Big Project... Compendium of Logos Packages from its Inception to present... Could use another set o
RWS and I have been working on this for the last week or so. He created the original document, but since then we've added the L1.6-L3 packages and tried to put them in a format where it is easy to compare the contents of the different packages from past to present.
However we've made it about as far as we can on our own, and need some additional eyes, and people with more experience with the Logos catalog to help us fine tune it.
There are some products that are the same, but are now listed under a different name. 100 midi hymns for instance has had three different names as near as we can tell. So for those of you who have been around a little bit longer than we have, if you wouldn't mind glancing over the document and making sure we didn't inadvertently duplicate data points it would be much appreciated!
Post back here anything you find that is inaccurate and we'll fix it as we have time.
The plan is to one day include all of the catholic/verbum packages as well, though we aren't there yet. Still getting the standard Logos resources compiled.
Anyway without further ado:
Here it is 
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Comments
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on the Omnibus page, there was a copying error in the L3 columns due to some merged cells... Fixing that now.
Fixed
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Wow, this is very impressive. Thanks for all the work, you guys. I've had Logos since before Logos 1.0 (I think it was 0.9 when Bob first gave me a copy of it to beta test when we were both still working for Microsoft) but I can't for the life of me remember what resources were in it back then and I've long ago ditched the disks.
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I admire your work, however your columns need to be a little more clear about which base package you are describing because there was movement within the categories you have listed.
For example in May 2004 I bought Scholars Library QB in May 2006 I upgraded to Scholars Library OC which had different resources but was still an L3 Scholars Library. In Nov 2009 I upgraded again from Scholars Library OC to Scholars Library LE (still an "L3 Scholars Library") so I owned 3 different "L3 Scholars Libraries"
Later I upgraded from "Scholars Library" to "Scholars Library: Silver" - and owned 3 different base packages with this same label (LE, KF, JG). As I recall, LE was an "L3 Scholars Silver" and KF, JG were both "L4 Scholars Silver"
This is a long explanation, but is meant to illustrate that your columns need to specify WHICH edition under the package color.
I hope this is not discouraging!! what you are doing is valuable as people buy and sell old base packages.
EDIT: I notice you have 2 different columns for Scholars and Scholars QB on the Series X (2.6) tab. This is the granularity I am suggesting for the other tabs.
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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Unless otherwise specified, the version is the original one that shipped. Were working on a timeline feature with links to the various package versions, and so forth. We likely won't include ALLLLL of that data in the spreadsheet... but we'll make it findable.David Thomas said:I admire your work, however your columns need to be a little more clear about which base package you are describing because there was movement within the categories you have listed.
For example in May 2004 I bought Scholars Library QB in May 2006 I upgraded to Scholars Library OC which had different resources but was still an L3 Scholars Library. In Nov 20098 I upgraded again from Scholars Library OC to Scholars Library LE (still an "L3 Scholars Library") so I owned 3 different "L3 Scholars Libraries"
Later I upgraded from "Scholars Library" to "Scholars Library: Silver" - and owned 3 different base packages with this same label (LE, KF, JG). As I recall, LE was an "L3 Scholars Silver" and KF, JG were both "L4 Scholars Silver"
This is a long explanation, but is meant to illustrate that your columns need to specify WHICH edition under the package color.
I hope this is not discouraging!! what you are doing is valuable as people buy and sell old base packages.
Thanks Rosie! it still needs a fair bit of work, but hopefully it makes some of the obscure information Re what was in which package a little less obscure.Rosie Perera said:Wow, this is very impressive. Thanks for all the work, you guys. I've had Logos since before Logos 1.0 (I think it was 0.9 when Bob first gave me a copy of it to beta test when we were both still working for Microsoft) but I can't for the life of me remember what resources were in it back then and I've long ago ditched the disks.
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Wow.
I've glanced over it, and would only have two suggestions. (1) It would be helpful to have a list of sources for the document, if they're online (I'm presuming they were internet archive pages). (2) Logos sometimes changed its base packages mid-version, so there were at least two different L4 Gold packages, for example. Each package has a two-letter identifier after it to indicate exactly which package it is.
The current range of packages are IH which were released when L5 was launched. L4 was launched with LE, but later versions of L4 came with KF, or JG, which were slightly different. L3 came with OC or ND, L2 with QB and L1 with RA. If you wanted to be totally comprehensive, you might want to make a note of these differences if you're able. The changes to the base packages during L4 are quite well documented on the forums, but it might be harder to find out the differences between OC and ND.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Thanks for the reply!Mark Barnes said:Wow.
I've glanced over it, and would only have two suggestions. (1) It would be helpful to have a list of sources for the document, if they're online (I'm presuming they were internet archive pages). (2) Logos sometimes changed its base packages mid-version, so there were at least two different L4 Gold packages, for example. Each package has a two-letter identifier after it to indicate exactly which package it is.
The current range of packages are IH which were released when L5 was launched. L4 was launched with LE, but later versions of L4 came with KF, or JG, which were slightly different. L3 came with OC or ND, L2 with QB and L1 with RA. If you wanted to be totally comprehensive, you might want to make a note of these differences if you're able. The changes to the base packages during L4 are quite well documented on the forums, but it might be harder to find out the differences between OC and ND.
1) if you check the "intro" page, our sources are listed there.
2) we are creating a timeline page with links to the location of the incremental changes to the individual packages... Too much work to include an additional 30-40,000 cells...(1020 cells per package just on the omnibus page...)Thanks for checking it out, and thanks for the advice so far guys; keep it coming
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Some of the initial data came from the wiki list of discontinued packages. Since then we have been going through old posts, old versions of the website (via the wayback machine) to try to identify when the package revisions were made and the content of those revisions.
Those notes and references are in the Timeline.
There are still some releases that haven't been nailed down adequately, but we'll try to make sure the charts reflect the proper revisions.
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Good work on the timeline by the wayRandy W. Sims (Shayne) said:Some of the initial data came from the wiki list of discontinued packages. Since then we have been going through old posts, old versions of the website (via the wayback machine) to try to identify when the package revisions were made and the content of those revisions.
Those notes and references are in the Timeline.
There are still some releases that haven't been nailed down adequately, but we'll try to make sure the charts reflect the proper revisions.
[Y] L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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abondservant said:
Good work on the timeline by the way
Thanks.
Good work on adding packages for 1.6, 2.0, Series X, 3.0, and creating the incredible Omnibus. [Y] [Y]
That's an incredible amount of work and all credit to you for putting it together.
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Randy W. Sims (Shayne) said:
Those notes and references are in the Timeline.
Thanks, I didn't see that earlier. Two minor suggestions for the quick reference charts page:
- I initially read the dates as ranges and quickly got confused! (e.g. I though 2009-11 meant 2009-2011). It might be clearer if the month could be written out (e.g. Nov. 2009).
- The brand "Libronix" was launched in September 2001: http://web.archive.org/web/20020211141226/http://www.libronix.com/page.asp?id=pr2001091001 - it was never called Libronix 1 or 2, though. What Phil called Libronix 1 is actually Logos Bible Software Series X, and Libronix 2 is actually Logos Bible Software Series X v2.0 and was launched in July 2003. At the time, Libronix was used to describe the underlying software (Libronix Digital Library System), but Bible packages were still marketed under the Logos brand name. Libronix 3 was then called "Logos Bible Software 3". It's confusing, because most users use L3 to refer to all three of these products, and use L1 and L2 to refer to LLS v1 and LLS v2.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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I applied your second point to the spreadsheet - instead of L1 its Logos 1.0, and L3 is now Logos 3.0 (etc).
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At the bottom of the Omnibus page I added in large red letters that each package is (as near as we can tell, and unless otherwise noted) the default package that was originally released.Mark Barnes said:Wow.
I've glanced over it, and would only have two suggestions. (1) It would be helpful to have a list of sources for the document, if they're online (I'm presuming they were internet archive pages). (2) Logos sometimes changed its base packages mid-version, so there were at least two different L4 Gold packages, for example. Each package has a two-letter identifier after it to indicate exactly which package it is.
The current range of packages are IH which were released when L5 was launched. L4 was launched with LE, but later versions of L4 came with KF, or JG, which were slightly different. L3 came with OC or ND, L2 with QB and L1 with RA. If you wanted to be totally comprehensive, you might want to make a note of these differences if you're able. The changes to the base packages during L4 are quite well documented on the forums, but it might be harder to find out the differences between OC and ND.
Will add that text to the Intro page as well.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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Mark Barnes said:
I initially read the dates as ranges and quickly got confused! (e.g. I though 2009-11 meant 2009-2011). It might be clearer if the month could be written out (e.g. Nov. 2009).
It's habit to write dates in that format. It's a format that will sort chronologically. How about a compromise, year first: 2001 Nov? It seems more helpful to visually parse the years first in a timeline.
Mark Barnes said:The brand "Libronix" was launched in September 2001: http://web.archive.org/web/20020211141226/http://www.libronix.com/page.asp?id=pr2001091001 - it was never called Libronix 1 or 2, though. What Phil called Libronix 1 is actually Logos Bible Software Series X, and Libronix 2 is actually Logos Bible Software Series X v2.0 and was launched in July 2003. At the time, Libronix was used to describe the underlying software (Libronix Digital Library System), but Bible packages were still marketed under the Logos brand name. Libronix 3 was then called "Logos Bible Software 3". It's confusing, because most users use L3 to refer to all three of these products, and use L1 and L2 to refer to LLS v1 and LLS v2.
I've updated the chart to reflect your corrections. There are a few other references that I still need to change.
Thank you for clarifying that and for the references.
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anyone else see anything that needs finessed?
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Hey Guys! *smile* Your intensive labours are incredibly wonderful!
I'm truly amazed and impressed; and I know what you do will be helpful to me and others in the future.
I don't really have the "right" to say "Thank You in behalf of the Logos Forums Community!!!"
However, that's what I'm saying! *smile*
Psalm 29:11
Philippians 4: 4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, Rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand..........
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There is a huge amount of work done here. Thanks. Once question I have is there a way to follow your history of what packages you purchased in the early days? On-line profiles only go back so far. I had a Logos 2 package in the mid nineties but I don't remember which version.
Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God
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Bruce Dunning said:
There is a huge amount of work done here. Thanks. Once question I have is there a way to follow your history of what packages you purchased in the early days? On-line profiles only go back so far. I had a Logos 2 package in the mid nineties but I don't remember which version.
Hmm... you might need to call Customer Service? I suspect they would be able to see what products have been activated on your account
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Thanks for the kind words Bruce.Milford Charles Murray said:Hey Guys! *smile* Your intensive labours are incredibly wonderful!
I'm truly amazed and impressed; and I know what you do will be helpful to me and others in the future.
I don't really have the "right" to say "Thank You in behalf of the Logos Forums Community!!!"
However, that's what I'm saying! *smile*
Thanks much Milford!
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preparing to start on the catholic/verbum packages. The plan is to make a new page that lists ALL the packages - protestant and catholic. Then make a second that is like the omnibus but only lists the catholic resources.
Going to call one protestant, one catholic, then leave the all encompassing one labeled omnibus.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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Thanks for all your work on a comparison guide. In the Reformed Base Package tab, at line 150, you need another heading "Devotional and Spiritual Formation." Also, Taste and See, Alone with God, and Morning and Evening are in all the Reformed Base Packages.
Windows 8.1 64-bit, Core i5-3330, 8GB RAM
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Realizing that this is an old thread, I am surprised to see http://wiki.logos.com/Contents_of_Discontinued_Base_Packages doesn't include the Catholic collection as displayed at http://web.archive.org/web/19970202092412/http://www.logos.com/products/20prices.htm
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Dan Francis said:
Realizing that this is an old thread, I am surprised to see http://wiki.logos.com/Contents_of_Discontinued_Base_Packages doesn't include the Catholic collection as displayed at http://web.archive.org/web/19970202092412/http://www.logos.com/products/20prices.htm
I never knew there had been a Catholic collection before. Anyone can edit that wiki page. Wanna do it? I no longer have as much time for Logos forum and wiki activities as I used to.
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Sorry blonde moment.... I see in the database list it is on the todo and the page I referenced is labeled as out of date, please refers to the spreadsheet.
-Dan
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Timothy Brown said:
Thanks for all your work on a comparison guide. In the Reformed Base Package tab, at line 150, you need another heading "Devotional and Spiritual Formation." Also, Taste and See, Alone with God, and Morning and Evening are in all the Reformed Base Packages.
Thanks for catching that. I've made the corrections.
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Yes thank you! I used software to import all the items, and then double checked it... But - mistakes still sometimes slip through. Thanks for catching it!Randy W. Sims said:Timothy Brown said:Thanks for all your work on a comparison guide. In the Reformed Base Package tab, at line 150, you need another heading "Devotional and Spiritual Formation." Also, Taste and See, Alone with God, and Morning and Evening are in all the Reformed Base Packages.
Thanks for catching that. I've made the corrections.
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Anglican packages now have their own page and the data is up (except on the Omnibus page).
SDA and Lutheran, I probably won't get to you until after the weekend.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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I appreciate all the work and effort. I absolutely love the progress and have obtained the Reformed and looking at some future date obtaining Anglican. When I purchased the Reformed, I spoke with Chris about my interest and he definitely knew my interest by my wish lists. Any idea when a Pentecostal/Charismatic type of library base will be released or planned?
Rog
Rog {BlueBird}
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Your guess is as good as mine unfortunately. None of the people who worked on this project are associated with Logos in any way other than as customers
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This project has long outgrown the spreadsheet format. I'm wondering about converting it to a DB. Does anyone know of any easy free/cheap db hosting options? A relational db with 5-6 tables and some kind of web based front end designer or something simple. I've never done any web based development so I'm not sure what the best tools are and I don't want to invest a lot of time so I'm looking for something maximally simple. It would need interface for entering bulk data like a spreadsheet with combos and checks for the joined tables and a report for picking N arbitrary packages and displaying them side by side grouped by or filterable by category. I haven't completely made up my mind on doing this, but I'd like to explore the options. Any recommendations on how best to approach it?
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Even though it's grown huge, I'd still keep it as a spreadsheet. If it becomes a DB, it will be harder to get volunteers to keep updating it. In case you aren't able to carry on with this project indefinitely, I think it's best to leave it as a Google Doc where a team of volunteers can continue the work. What do you think?
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I completely agree. I wouldn't do anything that would prevent people from contributing or that would make it more difficult to contribute. And I want the Logos community to own it*. It wouldn't be half of what it is now without the contribution of others, esp Ken. I guess what I'm wanting is something just like google docs but with support for simple dbs and forms.
* It would probably be a good idea to create a Logos Community Google account and move the current spreadsheet there. Then share the login info with a number of regulars here.
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https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AhAl790TopkhdHNsTnRLY1A2RU9OY3pDNHdqTHVpQ3c&usp=sharing
Baptist BP has a page now, as does the P & C bp data.
Then to update the omnibus.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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Good work [Y]
L4 BS, L5 RB & Gold, L6 S & R Platinum, L7 Platinum, L8 Baptist Platinum, L9 Baptist Platinum, L10 Baptist Silver
2021 MacBook Pro M1 Pro 14" 16GB 512GB SSD, running MacOS Monterey iPad Mini 6, iPhone 11.0 -
Randy W. Sims said:
It would probably be a good idea to create a Logos Community Google account and move the current spreadsheet there.
I would much rather it be on Faithlife ... I get annoyed at people expecting me to have or open accounts on a plethora of sharing sites.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:Randy W. Sims said:
It would probably be a good idea to create a Logos Community Google account and move the current spreadsheet there.
I would much rather it be on Faithlife ... I get annoyed at people expecting me to have or open accounts on a plethora of sharing sites.
I would love to be able to host it on Faithlife, but it doesn't have a document type that would work for what we need and sharing the document itself for download wouldn't allow for easy collaboration. Microsoft OneDrive w/ Excel and Google Docs are the only two reasonable services I know of, and Google Docs is free. I'm very open to alternatives suggestions though as long as it's free and supports collaboration; I want it to belong to the community.
Hopefully, Logos will have their comparison engine updated soon to support comparisons across denominational package lines and then this project will become largely irrelevant except for recording older packages.
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I think prior to 1.6, Logos just sold individual resources on floppy disks. I know this was how I got started. Unfortunately I pitched all those 3.5 floppies years ago!
Perhaps some has keep these or remember what bibles were offered.
I ran Logos on a 286, with only a 20 MB hard drive, a gray scale monitor and Windows 2.0!
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Randy - I'm noticing some glitches that I didn't notice the last time I used google docs?
When I make changes to the omnibus page. Specifically copy and pasting new resources, it gives me an error saying to wait a few minutes and refresh the page.
Is the omnibus just getting to be too big to be useful? or is there something else going on?L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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This reminds me of the first computer my dad bought. He got it used and it came with these .zip files on them. Took him weeks to figure out how to open them!Keith Larson said:I ran Logos on a 286, with only a 20 MB hard drive, a gray scale monitor and Windows 2.0!
Our next one was a Tandy 386 with a 120mb hard drive. Still got that one.
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We really shouldn't be stretching it. It's not that big and only a few simple formulae. Let's kill those formulae and see how much that improves things.
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still happening. but infrequently.
We are using 85,000 cells on the omnibus. its by far the biggest spreadsheet I've ever worked on. According to google, the max number of cells is 400k, and the max number of characters is 1.02 million. The max number of colums is 256 (currently at 71).
Looks like there is a new version that is less buggy and no real maximum size (2 million cells). but you'll need to do the upgrade. I was able to upgrade it. Made you the owner once more. But you will need to give the other helpers edit privileges again.
Here is the updated link.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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EDIT: Removed. Taking irrelevant discussion offline.
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Chaplain BP is up on the omnibus, and I am done for the night. Maybe I'll do the Baptist BP tomorrow... We'll see. Reformed Diamond, the rest of the Anglican data and the P&C BPs still need to be listed also. If anyone else would like to help, there is a link in the document for Randy's email.
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Standard L6 base packages are now up.
No timeline on the rest. Logos made these available through google docs and I was able to basically copy and paste the data in.
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