Official: Minimum Crossgrade and free engine download are coming!
Comments
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Scott Stackelhouse said:
Could someone explain what the difference is between crossgrading my L4 Scholar's Library vs upgrading to the L5 Starter package?
Both will give you the L5 appearance and engine. The crossgrade (subject to confirmation of details) will give you the new datasets used in L5. L5 Starter will give you a few new books but not all the datasets and related program features: see the bottom end of the comparison table at logos.com/upgrade.
If still in doubt, wait for the crossgrade and make your decision when all of the options are on the table.
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Heavenly Father we pray for your incredible blessing and favour for Bob Pritchett and Logos as a company. Ultimately, we thank you for your divine Word that truly wrecks us and rebuilds us into your image, but we also thank you for modern tools that help to study, learn, and prepare that Word fully and efficiently.
We ask you Lord that you meet every financial need in the company with an abundance that can only come as an extension of your grace. As Bob leads with strength and humility, let that overflow pour into his lap and may his faith RISE over any bill, debt, or future endeavor that is before him.
In so doing, we believe that you will give him and the whole team the wisdom necessary to steer through this momentary frustration. There is an answer that covers all the bases! And it is found in YOU FATHER! Thank you in advance for this supernatural provision.
Bob, and Logos team, we bless you and speak favor into all that you are going through. May God's supernatural grace, righteousness, favor, and abundance fill you to overflowing and spill into your lap.
Okay I feel better now
I was in the frustrated category for the last few days (trying to justify any upgrade to my wife on a church planters salary). Anyway, woke up praying for you all and found it a better approach. Sorry it took us so long Bob. :Dan Cousins (Church Planter from British Columbia, Canada)
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I am typically one who looks forward to upgrades of software, but Logos 4 did nothing for me. I hope Logos 5 is truly an upgrade. Before Logos 4, I was an avid user of your software. With the "upgrade," however, I found the software confusing and unusable. I've felt the money I spent purchasing the Gold Edition of Logos 4 has gone to waste. Now, looking at another version coming out, I'm wondering if it's worth upgrading or if I should uninstall Logos 4 and try re-installing the old program that worked for me.
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David Braak said:
I am typically one who looks forward to upgrades of software, but Logos 4 did nothing for me. I hope Logos 5 is truly an upgrade. Before Logos 4, I was an avid user of your software. With the "upgrade," however, I found the software confusing and unusable. I've felt the money I spent purchasing the Gold Edition of Logos 4 has gone to waste. Now, looking at another version coming out, I'm wondering if it's worth upgrading or if I should uninstall Logos 4 and try re-installing the old program that worked for me.
David,
Welcome to the forums! I'm sorry you had trouble using Logos 4. If choose to keep Logos 4 or upgrade to Logos 5 I hope you will come to the forums and ask for help. If you don't know how to do something or are confused just ask your question in the forums. You will likely get an answer pretty quick.
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I'm encouraged to read that a crossgrade is coming soon. I'm not a Logos 4 power user and originally purchased the Bible Study Library (LE). My upgrade to Logo 5 moves me to the Bronze level but I'm not in a position to spend $330. It appears I can upgrade to the Starter level for $70. Though, I'm wondering if it would be still cost effective for me to wait for the crossgrade.
Thoughts?
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Chris Bell said:
I'm encouraged to read that a crossgrade is coming soon. I'm not a Logos 4 power user and originally purchased the Bible Study Library (LE). My upgrade to Logo 5 moves me to the Bronze level but I'm not in a position to spend $330. It appears I can upgrade to the Starter level for $70. Though, I'm wondering if it would be still cost effective for me to wait for the crossgrade.
Thoughts?
Have you seen the post about 5 entries above yours that reads:
Both will give you the L5 appearance and engine. The crossgrade (subject to confirmation of details) will give you the new datasets used in L5. L5 Starter will give you a few new books but not all the datasets and related program features: see the bottom end of the comparison table at logos.com/upgrade.
If still in doubt, wait for the crossgrade and make your decision when all of the options are on the table.
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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the answer to that question is that they already have our money
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tom said:Scott Stackelhouse said:
Could someone explain what the difference is between crossgrading my L4 Scholar's Library vs upgrading to the L5 Starter package?
We have to wait and see what is included with the cross-grade. If I had to take a guess, the cross-grade will not have any books, just the databases, and the starter package has some books and some databases.
With dynamic pricing, a minimal crossgrade has potential for 4 price points:
1) Crossgrade from Logos 4 - purchase all the new resources for Logos 5 use
2) Crossgrade from Logos 5 Starter, which has 4 of the 16 new Logos 5 Data Sets
3) Crossgrade from Logos 5 Bronze, which has 12 of the 16 new Logos 5 Data Sets
4) Crossgrade from Logos 5 Silver, which has 15 of the 16 new Logos 5 Data Sets
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Robert, don't let a payment plan hold you back. While my base package was paid off a long time ago (4 times actually, as I went from Leader's to Scholar's the Silver to Gold, if I recall), I still had a payment plan from some other content I bought 6 months ago. It's generally how I operate. For me, $5 a month in service charge is a great deal to get a thousand or two thousand dollars worth of content now, for 1/12th the price.
Take a look at http://www.logos.com/upgrade - as I did, and click on "new to you" as you browse the various packages. Don't worry about where you are now. If you have Platinum and go to Gold, you don't "lose" any platinum books. You keep 100% of what you had, and get 100% of what's new in that new base package. For me, it was about $120 more to go from v4 Gold to v5 Platinum then to go from Gold to Gold. And rather than wait a few weeks for the crossgrade, I took a good look at what was in Platinum, and decided I wanted it. And I keep all my old stuff, including things like NIV 1984 that are no longer available at any level, or even separately.
But keep paying your payment plan. You agreed to buy something, and have used it for 5 months, but haven't finished paying for it yet. But don't assume you have to "start over", or "wait".
In my case, I keep my Logos monthly budget pretty fixed. Every time I pay something off, I buy something new, but keep the monthly the same, so it's easy for me to budget for my library building. I called Logos on the phone, and they were 100% willing to add in the upgrade to my existing payment plan, resetting it from 6 months to 12 months in the process. The monthly was a bit more than I had budgeted for, so I spoke to my wife, gave them a one time $200 payment, and ended up with a monthly price in our range (went up about $10 a month in my case). The rep even noticed I had my next payment due in 3 days, and spoke to accounting to cancel it, so 12 months starts next month, not in 3 days. That made the $200 even more tolerable for me!
I suspect that even if it was ethical to start over (it's not), it's cheaper to upgrade now with the special pricing than throw away what you paid and pay full price for your package. Or, if you are 100% satisfied with what you have now, content-wise, but like what v5 offers feature-wise - wait a bit, and drop the $100 or less on the crossgrade. But like any other software purchase, once you buy it, you pay for future upgrades, even if they happen 5 weeks after you bought. In Logos' case you have a 30 day return policy. Go buy Microsoft Office at a local store, and try to return it after opening it. They are trying to be fair here, but also stay in business, which as a paying customer with thousands in content, I need... if they go away tomorrow, I have a lot of money invested...
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ManilaDave said:
There is another aspect to this as well. Once the initial roll out is completed Logos will raise the price of its offer to us. After all their offer to us states a price that is "today only"! So not only do we backbone customers get devalued in the new launch we get shafted on price later.
I hope you'll find that the initial discounts are in place long enough to be available when you want them. If you're unable to participate then because you're already committed to too many pre-pubs, give us a call. We don't want anyone to feel taken advantage of or abused in any way, and if so we'll do whatever we can to make it right.
ManilaDave said:I've raised a similar issue before without response from Logos. When they cluster the release dates of many pre-pubs around the same time we're often forced to choose between resources we really want and make a priority choice on the basis of the resource we consider most valuable to us at that moment. I suggested that in the case where this happens that Logos hold the pre-pub price open for a period for the customers who through their pre-pub order enabled the product to get to production in the first place. But I received no response. I've been unable to purchase several resources [all collections or sets] I really wanted because of this.
I'm sorry you didn't get a response sooner. This is an ongoing topic of discussion here, and we need to balance many concerns. Among the issues: the books are produced in parallel. Hundreds of people are working on many resources at once, and with 2,000+ shipping per year to every-possible-permutation of customers, it's impossible to "smart schedule" the release dates. Extending the discount period seems like a good solution, but that effectively takes away the point of pre-pub, which is a discounted price for an early commitment. (If the price doesn't go up, everyone can wait a while to buy, then pre-pub is no different than just adding it to the web store at a fixed price.) There are possible solutions to this, and variant models we could try, but most of them require web coding that we haven't been able to get to yet.
Please do know that we're aware of this issue, and it gets a lot of thought and attention here. We are working on solutions.
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Bob,
Thanks for taking the time to respond.
Even though I am one of those who has experienced numerous prepub releases at the same time (this is going to happen again in about 10 days), Logos is not responsible for placing my orders - I am. And as much as I wish there would be a gradual release of prepubs, it's impossible for Logos to develop a release schedule when so many different customers place so many different orders. One month I may have no prepubs shipped when someone else has many.
So - I appreciate the time and effort Logos takes to work with each customer.
By the way, I have talked to customer service and we have already worked out a plan for me to afford my prepubs.
Another happy customer!
PS. I am patiently waiting for the Crossgrade so I can play with Logos 5 too.
Thanks again,
Ron
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Hey, Dan Cousins,
Thanks for calling us into prayer, and for the prayer you offered. [:)]
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Beautifully perfect response! Thank you for taking the time to clear things up, and offer us your great new features at a very reasonable rate.
Simply! Thank you and God bless!
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I do hope that at the very least Logos will keep the intro pricing up until the cross-grade can launch; otherwise we'll have no way to compare pricing. I'm also curious if I upgrade to a lower base package if the % discount on the higher ones vanishes (eg, if I pay more to upgrade to broze then to silver than if I went directly to silver).
So, right now I can upgrade to Starter for $48, and Bronze for $226. If I get Starter today can I buy Bronze for $178 tomorrow, or will the discount on Bronze be less so the total would be more than the $228 I'd have paid for it initially?
Thanks!
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Robin
I bought a lower package and the discounts did change. However, I think I could call sales and could get the original pricing if done within 30 days or so.
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Robin,
I would suggest that you give the good folks at Logos a call first thing tomorrow when they are open. They are quite reasonable and if you voice your concerns over this, they might be willing to make arrangements with you regarding all of this uncertainty. If you spend a certain amount of time going over the lists of things you will get with this new version, start with the package that is going to give you the largest discount. It may be more than you want to spend, but go through the lists of stuff. Most of it to me is beyond my skill level, and although useful at some point, I couldn't really see the value of owning of it. Then I found some commentaries and devotional resources like the works of Baxter and Tozer. Here's a helpful hint in your decision making progress. When they give you a price for a resource, cut that price in half. You know that they are going to put that on sale at some point. You just have to be patient and wait for it. If you can add up a number that comes pretty close to equating to the price they are asking about 100 dollars short, then you should probably just do it. I say 100 dollars short as the minimal crossgrade is going to cost you something. We don't know for sure what that is, but I would venture to say it is probably around the 100 dollar mark. If it turns out to be 50 or 150, you are still only 50 dollars off in your calculation. Personally, I think it is the only way in which you can justify the expense of a large amount of money is by pulling certain things out of the huge list that really speak to you. Now, if you manage to talk yourself into the larger process and just can't manage to push yourself into the pool... ask your sales person if there is any way to buy into the lower package and test the waters a bit and still be able to get that special price on that bigger package a week or two down the road. All they can do is to say no and then you know you will have to jump now or lose that 15-30 percent discount. The lists of stuff you have to wade through is pretty intimidating. I think that if you concentrate on picking out the things that you really like in the list and with the big ticket items like commentaries and such, using half the price they give you as a guide will help you. I am sure somebody in sales will be groaning at the half price thing but really, even with that, you will find that the dollars will really add up quick. If you can't get the dollar amount at one level, drop to the next one and try there. You will find a happy spot where you can feel good about what you are getting and end up with some really cool resources that you really like and will use. Along with that will be a whole slug of other stuff that you might or might not make use of. Forget about that part and just concentrate on the things that you know you will cherish and use over the years to come. :-) If you can't afford it all right now, do the payment plan thing.
I hope that helps you, then again, it might just have wrapped your head around the proverbial light pole.
God Bless!Robin Monks said:I do hope that at the very least Logos will keep the intro pricing up until the cross-grade can launch; otherwise we'll have no way to compare pricing. I'm also curious if I upgrade to a lower base package if the % discount on the higher ones vanishes (eg, if I pay more to upgrade to broze then to silver than if I went directly to silver).
So, right now I can upgrade to Starter for $48, and Bronze for $226. If I get Starter today can I buy Bronze for $178 tomorrow, or will the discount on Bronze be less so the total would be more than the $228 I'd have paid for it initially?
Thanks!
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John Fidel said:
the discounts did change
If I get Starter today can I buy Bronze for $178 tomorrow, or will the discount on Bronze be less so the total would be more than the $228 I'd have paid for it initially?
John did they change in similar % like this--or will Robins (above example) be penalized?
Regards, SteveF
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In my experience, upgrading in L4 from Scholar's to Silver to Platinum, I paid a bit more for it because I did it in steps like that. I don't remember the exact amount, but I recall that it was more than I expected. (I am guessing it cost me $100 more, or so, because I upgraded this way.) Buy the most expensive package you can afford, for the best discount.
"It seems our problems solve themselves when we look beyond us to those truly in hell." - Beyond Our Suffering - AILD
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Tom Geswein said:
In my experience, upgrading in L4 from Scholar's to Silver to Platinum, I paid a bit more for it because I did it in steps like that. I don't remember the exact amount, but I recall that it was more than I expected. (I am guessing it cost me $100 more, or so, because I upgraded this way.) Buy the most expensive package you can afford, for the best discount.
This is true when the upgrades are spaced out far enough. If you upgrade within the 30 day return period, you'll get full credit for the previous purchase. Customer support was great when I called though and gave me full credit even though it had been a few months since my original purchase.
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Great, very helpful, satisfying post, we love logos, thank you for all the hard work you are doing to make our bible study easier and more fun.
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Thanks for the answers, folks!
One more question to those who've made the jump to 5: will it overwrite 4 or install along side of it, and will it use existing resources I downloaded or re-download my entire library?
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Robin Monks said:
One more question to those who've made the jump to 5: will it overwrite 4 or install along side of it, and will it use existing resources I downloaded or re-download my entire library?
5 overwrites 4 and uses the same resources. However, there is still a big download because many resources were rebuilt for L5.
Prov. 15:23
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Bob,
I join my brothers in Christ in thanking you for your honest and complete response to our questions. I only gained more respect for you and for the entire Logos team. Even though we can't truly afford it right now, because of you answer I'm tempted to just go ahead anyway and upgrade to Diamond!! :-)
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Rick King said:
Here's a helpful hint in your decision making progress. When they give you a price for a resource, cut that price in half. You know that they are going to put that on sale at some point. You just have to be patient and wait for it. If you can add up a number that comes pretty close to equating to the price they are asking about 100 dollars short, then you should probably just do it.
Using this method I ended with with in the neighborhood of $1200 of things I actually wanted for $420; so I grabbed the Silver package. Thanks for the tip
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I completed my upgrade yesterday as planned and am quite happy with the new interface and the resources I received (Silver to Silver). Now I am making my plans to move on up to Gold.
Chris
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Christopher Sanchez said:
I completed my upgrade yesterday as planned and am quite happy with the new interface and the resources I received (Silver to Silver). Now I am making my plans to move on up to Gold.
I couldn't find the same value in Gold; but, maybe there'll be some Black Friday/Christmas/March special that'll make it unbearably attractive. I was using the Scholar’s Library before moving to Silver (which is presently downloading). I was able to originally get the Lender's Library at a significant discount thanks in part to finding some Libronix CDs in a discount software bin at a local retailer :P, then I jumped to Lender's Library during a massive sale. So far Logos has been one of the best investments I've made.
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Hi Bob,
Pre-pubs coming due at the same time has been a struggle for me especially during August and I now see there is one bunch load coming up in the next couple of weeks. It is frustrating to want resources that help deepen my study and understanding of the scriptures, but at the same time being able to afford it all at the same time. Logos 4 has been a tremendous tool of which I have no doubt. But I have spent close to 5k in less than a year and then to be shocked with a brand new version which has changed some of the resources in the same platinum level. I am not sure that I understand the mechanics of this but I am torn because God has called to be good stewards of His manifold grace. I am not sure that there is an easy answer to this dilemma of releasing pre-pubs at the same time as well as people who have just bought Logos 4 in the past six months.
However, I am perplexed about this Logos 5 (new to you) includes in its pricing for my account NAC as new to me while I already own most of the resources in that set (37 of 40). I am not sure how the online discount calculator is configuring resources that I already own. I don't know the configurations of this tool which takes all that stuff into consideration or does it see me not owning the 40 volume set (as opposed to having paid the 37 vol set and just lacking the three newer volumes added to this configuration). This leaves me in quite a quandry. I am not sure the sales people have an adequate answer to this issue.
Please apprise.
In Christ Alone and for His Glory
Naveen
Colossians 3:16
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Hi Bob,
I just checked on my upgrade discount calculator and it shows that Believers Church Bible Commentary (24 vols) is new to me while I already own this particular set and shows up in my library. I really don't have the time to go through every set and every volume I have to see if that has been configured into the discount to come up with a price for me in order for me to upgrade either to Platinum, or Diamond or Portfolio. Is the tool working properly and if it is, then the page is not posting that correctly. I am quite frustrated with this as you can see. An unjust scale is an abomination to the Lord. Scripture says that we should rather choose to be defrauded than to defraud someone knowingly or unwittingly. I am not giving up on Logos nor on your team. I want to you do what is right and that the information that is given is done right. Provide all things honest in the sight of all men is the admonition of the Scriptures.
In Christ Alone and for His Glory
Naveen
Psalm 119:9-11
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Did you buy the upgrade volumes? If not, you only have 19 volumes and the calculator is taking those 5 volumes into consideration.Naveen Balakrishnan said:Hi Bob,
I just checked on my upgrade discount calculator and it shows that Believers Church Bible Commentary (24 vols) is new to me while I already own this particular set and shows up in my library.
EDIT: I bought the Believer's Bible Commentary upgrade last year and just checked the upgrade calculator and it did not show "New to Me" since I have the complete set. So on my end, the scales have been 100% correct. For my possible upgrade within the next week or so I have done a very thorough check and the calculator was very accurate.0
