Logos Android App Development Seems to Have Slowed to a Crawl
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Hi Jim. I'm not a Logos apologist, but I suspect they recognize that it is not only a service to their customers but also increases their continuing profitability to continue improving the mobile apps.
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
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Don't be too hard on Logos. My Osnova eBibles used to be great on the Kindle Keyboard but are too slow to find verses on the Kindle Fire. My Tecarta eBibles work great on the Kindle Fire but their web site is still inoperable to be able to sync with my Kindle Fire eBibles.
Thus, NONE are perfect. Remember, Romans 2:23 "all............fall short of the glory of God." I got that verse in seconds with my Tecarta eBible on my Kindle Fire. I don't read eBibles on my PC anymore.
I'm also almost positive all of us will get a big Easter suprise from Logos: Version 1.0.0 P L E A S E ...............! I suspect the 5 android programmers are working for a big Easter bonus around the clock.
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How about an e-mail a few times a month telling us how software projects are progressing? You can call it "Logos Insider" or something like that.
While I also would enjoy this - it isn't likely. Why? It takes time and time is money.
Who would write up the software progress reports? The programmers are the only ones qualified to know what they've been doing on these software projects. I'd rather they wrote code than newsletters. They already commit change-logs which are pruned and provided when there is a new release.
My own former dabbling in coding taught me that one line in a change-log may equal hundreds (thousands?) of lines of code, multiple hours of testing, and many many trials and failures along the way.
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 0 -
My own former dabbling in coding taught me that one line in a change-log may equal hundreds (thousands?) of lines of code, multiple hours of testing, and many many trials and failures along the way.
Also, one line in a change log that makes sense to other programmers and Logos staff may appear a bit whimsical to others, who would need more contextual information to understand.
Keep Smiling [:)]
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The best advertising is word-of-mouth. The best advertisers for logos are current users if they are happy. They might want to consider investing a little bit more in their current best advertisers. They have plenty of time to send out daily emails about resources we can buy. Why not a weekly email about the progress of their future development. Make it for those who sign up only. That way those of us who crave more information, can get it. I'd be happy to do it for just a slight discount on one future purchase per year
Dr. Kevin Purcell, Director of Missions
Brushy Mountain Baptist Association0 -
So I'm thinking of buying a Kindle Fire within the week, just for using Logos. . . Should I wait until Easter (when the next update comes out)?
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Noticed tonight that they have fixed the Gk and Heb word lookups. Clicked on the word after the one I wanted and got the word I clicked on! Clicked on the one I wanted and got it. Went from my Kindle Fire to phone, same pleasant result. Checked the Hebrew; vowel points still off (no real biggy; if you are use to reading Hebrew since the vowel points are secondary) but the word lookup is now spot on.
I may be slow in noticing because I have been doing my language reading at OliveTree lately. May just remove Olive Tree now that the most infuriating bug is fixed. Thanks much Logos Android Team. BTW: how long has it been fixed?
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So I'm thinking of buying a Kindle Fire within the week, just for using Logos. . . Should I wait until Easter (when the next update comes out)?
Reading rumors about Kindle Fire model(s) later this year => http://allthingsd.com/20120209/is-amazon-building-a-bigger-fire/ and => http://www.zdnet.com/blog/mobile-news/next-for-amazon-8212-big-kindle-fire-or-refresh-existing-model/7243
Currently not know price point(s) for new model(s) so do not know if Kindle Fire will drop in price like Apple's refurbished iPad's did earlier this month.
By the way, newegg.com has a number of Android tablets with prices less than the Kindle Fire. At $ 199, noticed Lenovo A1 => http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834246233 has 16 GB storage and micro SD (Lenovo bought IBM's ThinkPad business years ago). Review => http://www.pcworld.com/article/239317/lenovo_ideapad_tablet_a1_a_199_bargain.html Kindle Fire also runs Android 2.3 (Gingerbread).
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Jim, you're right, looks like they have fixed the look-up feature. That's why I read the forums, always someone who knows a lot more than me. Thanks for the alert. [:)]
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Noticed tonight that they have fixed the Gk and Heb word lookups
BTW: how long has it been fixed?
Hi Jim
This is good news - but strange!
When Logos shipped the current version (0.9.4) it was noted specifically that this wasn't included! See discussion at http://community.logos.com/forums/p/44710/333252.aspx#333252
So I don't know whether it is totally fixed or not.
Graham
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I guess I'm going to have to wait! . . .Is the app on the Kindle Fire going to be the same as the App on an android tablet?
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Hi Mmaglaya
For what are you waiting?
And yes, the app on the Fire is functionally the same as on the tablet.
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the supposedly new 9" kindle coming out later this year!
right?? i mean, one now would be cool, but i can wait. . . . .maybe... do you have a Fire, Graham??
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Hi MMaglaya
the supposedly new 9" kindle coming out later this year!
I understand now, I see you are responding to KS4J' answer to your earlier post.
When posting a reply, it can be useful to "quote" the post to which you are replying so that it is easier to keep track. Details of doing so are at http://wiki.logos.com/Using_the_Forum#Reply_post_editor
do you have a Fire, Graham??
No, I don't. Just a regular Android phone.
Graham
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the supposedly new 9" kindle coming out later this year!
right?? i mean, one now would be cool, but i can wait. . . . .maybe... do you have a Fire, Graham??
If there is a 9" kindle, which who knows at this point, it might be worth considering. I really like my 8.9" galaxy tab. It's a comfortable weight and size for portrait mode reading, as well as being big enough in landscape mode for web surfing and basic laptop replacement functions. Especially when paired with a bluetooth keyboard and/or mouse.
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I would love to see Logos make the Android version a more versatile offline tool, as I don't have access to the web via my tablet much of the time.
Two features that would be useful would be offline search and the ability to categorize resources.
Anything else you would like to see?Director of Zoeproject
www.zoeproject.com
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I would love to see Logos make the Android version a more versatile offline tool, as I don't have access to the web via my tablet much of the time. Two features that would be useful would be offline search and the ability to categorize resources. Anything else you would like to see?
I second that request. My Church only allows staff to access their network. Thus, Logos is useless now for me where I need it - in church. Without offline search it simply cannot be used there at all on my Kindle Fire.
Also, many apps have released Kindle Fire Versions with special features not available in other tablets. Amazon is now pushing out their latest firmware release 6.3 which will have even more features which Logos could address.
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Well, it has been three months since the last Android update. Can someone tell us what is going on behind the scenes?
Director of Zoeproject
www.zoeproject.com
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By the way, appears Android development is a bit more expensive than iOS so one game developer is abandoning Android due to lack of profitability => http://mikamobile.blogspot.in/2012/03/our-future-with-android.html
Keep Smiling
Thanks that explains many of the issues very well, and while logos is not selling mobile apps at all, to make an APP covering most of the hardware out there is not as easy as one might hope. I would bet Logos could get their app out quicker if they focused on one device, but then while Kindle fire users might be jumping with joy, many others might find it didn't run at all. I am the last one who should be talking about the virtue of patience but I can see it is no small task getting everything to run smoothly on the majority of android configurations. As someone pointed out earlier it is better to get one thing done first. I believe Logos is likely focusing on basic usability and stability (on all targeted android devices). It will take a while but I am sure you will find it was worth the wait when all is said and done.
-Dan
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I would love to see Logos make the Android version a more versatile offline tool, as I don't have access to the web via my tablet much of the time.
Two features that would be useful would be offline search and the ability to categorize resources.
Anything else you would like to see?
Would be very nice & more power to you if you can get them to do this, as it might mean more robust offline options in the iOS universe too… so I will [Y] this idea too...
-Dan
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By the way, appears Android development is a bit more expensive than iOS so one game developer is abandoning Android due to lack of profitability => http://mikamobile.blogspot.in/2012/03/our-future-with-android.html
Thanks that explains many of the issues very well, and while logos is not selling mobile apps at all, to make an APP covering most of the hardware out there is not as easy as one might hope.
I'm sure app dev on Android is more difficult, since I've heard this from many developers who do it for both Android and iOS, I don't think the issues the gaming company cited has are applicable with the Logos app. It's graphically pretty straightforward app. I doubt they have to deal with all the problems a 3D gaming environment brings. The compatibility issues for multiple devices won't affect Logos nearly as much.
Dr. Kevin Purcell, Director of Missions
Brushy Mountain Baptist Association0 -
On the contrary, Android development has accelerated recently and in the past few months we've more than doubled staffing on the Android team.
I understand that you can't see inside our organization, but you could just ask "What's up with Android development?" instead of posting provocative headlines like "Android App Development Seems to Have Slowed to a Crawl." I understand that the "seems" gets you off the hook of making an untrue statement -- because technically it "seems" to you dev has slowed to a crawl, even though you have no data on which to base any statements about the development, which by its nature happens inside Logos and out of sight.
But provocative headlines do get your forum threads read... that's why I'm going to start one with the equally true (and disconnected from facts) headline "Logos Android users not ruled-out as suspects in flash mob crime spree." I mean, you haven't all been cleared, right? The police haven't announced arresting anyone else yet, right? It could have been you... I don't know it wasn't... Maybe there was a real-life "ice cream sandwich tablet" on display...
:-)
Okay, I'm being defensive... I know you just want the Android app, and we've not been delivering enough information. We'll keep trying:
We're on it. It's getting better every day. We have a team of 4-5 developers assigned specifically to Android (not counting all the shared code it uses from other devs/teams). Our primary Android targets are phones and the Kindle Fire, because Android hasn't made much market-share progress on tablets yet. (But we have many Android tablets on site and are working on them, too.)
The Android app is rapidly catching up and major new releases are coming shortly. The other "unannounced" products people think are stealing time from "the things I want done first" are actually built on the same code base. Yes, we're doing many things, but we're also making sure that everything we do "kills two birds with one stone." The net result of our recent efforts has been a doubling of the Android team, not a detraction from it.
By the way... for all those who said or agreed with "I think that it is better to complete one task before moving on to the next." -- is it alright with you if we stop all Android development and move those developers back to working on Logos 4 for the Mac desktop? Or fixing Logos 4 Windows issues? Or working on Proclaim? As a matter of principle? Because there were no Android tablets or Kindle Fire when we released those products and promised updates...
:-)
Thank you for the update Bob. I have an iPad (version 1 WiFi only), but I want to get my own phone since my employer will shut down in the coming months and I don't want to keep the ages old BlackBerry. I waffle between an iPhone 5 when it arrives and the Samsung Galaxy Note (available now). I am confident after reading your post that the Logos Android app will be satisfactory for my intended use on the Galaxy (the iPAd will still be my primary mobile Logos device), so I am leaning in that direction.
And I can sure appreciate what you must feel about some of the derogatory posts. I've faced the same challenges as a data warehouse developer/manager/administrator for 15 years. There's always somebody expressing their frustration at being underserved by spreading speculative gossip instead of asking direct questions with an open mind.
Have a great Easter season, and send the same greetings to the whole Logos team for me.
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I will chime in on this. Having developed the same application for android, iphone and most recently windows phone 7 I would say that development for iOS is MORE expensive and difficult than the others.
For one, you can only develop iOS apps on a Mac, a rather expensive piece of hardware considering the cost of a comparable PC. Secondly, Xcode, bleck. I have much experience with C++ but Apples version, XCode, just seems harder than it should be. I am sure a lot of this was unfamiliarity with the dev environment and the unique aspects of the language.
Android, is Java based and can be developed with open source tools, ie - cheaply. The Davlik VM is different than the standard Java VM but enough similiarity is there. Framework is of course different as well.
Windows Phone 7, XAML and SIlverlight. Painful. Free tools, alhough limited. Really bad documentation.
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I have much experience with C++
Logos is hiring: http://www.logos.com/about/careers has => Software Developer with choice of work location: Bellingham, WA or Phoenix, AZ.
Keep Smiling [:)]
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We live in a instant society.. but being a developer I know some solutions are not instant, and quick fixes usually come back to haunt you.. and take more time to put right
Whilst I am champing at the bit for a new update, I would rather they get it right first time, than them making it worse in the long term.. and burying us in patches/updates
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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BTW, more developers are NOT necessarily better. It depends if you have parallel tasks; if not, they just trip over each other. It's also worth noting that the most productive programmers are many times (perhaps 10) more productive than average programmers.
Windows 11
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Glad that 1.0 Beta 1 has been released!
http://community.logos.com/forums/t/48972.aspx
That's what I'm talking about! [:D]
Director of Zoeproject
www.zoeproject.com
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No matter how mad your customers' comments make you, there is a certain amount of tactfulness that should be exhibited in order to remain professional. I know it is easy to let emotions pour out in posts when they are hot out of the oven especially if you are replying to unfounded statements. All I am saying is take a break before replying and think about how your customers will perceive your posts. Just trying to help.
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Hi Ron,
Did you mean to post this comment on this thread? I looked back and didn't see any previous posts from you over the last three pages (I might have missed it, in which case I apologize). I only make this comment since this thread seemed to get a little testy a while back, and I would hate to see fresh powder and a new fuse stuck back in this particular keg unnecessarily.
Platform Details for Alpha/Beta Testing Reference:
- Windows 7 Home Premium x64
- Intel Core2 Duo P7450 @ 2.13GHz
- 6GB DDR3 RAM
- Logos 4 Gold
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