say I'm in agreement. I don't actually use the desktop software (yet, anwyay). I just found out about the Ipad app around 3 weeks ago. It seemed like it fit my needs better than any other app. I could save my notes and have my reading plan at my disposal. Would work out perfectly for the upcoming business trip I had. I had the ESV study Bible in hard copy, but this would keep me from having to lug it around on my trip.
Wouldn't you know, the day before the trip the reading plans stopped working. While I know that the syncing of reading plans may be a frivolous thing to complain about for some, but for me, it was about 50% of the reason I plunked down the $50 bucks to re-purchase an electronic version of the study Bible I'd been using. I'm continuing to use it, and appreciate the fact that the app itself is free.
I have to say that if this were any other service, I've got a feeling we'd all be in an uproar. For example, I know with most cell phone plans we get voice mail and text messaging for free. Imagine our cell phone company disabling for a few days before telling us they were giving us an upgrade. And once they did announce the upgrade, they told us we'd get our voice mail and text messaging back in a few days. Meanwhile, 2 weeks pass with no more updates.
To reiterate, the voice mail and text messaging are FREE, but a decent portion of the reason we purchased the cell plan to begin with was due to having text messaging and voice mail.
I can appreciate the complexity of the system Logos is trying to implement. I can appreciate that the user volume has likely gone up significantly and scalability has to be built into the syncing process. What I can't understand is why I wake up every morning looking for an update to when this issue will be resolved and all I see is that the reading plans will be disabled for the next few days.
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In these areas a service company must avoid two common problems that Logos sometimes fall into. 1. Setting dates that continue to slip to a ridiculous point. 2. Not communicating about dates at all.
I have been waiting for fixes for large highlights since the release of Sync 2. While the fix is apparently done, it awaits the inclusion of the reading plans implementation. A few days - no big deal. However, weeks of expectation becomes frustration. Other than an unofficial word from Alabama (thanks for this by the way), nothing. Not sure how a couple of days can turn into weeks - definitely need to provide updates when this occurs (actually as an ex software I guy I can - but even more the reason to communicate once an expectation has been set).
The other problem that arises is when no dates of any kind are given and/or no vision/plan is cast. Likely this comes as a result of giving dates that continually shift (as this one), and users go balistic. It becomes easier to give no dates than face the heat for a missed date. I am amazed at sometimes how unChiristian the comments can become.
Is there an answer? I believe that great customer service is when a company sets realistic expectations - casting vision and implementation plans - and then delivers. Do things happen? Of course. And these are opportunities to communicate and make users feel that a company understands and is taking appropriate actions to make things right. Perhaps an on going regular set of posts/blogs that provide development/maintenance updates would help. I know that there are some limitations in not wanting to give competitors too much info, but providing something would help. Frustrations arise when a vacum exists. Wild speculation runs rampant in these situations. Dissatisfaction grows exponentially. Establishing a reputation of delivering as promised and providing continual communication in all cases is critical.
The other side of this responsibility is that Logos users must respond appropriately (unfortunately this may never happen based on years of browsing the forums).
Logos is a great company with a great product. But it has areas that could be improved, especially as it expands its reach into the future.
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I love the Logos product, and am impressed with the way Logos tries to deal openly and honestly with its customers (30-day refunds, great sales, relaxed licensing policies, not charging for ongoing syncing/data storage and so on). The difficulty is that situations such as this with the reading plans become those that shape users' views of the company. I am becoming disappointed at the response on this one, and the "few days" notification that appeared on our devices (after the removal of plans) has now turned into over a week with no further official communication.
If someone tells me that my reading plan isn't going to be available for a month, I am happy to put it into a spreadsheet on my iPad and carry on that way until it's fixed, but I have been checking the App Store a couple of times a day now for over a week to see if there is an updated app. Like Danny, I used to manage software projects before becoming a pastor, and still have the scars from the occasions when I didn't communicate well with the user community when unexpected delays occurred. I suspect it is the lack of communication on this issue that is causing frustration, probably because the people concerned have got their heads down full-time to sort out whatever issues have arisen in the implementation, but it would be helpful if whoever is managing them would make sure to put an aupdate setting reasonable expectations onto our home screens so that we can stop wasting time checking these forums and the app store looking for some idea as to what is happening.
We all know that Logos in general, and Bob in particular, really care about these things, but some regular official updates would help those of us who are positive about Logos, and would probably help with the perception of those who are not so positive.
Running Logos 6 Platinum and Logos Now on Surface Pro 4, 8 GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5
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One thing for all of us to remember is that the reading plan sync is one piece of a much larger product that for the most part work really well; not to mention the fact that Logos provides it FREE. While the reading plans not working frustrates me too.I am still thankful for a wonderful product that allows me to do a lot of study while on the go. If you are like me, it is easy to fixate on the negative instead of the positive. The positive is that we have a great mobile app that will be even better once the "reading plan" issue is resolved.
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There is some inherent delay built into Logos updates for iOS as they await approval from the appstore. I'm guessing this process is even more delayed now that everybody is submitting the OS 5.1 updated software.
Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org0 -
Just a reminder that the issue is not really the additional delay (delays are part of life). The issue is how to establish and manage customer expectations (at least for me).
Note: The update has not yet been released for Apple review (at least not as of last week). So we can't just assume it is an Apple update problem.
Users (customers) should neither beat up people in an unChristian manner nor should we merely ignore mistakes in customer service. In order to reach its full potential Logos needs to be aware when it impacts customer's perceptions. Pointing this out is not (or at least should not) be an unkind action, but merely customer feedback about perception of service. I believe that Logos desires this feedback - better to receive feedback than lose customers.
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Free? Have you looked at the price of Logos? With prices starting at $150.00 and capping out at $1700.00 I don't think you can call any feature free.
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As with every other human endeavor, lack of communication allows us to fill in with the worst.
Logos - all you need to do is inform us what is going on!!
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Richard Dillon said:
Logos - all you need to do is inform us what is going on!!
It was confirmed to me today that Logos is trying to get the app (2.1) through the approval process with Apple.
macOS, iOS & iPadOS |Logs| Install
Choose Truth Over Tribe | Become a Joyful Outsider!0 -
Harold W. Maynard said:
Free? Have you looked at the price of Logos? With prices starting at $150.00 and capping out at $1700.00 I don't think you can call any feature free.
Logos mobile apps includes free access to 46 Bibles, a Greek Apparatus, and Summarized Bible.
Logos.com prices for resources range from $ 0.00 (Free) => http://www.logos.com/products/search?start=0&sort=pricelo&pageSize=30 (that includes 1,743 Perseus resources)
to $ 4,290 for Portfolio Edition => http://www.logos.com/products/search?start=&sort=pricehi&pageSize=30 with NICOT/NICNT being $ 40 per volume (set is $ 1,599.95) => The New International Commentary on the Old and New Testament (NICOT/NICNT) (40 vols.) while Theology of the Old Testament collection is $ 90.90 per volume (set is $ 999.95) => Theology of the Old Testament Collection (11 vols.) For a single resource set, the Anchor Yale Bible is $ 1,899.95 => Anchor Yale Bible (AYB) (83 vols.)
Thankful for various Vyrso promotions that have included 74 free eBooks, which are usable in Vyrso and Logos apps plus Logos 4. Vyrso has 4,178 products => http://vyrso.com/products/search?q=&start=&sort=pricehi&pageSize=15 most expensive is $ 30.24 => http://vyrso.com/product/14609/the-most-important-thing-youll-ever-study-a-survey-of-the-bible that has a 55 % discount.
By the way. blog has bargain hunting tips => http://blog.logos.com/2011/07/how-to-find-a-bargain-on-logos-com/
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Thanks Alabama for the update.
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Ditto on the thanks for an update Alabama.
Still the issue is bigger than the specific. I really hope that Logos takes a hard look at communication. The info that filters out from Alabama is a case in point - it brings reassurance and difuses concerns. Why not establish a permanent mechanism (person) to proactively communicate before frustrations set in? This type of proactive communication has become a rarity in today's world (Apple, Microsoft, etc.). What a great opportunity to create a radical departure from the status quo! Already Logos engages in some of this (in general they really are not bad at all) - why not take it to a new level?
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Thanks for the pricing update. My point is I paid over $700.00 for the edition I have which includes a lot of good information that I will never use. One of the features I used was the reading plan. To say it is free is not really true as I paid $700.00 in order to be able to use the reading plan which was until it was taken down a helpful tool.
I also get Solicited every day to buy more material at an additional cost. Is a good buy that's up to the buyer but to say it is free is just not true
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Just a note on the reading plans. If you have the reading plan on your desk top and use outlook as you mail tool. You can export your reading plan to outlook which will then update to your outlook calender which will then sync to your ipad and/or iPhone. It's not hyper linked but it allows you to track the reading required to keep on pace.
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Danny Parker said:
Note: The update has not yet been released for Apple review (at least not as of last week). So we can't just assume it is an Apple update problem.
The good news is that reading plans are working well in private beta...the bad news is that there has been a delay on Apple's part in the approval of the submitted app.
Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org0 -
According to Alabama I was not correct about the whether the fix was released[:$]. Not the first time I have been wrong. lol
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Harold W. Maynard said:
Thanks for the pricing update. My point is I paid over $700.00 for the edition I have which includes a lot of good information that I will never use. One of the features I used was the reading plan. To say it is free is not really true as I paid $700.00 in order to be able to use the reading plan which was until it was taken down a helpful tool.
I also get Solicited every day to buy more material at an additional cost. Is a good buy that's up to the buyer but to say it is free is just not true
In 2009, Logos changed software and resource licensing to only charge for resource licenses. All Logos software releases on all platforms became free. Caveat: to use certain features, appropriate resource(s) are needed (e.g. Reverse Interlinear Bibles in Logos 4). Logos does charge for resource licenses (or to remove on-Air watermark in Proclaim). Looking at Logos 4 comparison chart => http://www.logos.com/comparison reading plan feature is available for all base packages. Looking at iPad features => http://www.logos.com/mobile/ipad noticed reading plan is included. Caveat: to use a reading plan for a resource, need to have a resource license. Depends on resource for price to be paid, which ranges from $ 0.00 (Free) to lots of money for base packages, library bundles, and additional purchases.
Note: when looking to build a digital library, Logos has potential for most money to be spent with over 12,000 resources available for purchase at Logos.com and Vyrso.com (a variety of resources are multi-volume sets).
By the way, my library has many resources that have not been opened (from base package, bundle, and community pricing purchases); honestly not know how many resources will be useful. Already Thankful for many resources plus Thankful for various Logos sales.
Likewise Thankful for many friendly forum discussions; have learned a lot plus have a lot to learn.
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Sorry for the delayed reading plans. We were pretty confident we'd be through the app store in the normal time frame, but we were denied during app store review over a minor issue. Now there appears to be a slow down in the review process, which we guess is because of all the apps getting re-submitted with iPad retina display graphics for the new iPad.
Unfortunately Apple's review process is opaque, and rejections are never anticipated. This could add a week to the process. (To the best of my knowledge we re-submitted the same day, but that can reset the clock by a week.)
-- Bob
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Bob, thanks for the update
Good to have an insight into what is happening - and to be aware of some of the challenges you are facing.
Really appreciated.
Graham
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Thank you Bob and Alabama
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It appears we're back up and running! Bible reading plans just appeared on my iPad 2 and it is now also syncing back to the desktop app (on Mac)!
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polytrotter said:
Bible reading plans just appeared on my iPad 2
Same here - and they are synced up to date with my PC. No sign of the new app in the App Store yet, though. Still, that's progress!
Running Logos 6 Platinum and Logos Now on Surface Pro 4, 8 GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5
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This is indeed a good development - although I admit that I don't understand how this has happened!
The new sync capability requires an update to the Logos app and this app hasn't arrived yet - but sync is working!
In another thread it was suggested that this functionality may have been provided as a side effect of an update to Vyrso but that is speculation.
We wait for clarification while enjoying the return of this feature!
Graham
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Thank You Logos!
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Graham Criddle said:
This is indeed a good development - although I admit that I don't understand how this has happened!
The new sync capability requires an update to the Logos app and this app hasn't arrived yet - but sync is working!
It works because it's not actually sync [:)]. When we updated reading plans to v2, we also included a new, stateless way to access the data to better support Biblia and other future offerings. We used this new API to reconstruct the data that the iOS apps (prior to version 2.1) expect to see.
So if you're running version 2.1 of an app, you're using reading plans sync v2; if you're using a prior version, you're accessing this new service indirectly.
David Mitchell
Development Lead
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Thanks Dave
Makes sense and very helpful - good job.
Graham
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woo hoo! Thanks!
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Will http://biblia.com reading plans come back online at the same time as the app plans?
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Will Ellett said:
Will http://biblia.com reading plans come back online at the same time as the app plans?
Biblia reading plans are handled separately from mobile reading plans. However, the code to re-enable them has been completed, so reading plans should be available on Biblia after the next deployment.
David Mitchell
Development Lead
Faithlife0
