Why go from Silver 5.0 to Silver 6.0 - Whats to be gained?

Are Sermons any easier to write if I am NOT diving into the useless datasets Logosians dreamed up?

I could just as easily switch to Chaplain''s Library - get a ton of new resources, and still have the same 6.0 goodness right?

How do I overcome the feeling of being duped if I switch to 6.0 - because its not simpler to use and more "common-every-day-user-not-a-developer" friendly as we all (ok maybe just I) hoped for?

Find more posts tagged with

Comments

Mark Smith

How do I overcome the feeling of being duped if I switch to 6.0 - because its not simpler to use and more "common-every-day-user-not-a-developer" friendly as we all (ok maybe just I) hoped for?

I think it was Zig Ziglar who said "You need to do a checkup from the neck up and eliminate stinkin' thinkin.' For someone who hasn't even used L6 you are highly opinionated about it, Josh.

Why not just 'bite the bullet', get either upgrade and take 30 days to evaluate it? You can get a full refund at that point. Is there a reason you hesitate to do this?

JoshInRI

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656495#Comment_656495

My reasons:

Money and a growing disappointment that the hoped for Logos update is on some very basic levels a total bust.

How about some dramatic new touch functionality for tablet users for example. That's an area noone - not even I - have broached as a subject yet.

I looked up Mr. Ziglar and liked this quote: "You can disagree without being disagreeable."

Here's hoping v 7.0 has a "Simple Group Bible Study Mode" for the users who do not need fancy little Word Study graphic bubbles, etc.

I mean does anyone watching that video with the woman (wearing blue/white top, gigantic hoop earrings in front of her laptop marveling at new 6.0 functionality) convincing? Its entitled "Delivering Insight".

I chuckled when I saw it (and not because its a woman either) but because the screen in front of her had some useless colored bubbles in a dataset I can't imagine a common user caring about.

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656503#Comment_656503

My reasons:

Money and a growing disappointment that the hoped for Logos update is on some very basic levels a total bust.

How about some dramatic functionality for tablet users for example...there is an area that no one not even I have broached as a subject yet.

Believe me I've heard you say this. What I want to know is what is wrong with free? As in 30 days free use if you decide to return one package?

No one here is going to convince you against your will to like Logos 6. So I suggest you either try it and if you don't like it return it, or stay in love with Logos 5 and use it until your operating system can support it no more. If you choose to do the later, then from then on log into the Logos 5 forum and don't further waste folks time here in Logos 6 when at that point you really don't want help.

You can put all your complaints and suggestions into an email to Bob@Logos.com. He'll read what you have to say.

You've got enough to go on seeing as how you don't need to take any risks. Logos will take them all.

Unix

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656503#Comment_656503

That'd be Noet desktop and I think it'll come out before v. 7.0:

Here's hoping v 7.0 has a "Bible Study Mode" for the users who do not need fancy little Word Study graphics, etc.

Mike Tourangeau

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656516#Comment_656516

With a program like L6 I'm confident the majority of users will be very very pleased. It's excellent!

abondservant

I could just as easily switch to Chaplain''s Library - get a ton of new resources, and still have the same 6.0 goodness right?

You don't get the same datasets... But yes. You get the free engine.

As to the concern over iOS/android, its on a completely different development track and the L6 engine has nothing to do with it.

Bill Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656503#Comment_656503

My reasons:

How about some dramatic new touch functionality for tablet users for example. That's an area noone - not even I - have broached as a subject yet.

Josh, if I have read your other posts correctly, you are like me in preferring Windows 8.1-based tablets. The problem is that we are in the minority. The reason Faithlife hasn't added touch functionality is because most people with tablets are using iPads or Android tablets. If the majority of people used Windows tablets, Faithlife would develop to them. I'm pretty certain that to do this would require an overhaul of the UI (user experience).

For what it's worth, Microsoft still hasn't come out with a touch-centric version of Microsoft office for Windows 8.1 tablets either. We're stuck using the desktop version.

Andy

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656503#Comment_656503

I chuckled when I saw it (and not because its a woman either) but because the screen in front of her had some useless colored bubbles in a dataset I can't imagine common users even caring about.

Hi Josh,

This is why you are at a disadvantage to those of us who have had opportunity to test out the new functionality.

From your description, I think that the 'coloured bubbles' are the new Psalms Explorer interactive tool (as per below),

This tool enables me to filter the Psalms by author (below I have filtered all of the Psalms authored by David),

And then by genre (below I have filtered Psalms which conform to the genre, 'Praise'),

I can then filter this down further (below, I have filtered Psalms in which the predominant theme is the love of God),

Personally, I think this is both cool and useful. This has already proved helpful in my own study and I intend on using this tool to plan a sermon series and Bible study (to run in 2015). (Additionally, I am thinking of ways in which the visual nature of this tool might prove helpful to my church.)

The lady in the video, if I remember correctly, is a worship leader/songwriter. Given that my wife also leads worship and writes songs, I can understand how useful this might be in the context of worship, songwriting and the Christian arts.

From my perspective, it is this kind of functionality which is the most exciting aspect of L6. This particular tool is the result of considerable (human) input and really distinguishes L6 from anything else out there (as far as I am aware). I honestly think that these 'coloured bubbles' and the like signal a really exciting step forward. I understand you find it alienating and perhaps indicative of style over substance. I honestly think, however, were you to get your hands on it, you may reconsider your view.

You may disagree, but I honestly think, were you to try it out, you would begin to see the real value in some of these new features.

Blessings

Rob

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656503#Comment_656503

"Delivering Insight".

Josh, did I read in one of your posts that you are studying to be a pastor?

JoshInRI

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656542#Comment_656542

Wow Andy...that's a really well thought out even useful real world explanation. I thank you for the time and effort it took to put together, Sir.

God bless you, your wife, and the woman in the video I mentioned.

JoshInRI

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656547#Comment_656547

Yes Mr. Perron, God willing I am called to be a bivocational Baptist assistant pastor one day - which is why making a wise selection with my limited funds is so important.

I acknowledge I have some growth to do in the discernment area and in designing even a simple post so its not remotely hurtful - but hopefully still delivers (pardon the pun) some insight.

I am thankful for the tool we all have in Logos (now Faithlife right?) but baffled (and perhaps a little publicly stunned) by the seeming lack of basic functionality of the new upgrade.

My vantage point is common person sitting in a group Bible study (or pew) using this great tool and being baffled and disappointed.

Andy

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656550#Comment_656550

Wow Andy...that's a really well thought out even useful real world explanation. I thank you for the time and effort it took to put together, Sir.

God bless you, your wife, and the woman in the video I questioned.

I am glad it was helpful, Josh.

There is a similar tool relating to Proverbs. It isn't as colourful (probably the reason it didn't make the promo video [:P]), but I think I will find it really, really useful. It does a similar thing inasmuch as it breaks Proverbs down by genre, topic and theme.

I would also check out Propositional Outlines (a visual filter which can be applied to any RI) which breaks down any NT passage in way which is very helpful to the preacher/student disposed towards arcing and the like. I have only begun to scratch the surface of this, but wanted to post a shot as I am guessing (from what I have read of your previous posts elsewhere) that this might appeal.

I can imagine the likes of Piper, MacArthur, Carson, Sproul, et al, being really excited about this kind of functionality (from a teaching perspective),

Blessings

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656555#Comment_656555

Yes Mr. Perron, God willing I am called to be a bivocational Baptist assistant pastor one day - which is why making a wise selection with my limited funds is so important.

Excited for you brother. Calling to be an assistant pastor is very specific.

I acknowledge I have some growth to do in the discernment area and in designing even a simple post so its not remotely hurtful - but hopefully still delivers (pardon the pun) some insight.

I am thankful for the tool we all have in Logos (now Faithlife right?) but baffled (and perhaps a little publicly stunned) by the seeming lack of basic functionality of the new upgrade.

Its actually still Logos for the software, only the company is called faithlife now.

My vantage point is common person sitting in a group Bible study (or pew) using this great tool and being baffled and disappointed.

I'm not sure why, or how. What basic functionality should it have that it lacks?

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656555#Comment_656555

I'm not sure how many users use a touch screen.

For all their resemblance to a ministry, faithlife is still a business, and if it made business sense to add a touch ui, they would have.

As to a bible study mode, I'm not sure what you're looking for... Open your notes to teach from, open your bible translation of choice, and off you go.

JoshInRI

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656557#Comment_656557

To abondservant from a fellow doulos (In Christ)

I will get back to you on that one...i do not see a leaning or a bent toward basic functionality from the videos. Datasets look challenging to me. IMHO the only immediately apparent useful upgrade is the oneto the maps, people, places, and things that has like an overlay from what used to be to the way it is now.

I am beginning to change my mind from some of the posts above however. Its possible to form an opinion from the plentiful official videos out now too both here and on youtube. The bubble thing - well I laughed at it initially but can see it could be useful now.

I wish they would feature a video of a guy in a group Bible study holding say an Android Tablet or a (gasp) a Windows Tablet and making use of Logos 6.0. Now that would be impressive and help sell a lot of upgrades!

p.s. Easier Default Bible Negotiation - Book - Chapter - Verse using single touch functionality on any Tablet would be nice for starters.

Yasmin Stephen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656555#Comment_656555

[Y] I'm pleased you've come to that realization.

I acknowledge I have some growth to do in the discernment area and in designing even a simple post so its not remotely hurtful - but hopefully still delivers (pardon the pun) some insight.

Paul C

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656566#Comment_656566

I wish they would feature a video of a guy in a group Bible study holding say an Android Tablet or a (gasp) a Windows Tablet and making use of Logos 6.0. Now that would be impressive and help sell a lot of upgrades!

Should this guy look a lot like you? Do you want to pose for the filming?[:P]

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656555#Comment_656555

I am thankful for the tool we all have in Logos (now Faithlife right?) but baffled (and perhaps a little publicly stunned) by the seeming lack of basic functionality of the new upgrade.

My vantage point is common person sitting in a group Bible study (or pew) using this great tool and being baffled and disappointed.

What are some examples of "missing basic functionality"? It is my experience that most posts on the forums regarding "missing basic functionality" are either lack of knowing where to find it or disagreements with the way it is implemented. L6 addresses nearly all the missing basic functionality that I was personally concerned about. I am now comfortable putting Logos in the hands of the average parishioner for small group Bible study. What do you see as hindering that?

mab

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656550#Comment_656550

Logos tries to make every upgrade set sufficiently resource rich to be a good deal.

For those of us who have been using Logos since L4, L6 is a third generation and finally delivers a level of performance that L4 and L5 should have been. That's enough to go for.

All the extra baubles aside, Logos is a very accessible library. I look mainly at the resources in a given package and so do most users.

I was blessed with someone's great kindness to pay for my L4 and then L5 packages and not a few great resources. Thankfully my rep gave me a great deal on L6 so I got some useful works to do my study.

I rely on Logos because I can't physically wrestle with lots of heavy books at my desk like I could back in the day.

Everyone is different. My pastor is still on L3.

FWIW, look more at resources. Most people seem to go up a step when they upgrade because there are references that they want.

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656566#Comment_656566

To abondservant from a fellow doulos (In Christ)

I will get back to you on that one...i do not see a leaning or a bent toward basic functionality from the videos. Datasets look challenging to me. IMHO the only immediately apparent useful upgrade is the oneto the maps, people, places, and things that has like an overlay from what used to be to the way it is now.

I am beginning to change my mind from some of the posts above however. Its possible to form an opinion from the plentiful official videos out now too both here and on youtube. The bubble thing - well I laughed at it initially but can see it could be useful now.

I wish they would feature a video of a guy in a group Bible study holding say an Android Tablet or a (gasp) a Windows Tablet and making use of Logos 6.0. Now that would be impressive and help sell a lot of upgrades!

p.s. Easier Default Bible Negotiation - Book - Chapter - Verse using single touch functionality on any Tablet would be nice for starters.

You might like this thread:

https://community.logos.com/forums/t/94276.aspx

It is one that goes over individuals favorite features. Everyone has a few that they consider gold, that others consider waste. But that thread is specifically for positive posts on new features.

As to the touch functionality - its not fast to bring up the book of the bible you're looking for. I know this even on my ipad. By the time I have brought up the book on my aging iPad 3, most of the time the professor is already reading the verse. However, speed is something they are consistently working on, and in the context of leading a bible study, or preaching from my ipad - I just make sure I have brought up those things I'll be using in advance.

Preparation seems to be the only work around.

Rob

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656555#Comment_656555

I acknowledge I have some growth to do in the discernment area and in designing even a simple post so its not remotely hurtful - but hopefully still delivers (pardon the pun) some insight.

Perhaps you could put a sticker on the 'Enter' key that says 'Pray First'

Paul C

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656579#Comment_656579

Perhaps you could put a sticker on the 'Enter' key that says 'Pray First'

Thanks. I needed that. It prompted a genuine LOL ![;)]

abondservant

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656579#Comment_656579

I acknowledge I have some growth to do in the discernment area and in designing even a simple post so its not remotely hurtful - but hopefully still delivers (pardon the pun) some insight.

Perhaps you could put a sticker on the 'Enter' key that says 'Pray First'

I know I never ever miss-speak to the detriment of another [:|][:^)]

(smilies added to indicate a lack of seriousness in the tone of that post)

GregW

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656566#Comment_656566

p.s. Easier Default Bible Negotiation - Book - Chapter - Verse using single touch functionality on any Tablet would be nice for starters.

This exists on the iPhone, iPad, and I think the Android versions of the (free) app - the overwhelming majority of tablets in use in the world. There are only a tiny proportion of users using full Windows 8.1 touch tablets like the Surface Pro (and hardly any using RT tablets). This might increase with the new, cheaper ones that are coming out now. I sit in Bible Studies every week using an iPad and find it perfectly acceptable, apart from the slightly slow initial start-up. It's a case of using the appropriate device for the setting. I don't take my laptop into a Bible Study but don't prepare my preaching on a tablet.

I think you ought to follow Mark's advice and get the upgrade on the 30-day basis and return it if you're not happy. It's also worth noting that on Andy's Psalms Explorer note above you can drill down still further and click on a particular Psalm bubble to see the structure of that Psalm, identify the parallelism and (probably not of interest to you) the Hebrew text as well. That is what I call really useful functionality and I haven't had a chance yet to explore the Proverbs stuff. The Cultural Concepts tool is one that I would have used extensively before I became a theology graduate - it contains the sort of useful background information for Bible Study that I wouldn't have known how to find before I studied. I have found that L6 fits really well into my study workflow, and the cultural Concepts and Ancient Literature tools have plugged two of the most time-consuming parts of the exegetical process that I go through in preparing to preach.

I think you do need to check out the product rather than criticising something you haven't actually used: your comments on the forums have probably cost Logos quite a few sales from those who come here to research before making a purchasing decision.

DAL

I knew you had something to say based on your lack of comments (just a sigh) on >>>this thread<<<

But hey, I'm glad you acknowledge you still have some growing up to do, just like the rest of us. Cheer up! I don't think Chaplain would get you all the features, just the engine with, maybe, some basic features, since Chaplain is mostly a special interest base package, but I see it more as an add-on with better functionality than a special interest bundle (e.g. Master Bundle S, M, L and XL, etc.). I could be wrong, though. Check with your Logos Rep. he/she might be able to inform you better.

DAL

JoshInRI

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656679#Comment_656679

Thanks DAL. I would consider an upgrade but just do not see any new features from the plethora of videos and comments in all the forums postings that in my opinion prompt one. The reaction I had to every one of these videos was - "Meh".

I am not into slamming Logos - with this reply I am pretty much done with the negative "What were they thinking?" type posts. Those who have discernment can really see me searching for a reason to upgrade.

For me there is no compelling reason to do so at this time despite some great attempts to show me otherwise above.

Now wait and watch for all the "get in line and say amen" folks. Probably the same ones who would have told Job to stop bellyaching when he got boils and faced all his - ahem - very real troubles (as opposed to my grumbling over these minor enhancements posing as an actual upgrade concerns).

God bless you all as you use whatever version you have. Thank God we have Bible software at all and people aiming at Logos to make it better!

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656687#Comment_656687

Well I am not overly impressed with extra bells and whistles but there are enough good features to make it worth a minimal upgrade cost. The Explorer is a good thing, 64 bit code, and fact book are all good solid tools added in. The homepage is quicker and nicer in my mind. Psalm / Proverbs explorers appear interesting but I have not played around much with them yet. My upgrade costs were only $135 and included the black NT commentary series. I am not sure what your upgrade costs for giving you silver 5 to silver 6 but if it is cheap enough, I do think it would be a good thing for you to have.

-Dan

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/656687#Comment_656687

For myself the ability to attach a note to multiple passages ... and to attach notes to pretty much everything is all I need to make me "run" to L6.

Quick Links

Recent Posts
Activity
Unanswered