References in Exegetical Summaries in the L5 Gold and up packages link to titles but not pages
I took the plunge and upgraded my L4 Platinum to L5 Platinum.
One of resources that justified the expense in my mind is the Exegetical Summaries that is available for L5 Gold and up
(http://www.logos.com/product/4294/exegetical-summaries-series).
I'm very disappointed to find out that this resource does not link to specific pages in its references to commentaries.
It only links to title pages.
This is a big enough problem for me that I am strongly considering asking for a refund on my upgrade and waiting for the crossgrade only option to be released.
I wish Logos would be more upfront and specific on their product descriptions to indicate exactly how the linking for each resource will work.
The product page for this resources states, "All references to commentaries and lexicons are linked to the titles in your digital library, and Scripture references are linked to Greek and Hebrew texts and English translations."
I guess it is my fault that I assumed that the references would be linked to the appropriate pages in each commentary and lexicon.
Either way, pretty disappointing!
Comments
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That is a huge hole, one that I imagine Logos will address and fix. Question is, how long will it take?
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Another problem is that its lexical references are to the old BAGD instead of the new BDAG.
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I bought this a month ago and someone recommended it to. I don't like this particular series, maybe that's because I don't know how to use it?
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Russ Quinn said:
I'm very disappointed to find out that this resource does not link to specific pages in its references to commentaries.
Sorry for any inconvenience, and thanks for the report. I'll take a look at this issue first thing on Monday.
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Jannie van Niekerk said:Russ Quinn said:
I'm very disappointed to find out that this resource does not link to specific pages in its references to commentaries.
Sorry for any inconvenience, and thanks for the report. I'll take a look at this issue first thing on Monday.
Do you have an update on this, Jannie? It would help me in deciding whether to upgrade to L5 Platinum.
Thanks.
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
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Russ Quinn said:
I'm very disappointed to find out that this resource does not link to specific pages in its references to commentaries.
Logos' normal practice is to link to page numbers when the page number is in the original resource. It would be an enormous amount of work for someone to go through and tag everything. Part of the problem is that when Logos opens a link without a page number, it goes to the beginning of that resource. It would make more sense (at least in this case) to open the resource to the same reference that Exegetical Summaries is open to. That's what happens if I open a Bible from the library or command bar. If an override could be created so that also happened from exegetical summaries, no tagging would be needed.
But more of a problem is that many of the resources aren't linked at all, because Exegetical Summaries is a fairly old resource. Just looking at the Ephesians volume, it's missing links to all of the following volumes, which are all available in Logos:
- Alford, Henry. “Ephesians”. In vol 3 of The Greek Testament. 1874. Revised by Everett F. Harrison. Chicago: Moody Press, 1958.
- Barnes, Albert. Notes on the New Testament. Nd. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker, 1972.
- Bauer, Walter. A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature. Translated and adapted from the 5th ed., 1958 by William F. Arndt and F. Wilbur Gingrich. 2d English ed. revised and augmented by F. Wilbur Gingrich and Frederick W. Danker. Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979.
- Calvin, John. Calvin’s Commentaries, vol. 12 Nd. Reprint. Wilmington, Delaware: Associated Publishers and Authors, Nd.
- Candlish, James S. The Epistle of Paul to the Ephesians. Edinburgh: T. & T. Clark, 1901.
- Thompson, G. H. P. The Letters of Paul to the Ephesians to the Colossians and to Philemon. The Cambridge Bible Commentary. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 1967.
- Delitzsch, Franz. Biblical Commentary on the Psalms, vol. 2. Translated from the German 2nd edition by Francis Bolton. Biblical Commentary on the Old Testament by C. F. Keil and F. Delitzsch. Nd. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1959.
- Brown, Colin, ed. The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology. Translated, with additions and revisions, from Theologisches Begriffslexikon zum Neuen Testament, edited by Lothar Coenen, Erich Beyreuther, and Hans Bietenhard. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1975.
- Wood, A. Skevington. “Ephesians”. In vol. 11 of The Expositor’s Bible Commentary, edited by Frank E. Gabelein. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1978.
- Salmond, S. D. F. “The Epistle to the Ephesians,” In vol. 3 of The Expositor’s Greek Testament, edited by W. Robertson Nicoll. Nd. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1970.
- Field, Frederick. Notes on the Translation of the New Testament. Cambridge: University Press, 1899.
- Hodge, Charles. A Commentary on the Epistle to the Ephesians. 1856. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1950.
- Bromiley, Geoffrey W., ed. The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia. 4 vols. Fully revised. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1979.
- Kidner, Derek. Psalms 1–72. An Introduction and Commentary on Books 1 and 2 of the Psalms. The Tyndale Old Testament Commentaries. Downers Grove, Ill.: Inter-Varsity, 1973.
- Leupold, H. C. Exposition of the Psalms. Columbus, Ohio: Wartburg, 1959.
- Lightfoot, J. B. Notes on the Epistles of St. Paul. 1895. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1957.
- Maclaren, Alexander. “The Psalms”. In vol. 3 of The Expositor’s Bible, edited by W. Robertson Nicoll. 1903. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker, 1982.
- Spurgeon, C. H. The Treasury of David. 6 vols. Nd. Reprint. London and Edinburgh: Marshall, Morgan and Scott, 1950.
- Stott, John R. W. God’s New Society: The Message of Ephesians. Downers Grove, Ill.: Inter-Varsity, 1979.
- Foulkes, Francis. The Epistle of Paul to the Ephesians. The Tyndale New Testament Commentaries. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1956.
Jannie van Niekerk said:I'll take a look at this issue first thing on Monday.
On a much more important note, is Logos ever going to re-release BAGD? You could make a lot of money from it, as so many resources link to it, it's worth having as a reference, even though it's been replaced.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Mark Barnes said:
On a much more important note, is Logos ever going to re-release BAGD? You could make a lot of money from it, as so many resources link to it, it's worth having as a reference, even though it's been replaced.
[Y][Y]
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My experience also includes Logos 5 crashing when clicking on many of the links in the series. I gave up on using them, because I can never predict when it will abort abruptly.
I would submit logs, but since the Logos tool does not provide a point and click way of submitting logs, as for instance OS/X itself produces for operating system problems, I don't have the time/patience to file them all.
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Jannie van Niekerk said:Russ Quinn said:
I'm very disappointed to find out that this resource does not link to specific pages in its references to commentaries.
Sorry for any inconvenience, and thanks for the report. I'll take a look at this issue first thing on Monday.
Please get back with us. Some tagging will make this set more useful. Thanks.
http://www.TrinityExamined.com
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Mark Barnes said:
many of the resources aren't linked at all, because Exegetical Summaries is a fairly old resource
It was updated less than a month ago. And they didn't fix this??
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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I'm a bit shocked that these links are virtually broken. Based on the practical uses for this resource the direct linking is key. The 1st edition print versions of this set are actually only about 14 years old so they are not old.
Mark brought in a great point, I hope Logos re-releases the BAGD since so many resources cite and link to it. I have the BDAG but I'd get the BAGD for sure.
Logos 5, Windows & Android perfect together....
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fgh said:Mark Barnes said:
many of the resources aren't linked at all, because Exegetical Summaries is a fairly old resource
It was updated less than a month ago. And they didn't fix this??
The general policy is that they don't update the links in old resources. References to existing Logos products should be complete when the resource is released, but resources that are released later don't get added back in.
There are exceptions for important resources like BDAG and AYBD, but that's the general policy.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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I agree it would be MUCH more useful to have tagging done in Exegetical Summaries. I would even pay for an 'upgrade' to see this done. However, with Logos promoting their Bible Guides, I could see why they would not be too excited about upgrading Exegetical Summaries as it is a related competing product.
Regardless, I find Exegetical Summaries useful enough as it is. It's a shame though about this lacking feature and hope I am wrong about getting the tagging done.
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Mark Barnes said:Russ Quinn said:
I'm very disappointed to find out that this resource does not link to specific pages in its references to commentaries.
Logos' normal practice is to link to page numbers when the page number is in the original resource. It would be an enormous amount of work for someone to go through and tag everything. Part of the problem is that when Logos opens a link without a page number, it goes to the beginning of that resource. It would make more sense (at least in this case) to open the resource to the same reference that Exegetical Summaries is open to. That's what happens if I open a Bible from the library or command bar. If an override could be created so that also happened from exegetical summaries, no tagging would be needed.
But more of a problem is that many of the resources aren't linked at all, because Exegetical Summaries is a fairly old resource. Just looking at the Ephesians volume, it's missing links to all of the following volumes, which are all available in Logos:
- Alford, Henry. “Ephesians”. In vol 3 of The Greek Testament. 1874. Revised by Everett F. Harrison. Chicago: Moody Press, 1958.
- Barnes, Albert. Notes on the New Testament. Nd. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker, 1972.
- Bauer, Walter. A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature. Translated and adapted from the 5th ed., 1958 by William F. Arndt and F. Wilbur Gingrich. 2d English ed. revised and augmented by F. Wilbur Gingrich and Frederick W. Danker. Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979.
- Calvin, John. Calvin’s Commentaries, vol. 12 Nd. Reprint. Wilmington, Delaware: Associated Publishers and Authors, Nd.
- Candlish, James S. The Epistle of Paul to the Ephesians. Edinburgh: T. & T. Clark, 1901.
- Thompson, G. H. P. The Letters of Paul to the Ephesians to the Colossians and to Philemon. The Cambridge Bible Commentary. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 1967.
- Delitzsch, Franz. Biblical Commentary on the Psalms, vol. 2. Translated from the German 2nd edition by Francis Bolton. Biblical Commentary on the Old Testament by C. F. Keil and F. Delitzsch. Nd. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1959.
- Brown, Colin, ed. The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology. Translated, with additions and revisions, from Theologisches Begriffslexikon zum Neuen Testament, edited by Lothar Coenen, Erich Beyreuther, and Hans Bietenhard. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1975.
- Wood, A. Skevington. “Ephesians”. In vol. 11 of The Expositor’s Bible Commentary, edited by Frank E. Gabelein. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1978.
- Salmond, S. D. F. “The Epistle to the Ephesians,” In vol. 3 of The Expositor’s Greek Testament, edited by W. Robertson Nicoll. Nd. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1970.
- Field, Frederick. Notes on the Translation of the New Testament. Cambridge: University Press, 1899.
- Hodge, Charles. A Commentary on the Epistle to the Ephesians. 1856. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1950.
- Bromiley, Geoffrey W., ed. The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia. 4 vols. Fully revised. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1979.
- Kidner, Derek. Psalms 1–72. An Introduction and Commentary on Books 1 and 2 of the Psalms. The Tyndale Old Testament Commentaries. Downers Grove, Ill.: Inter-Varsity, 1973.
- Leupold, H. C. Exposition of the Psalms. Columbus, Ohio: Wartburg, 1959.
- Lightfoot, J. B. Notes on the Epistles of St. Paul. 1895. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Zondervan, 1957.
- Maclaren, Alexander. “The Psalms”. In vol. 3 of The Expositor’s Bible, edited by W. Robertson Nicoll. 1903. Reprint. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker, 1982.
- Spurgeon, C. H. The Treasury of David. 6 vols. Nd. Reprint. London and Edinburgh: Marshall, Morgan and Scott, 1950.
- Stott, John R. W. God’s New Society: The Message of Ephesians. Downers Grove, Ill.: Inter-Varsity, 1979.
- Foulkes, Francis. The Epistle of Paul to the Ephesians. The Tyndale New Testament Commentaries. Grand Rapids, Mich.: Eerdmans, 1956.
Jannie van Niekerk said:I'll take a look at this issue first thing on Monday.
On a much more important note, is Logos ever going to re-release BAGD? You could make a lot of money from it, as so many resources link to it, it's worth having as a reference, even though it's been replaced.
Peace to all! *smile* Responding to an old, old, old post ...
A repeat request to Logos ... please! please! please!
I have an extensive library -- quite up-to-date et.cetera..... However, so many of my resources have a BAGD tag that certainly does NOT plug me into my BDAG ....
I agree with Mark ............. Please re-release BAGD? a win-win situation until all your tagging is brought up to date....
Philippians 4: 4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, Rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand..........
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[Y]
I agree. I was just using Exegetical Summaries the other day wondering if there was any news on this. Even if I have to buy an upgrade, having this resource appropriately tagged would make it a killer resource and well worth it.
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[Y]
This deserves another bump. Some of the newer Exegetical Summaries were released from Pre-Pub earlier this year, and I was extremely disappointed that they were tagged just as badly as the other books in the series.
This is one of my most commonly-used resources in Logos, and it's a shame that they haven't been tagged properly.
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I think I may be the exception, but I don't care if all the links get updated. The general information is there and one ought to be able to navigate from the title page of a resource to the desired page that contains the information one seeks.
I love having my library in a digital format, but I have noticed that while it is convenient at the same time it makes one lazy. If it takes more than one or two clicks to do something we feel like we are being cheated.
I remind myself every day, what a blessing it is to have the resources that Logos offers. It does save me time and effort from having to go and pull books off the ole library shelves.
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Thanks for your post, Kenneth! *smile*
Having very carefully thought through what you said, I must conclude that you are "absolutely correct"!!!
Where does "luxury" end and meeting real need with proper assistance begin? So easy to get spoiled, eh??? *smile*
Psalm 29:11
Philippians 4: 4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, Rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand..........
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Kenneth Neighoff said:
I think I may be the exception, but I don't care if all the links get updated. The general information is there and one ought to be able to navigate from the title page of a resource to the desired page that contains the information one seeks.
Yes, but for some of us Logos Bible Software is a large expense. We pay this amount because we expect it to work as promised. The product description says "All references to commentaries and lexicons are linked to the titles in your digital library, and Scripture references are linked to Greek and Hebrew texts and English translations," and I think that Logos ought to honor their pledge to the best of their ability.
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Looks like this is a good example of where the suggested crowd-sourcing of links would come in handy!
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elnwood said:
Yes, but for some of us Logos Bible Software is a large expense. We pay this amount because we expect it to work as promised. The product description says "All references to commentaries and lexicons are linked to the titles in your digital library, and Scripture references are linked to Greek and Hebrew texts and English translations," and I think that Logos ought to honor their pledge to the best of their ability.
As I said before, I don't think Logos will every link to specific pages in these commentaries, when the original authors didn't consider that was necessary in the paper version. That said, I think there is a problem as most of the links I click on don't link to other resources in my library, they just show bibliographic information (I'm testing with the Mark 1-8 volume). The only one I've found that links to a specific resource is PNTC. I think that's a bug, either in Logos, or in the resource, and I'm going to create a bug report to find out.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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elnwood said:Kenneth Neighoff said:
I think I may be the exception, but I don't care if all the links get updated. The general information is there and one ought to be able to navigate from the title page of a resource to the desired page that contains the information one seeks.
Yes, but for some of us Logos Bible Software is a large expense. We pay this amount because we expect it to work as promised. The product description says "All references to commentaries and lexicons are linked to the titles in your digital library, and Scripture references are linked to Greek and Hebrew texts and English translations," and I think that Logos ought to honor their pledge to the best of their ability.
Just so you know. I do have a lot invested in Logos. My library has close to 13,000 resources.
I don't see any dishonesty when the description says, that things are tagged to titles in my library. To me this means it takes me to the right book, It says nothing about the exact spot in question.
As others have points out. If the original source, like, BAGD is referenced, I should know as a user that this is the 2nd edition of the Greek Lexicon and the 3rd edition known BDAG. I don't expect them to link a 2nd edition reference to the 3rd edition that is in my library. For me personally, if I need to go to the 2nd edition and pull it off the shelf and consult it. Or I look it up in the 3rd edition, by finding the word that is under study.
Sometimes we are just to quick to point out the speck in someone's eye, while we ignore the log in our own.
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Kenneth Neighoff said:
I don't see any dishonesty when the description says, that things are tagged to titles in my library. To me this means it takes me to the right book, It says nothing about the exact spot in question.
As others have points out. If the original source, like, BAGD is referenced, I should know as a user that this is the 2nd edition of the Greek Lexicon and the 3rd edition known BDAG. I don't expect them to link a 2nd edition reference to the 3rd edition that is in my library. For me personally, if I need to go to the 2nd edition and pull it off the shelf and consult it. Or I look it up in the 3rd edition, by finding the word that is under study.
The description says "ALL references."
You wrote: "To me this means it takes me to the right book." I agree. Opening to the correct page is nice, but it's not necessary. What I care most is that it opens the correct resource, and then I can simply type the verse reference. But right now, it's even not doing that.
I have the Thessalonians exegetical summary right now. Here are the resources are not linked: Alf, BAGD, EBC, EGT, Fn, Hb, HNTC, My, NIC. All of them are available in Logos, and bibliographic information come up, but they are not linked at all. None of the Bible translation resources are linked either: GNT, KJV, NAB, NASB, NEB, NIV, NJB, RSV, TEV. Again, I don't expect it to open to correct verse (although that would be nice), but I do expect it to open.
I don't expect the BAGD references to open BDAG. I do expect, though, that if you have BAGD (as some users do), that it would open it. It's currently not linked at all now.
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In addition to what I wrote above, the newest Exegetical Summary is actually LESS functional than the old ones!
Mark 1-8 was released on from Pre-Pub on March 28, 2013. I am disappointed to report that NONE of the links are working in this one!
It looks like it is hyperlinked, throughout, but when you click on the name of the title, it doesn't go there. Instead, it just gives you an option to copy the text!
If you also have Mark 1-8 Exegetical Summary, give it a try and let me know how it works for you.
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elnwood said:
Mark 1-8 was released on from Pre-Pub on March 28, 2013. I am disappointed to report that NONE of the links are working in this one!
It looks like it is hyperlinked, throughout, but when you click on the name of the title, it doesn't go there. Instead, it just gives you an option to copy the text!
See my post above: http://community.logos.com/forums/p/58457/510803.aspx#510803
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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elnwood said:
I don't expect it to open to correct verse (although that would be nice), but I do expect it to open.
Actually the bibles and commentaries would open to the correct page. In Exegetical Summary of Mark 1-8, the PNTC links work, and when I click the two or three times it takes to get beyond the bibliographic info, it will open the pillar commentary right to the bible verse treatment. Unfortunately, Pillar's seems to be the only one where they got it right in this resource.
I concur this is how all commentary resources and bible versions available in Logos should be working in this resource.
elnwood said:I don't expect the BAGD references to open BDAG. I do expect, though, that if you have BAGD (as some users do), that it would open it. It's currently not linked at all now.
You need to differentiate between citing BAGD as supporting one reading (not linked) and the 'lexicon' part discussion of the greek words: along with a LN domain, it gives a page number for BAGD which open the preview window for this resoure, thus I expect it to work for those who are lucky enough to have BAGD.
EDIT: it seems, this is an improvement (at least for these lucky few) in the Mar 1-8 volume, since the three on the Cor-Letters I looked at in a post below seem to miss the page links for BAGD. But then again, a double click on the Greek word under discussion will open your favorite Greek lexicon, which would be probably BDAG for the much larger number of those who a lucky owners of it - not a link to where the author wants to send you, but you arrive where most of you want to get to. /EDIT
Have joy in the Lord!
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Is it possible to make a series of this set? I am not seeing the series button.
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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Lynden Williams said:
Is it possible to make a series of this set? I am not seeing the series button.
Lynden,
they are meta-tagged as series "exegetical summaries" . I don't know which button you are missing, but the serialization works. I just set a bible to link with the 1 Cor 1 - 9 title of the series. When I scrolled the bible to 1 Cor 10, Logos seamlessly replaced with the follow-up volume, same happened when I scrolled on to 2 Corinthians.
Hope this helps,
Mick
Have joy in the Lord!
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Trying to navigate to Mark, but I did not have it.
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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I made a Logos User Voice request to have the tagging fixed in the Exegetical Summaries. Please vote for it.
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