The Attraction of the Cross

This resource is free if you bid at or above the closing price. I am still shocked that it is taking this long to put this resource over the top.

If everyone bids the max ($34), it will go over the top, and we still end up paying $0 for it.

http://www.logos.com/product/20510/the-attraction-of-the-cross

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Paul-C

I'm in at $34 too.

Friends, given how long it generally takes Logos to get CP items to publication, here is a golden opportunity - at no cost [Y] - to try and speed things up a little by increasing your bids to $34.

Michael Kinch

Hello Tom. I am surprised that this one hasn't crossed over the top as well. It is peaking at $18.00 and is almost over the top. I think you are working against it by bidding at $34. I think the purpose of this is to introduce new users to community pricing and get more of us involved in placing bids. As it sits right now with a peak at $18 anyone who bids $18 or more will get this product for free when it crosses over. I have not been on the forums for very long and wasn't aware of the value of community pricing until fairly recently. My experience so far though is when I have placed a bid at the suggested price (where it is peaking at) I have been successful in getting the product at the community price (my bid has been successful). Most of the time this has been below the bid I placed as it usually drops as more people place their bids. At any time we can go into our account and view our community pricing bids. We can see if any of our bids will not be successful. Click on account at the top of the Logos website, then click on orders. Prepub orders will be listed first then community pricing. Any bids that are too low, the bid you placed will be in red and at the bottom of your community pricing you will see "* Your bid may fail" also in red.

Sometimes you will see a resource that has a suggested bid that is more than you will be willing to pay. In this case you can place your bid at the price you would be willing to pay and the price may come down to your bid. Or you can place your bid higher and you can cancel it later if it doesn't come down to where you are willing to pay. If you place your bid at the suggested price at least you are assured that you will get it at community pricing if you really want it and can opt out later if you need to.

I am certainly not an expert on community pricing and am sure that I have alot to learn from others here. Please correct me if I am wrong in any of my assumptions or add more to this thread to help us all get the most of community pricing.

tom

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374605#Comment_374605

Michael, For the most part, you are correct. Because Logos is going to give this book away, it doesn't matter what the bid is as long as it is above the point it crosses the 100% point. Therefore, bidding $34 will move the product into production faster.

I think you are working against it by bidding at $34.

No, a bid at $34 is also a bid at $18. Someone who moves their bid from a lower price to a higher price will not lower the current peek.

I will even say that once it crosses the 100% line, we will get so many new bidders that the "price" will drop down to $4. But first we need to push it over the top.

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374614#Comment_374614

Therefore, bidding $34 will move the product into production faster.

I don't mean to be contentious, but someone moving their bid from $18 to $34 will not move it into production any sooner unless enough other people do so to set the curve at $34, and hence "cross the line" at $34. Since the curve is at $18, any bid at $18 (or higher) is of equal worth. New bidders are needed, and it doesn't matter what they bid as long as it is at least $18. The same amount of new bidders are needed to make it cross the line at $18, wether other bidders bid $18 or $34.

I point this out because it would be easy to conceive a situation where a small group of bidders get the CP to "cross the line" at $34 and bidders at $18 lose out. They could, of course, change their bid to $34, but inevitably there will be some who don't and miss out.

tom

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374619#Comment_374619

unless enough other people do so to set the curve at $34,

This is what I was hoping for. Once it crosses the line, then the price will drop.

I point this out because it would be easy to conceive a situation where a small group of bidders get the CP to "cross the line" at $34 and bidders at $18 lose out. They could, of course, change their bid to $34, but inevitably there will be some who don't and miss out.

This is possible, but I think is very very very unlikely. Once it crosses the line, more people will place their bid. As I said in the above post. I think when it is over and done with, the "cost" will be around $4.

David Salazar

Actually to serve the purpose Logos wants, I think $34 would be detrimental. (The purpose is to introduce others to CP, not have a resource hit 100% so one can have another book)

If I'm new to CP, and i see that it went for $34 for an +150 year old book, which most likely I'll never read or use, it would turn me off to the whole process. Having the video explain it helps but when you actually see the process unfold that speaks louder.

What they should have done in the video was use an example of the classic commentaries (since they say commentaries are their highest sellers) and show how much savings can be achieved. And then this this test run with this book.

Not sure if it would work, but lower bids would help accomplish the goal. If the book sold as $5 dollars to say, that would get people excited about the opportunity to purchases. ($18 doesn't really encourage me at all, and at that price I'd never get and much less at $34, and even though it's free in the end, the whole process that plays out with this resources leaves little to make one think that you get a great deal on a public-domain book)

Since Logos will offer free, maybe they can lower the math on the percentage, so that it will reach 100% quicker

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374620#Comment_374620

I think when it is over and done with, the "cost" will be around $4.

In which case 4.5 times the number of people required to make it "cross the line" at $18 will need to bid… which I think is very unlikely. I agree with you that it is probably to end up at least at $18, but this isn't guaranteed. If it closes higher, anyone who bid $18 will be out of luck. In the Vyrso forum, someone just asked about ways to ensure that they get the freebies while they are on vacation (the answer is to either have internet and check daily or get someone else to order for you). If it closes above $18, there WILL be people who miss out. For these reasons I am in no hurry for this to cross the line.

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374605#Comment_374605

suggested bid

It's not a "suggested bid", it's simply the most common bid. I've never understood why the first person who happens to see a new CP gets to set the price, and everyone else just bids the same, without any particular reason except that that was what the first person happened to think it was worth. CP would work much better if everyone bid what the resource is worth to them, not what it is worth to someone else.

David Salazar

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374636#Comment_374636

suggested bid

It's not a "suggested bid", it's simply the most common bid. I've never understood why the first person who happens to see a new CP gets to set the price, and everyone else just bids the same, without any particular reason except that that was what the first person happened to think it was worth. CP would work much better if everyone bid what the resource is worth to them, not what it is worth to someone else.

technically with the user base that there is, CP resources have the opportunity to be MUCH MUCH lower, even in the single digits. This of course ideal circumstances which won't happen.

What I'd like to see is that when you open Logos the homepage would show you your bids and how the resources is progressing (Some may have tons of bids - maybe there could be a tab, but either way the home page gives you x number of pages). That could make others bid what they really want to rather than going higher just because they don't want to miss out. (A lot of people, like me do not like nor have the time to be checking out the Logos pages/forums constantly) I'm very strict with my parameters and if I miss out I miss out (in the end I probably won't miss it because I never had it; especially since there are so many other resources that one has in Logos if you have mid-to high level base package.

price per volume, etc means nothing to me, since I will not read the whole thing (but every page does cost Logos I know). I bid what I view as a good deal to have these public domain resource available to me in Logos.

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374660#Comment_374660

A lot of people, like me do not like nor have the time to be checking out the Logos pages/forums constantly

There's no need to, really. Simple strategy that will keep you from missing anything:

Use the software Home Page (or the RSS feed, or the CP e-mail notifications) to see the new CP's that are added, and bid on what you want.
Take a look at http://www.logos.com/products/search?Status=Community+Pricing&start=&sort=progress&pageSize=60 once a week, some time between Wednesday noon and Friday noon PST. The closing ones will be at the top.

Theoretically you can even ignore 1 and just do 2, but if everyone did that, nothing would ever close at all.

Beloved Amodeo

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374783#Comment_374783

few more bids @ $20 should close this tasty this week [:)]

jcc

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374892#Comment_374892

I think this "experiment" that logos is running is showing how community pricing isn't working as the way it was intended. What was intended in for each person to bid the maximum amount that he is willing to pay for the resource. But what is ending up (with other resources) is that there is a sort of "crowd" effect going on. If the highest price is at $18, that's what everyone will look at and bid at (I know personally, that's what I'm tending to do even though math says that I should bid at the highest price that I want the resource at. If the current peak is at below what I want to pay, I tend not to bid at all. If current peak is above, I'd just bid at the peak normally.

For this special promotion, I had to think about the math and break my habit and bid the highest price possible.

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/374636#Comment_374636

CP would work much better if everyone bid what the resource is worth to them, not what it is worth to someone else.

That is my philosophy. I bid what I am willing to pay. If it goes for that or less—fine. If it goes for more, I still don't lose, because it is more that I am willing to pay.

Ken McGuire

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/376080#Comment_376080

I think this "experiment" that logos is running is showing how community pricing isn't working as the way it was intended. What was intended in for each person to bid the maximum amount that he is willing to pay for the resource. But what is ending up (with other resources) is that there is a sort of "crowd" effect going on. If the highest price is at $18, that's what everyone will look at and bid at (I know personally, that's what I'm tending to do even though math says that I should bid at the highest price that I want the resource at. If the current peak is at below what I want to pay, I tend not to bid at all. If current peak is above, I'd just bid at the peak normally.

It is pretty obvious that many people do not understand how Community Pricing and even the Pre-publication programs work. I commend Logos recently sending out marketing to move along some stalled projects as well as this giveaway.

But I don't really think it worked this time. I was disappointed at how "expensive" this book went over the line. Logos wants more people to participate - I want more people to participate to bring down the price for stuff I want.

The "high price" makes me think that it didn't reach into that many new bidders. Of course, I don't have real data other than having watched what books people actually had to pay for cost in community pricing...

The "high price" also could also discourage those new users. Instead of thinking, "Wow, I got to check this out for more deals", they would probably be thinking "Thanks for the Free book, but I would never pay anywhere near the $16 for it."

But, we will see.

Evan Boardman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/376141#Comment_376141

CP would work much better if everyone bid what the resource is worth to them, not what it is worth to someone else.

That is my philosophy. I bid what I am willing to pay. If it goes for that or less—fine. If it goes for more, I still don't lose, because it is more that I am willing to pay.

Often if you bid higher than you want to pay for it , you will see the price go down.