Searching for a Greek Construction

Hi all,

I'm looking at this construction in Colossians 3:17: ἐν ὀνόματι κυρίου. I am wanting to find all similar instances of this phrase where you have the preposition ἐν, ὀνόματι in the dative as the object of the preposition, and some word in the genitive modifying ὀνόματι. I can get close by doing this morph search (lemma.g:ἐν@P WITHIN 2 WORDS lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND* WITHIN 2 WORDS lemma.g:*@ng*), but it isn't exact since it will show results that don't fit exactly what I want. Is there a better way to do this so that I get all and only the search results I'm interested in?

Find more posts tagged with

Comments

Christian Alexander

Try lemma.g:*@NG AFTER 1 WORD lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND

</code><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Use <code style="font-style: italic; font-size: 10pt;">lemma.g:ἐν@P BEFORE 1 WORD lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND to anchor the phrase with ἐν governing ὄνομα specifically in the dative.

Hopefully this works better.

Brian Leathers

Is this what you're looking for?

I used this in my search query: lemma.g:ἐν BEFORE 4 CHARS lemma.g:ὄνομα BEFORE 4 CHARS morph.g:NG

Brett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325762#Comment_1325762

Try lemma.g:*@NG AFTER 1 WORD lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND

</code><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Use <code>lemma.g:ἐν@P BEFORE 1 WORD lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND to anchor the phrase with ἐν governing ὄνομα specifically in the dative.

Hopefully this works better.

Thanks for this. How would I add the genitive to this construction so that there is a genitive modifying "name"?

Brian Leathers

That particular search that I used found your verse:

Hope that helps.

Brett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325789#Comment_1325789

Is this what you're looking for?

I used this in my search query: lemma.g:ἐν BEFORE 4 CHARS lemma.g:ὄνομα BEFORE 4 CHARS morph.g:NG

Thanks for this. The issue I see with this solution is that it's irrelevant to me whether definite articles are included or not. Thus, this excludes John 5:43 ("ἐγὼ ἐλήλυθα ἐν τῷ ὀνόματι τοῦ πατρός μου καὶ οὐ λαμβάνετέ με· ἐὰν ἄλλος ἔλθῃ ἐν τῷ ὀνόματι τῷ ἰδίῳ, ἐκεῖνον λήμψεσθε."), among others.

Brian Leathers

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325795#Comment_1325795

Here is another search without the article:

I just used this in the search window: lemma.g:ὄνομα BEFORE 4 CHARS morph.g:NG

That might get you closer to what you're looking for.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

I am wanting to find all similar instances of this phrase where you have the preposition ἐν, ὀνόματι in the dative as the object of the preposition, and some word in the genitive modifying ὀνόματι.

lemma.g:ἐν BEFORE 2 WORDS lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND BEFORE 4 WORDS morph.g:NG

Keep Smiling [:)]

Brett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325791#Comment_1325791

That particular search that I used found your verse:

Hope that helps.

Right. I am simply trying to find a search that finds a similar construction for all Greek morph texts. So, that one ends up excluding some.

Brett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325832#Comment_1325832

I am wanting to find all similar instances of this phrase where you have the preposition ἐν, ὀνόματι in the dative as the object of the preposition, and some word in the genitive modifying ὀνόματι.

lemma.g:ἐν BEFORE 2 WORDS lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND BEFORE 4 WORDS morph.g:NG

Keep Smiling

Thanks for the suggestion. This will also include false hits, like 2 Chronicles 28:15: καὶ ἀνέστησαν ἄνδρες οἳ ἐπεκλήθησαν ἐν ὀνόματι καὶ ἀντελάβοντο τῆς αἰχμαλωσίας. I'm thinking a syntax search must be the right route, but I'm unsure of how to construct it.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325873#Comment_1325873

I'm thinking a syntax search must be the right route, but I'm unsure of how to construct it.

Does something like this work?

Or is it too constrained?

Christian Alexander

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325790#Comment_1325790

How would I add the genitive to this construction so that there is a genitive modifying "name"?

I am not sure. That is something for someone with more knowledge to answer.

Brett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325889#Comment_1325889

I'm thinking a syntax search must be the right route, but I'm unsure of how to construct it.

Does something like this work?

Or is it too constrained?

Thanks for this suggestion. As you thought, it's too constrained since it excludes lots of hits I'm looking to include (Matt. 21:9 is one example). I'm not sure why this is though.

Also, when constructing a syntax search, is there some way to delete part of the search or do you have to start from scratch?

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325964#Comment_1325964

Also, when constructing a syntax search, is there some way to delete part of the search or do you have to start from scratch?

You can right-click an element and select the Delete option from the popup. That will delete that element and anything descending from it.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325964#Comment_1325964

Thanks for this suggestion. As you thought, it's too constrained since it excludes lots of hits I'm looking to include (Matt. 21:9 is one example). I'm not sure why this is though.

Matt 21:9 is a slightly different structure - with one less nominal phrase. To cater for both cases, you could do something like this

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325873#Comment_1325873

I am wanting to find all similar instances of this phrase where you have the preposition ἐν, ὀνόματι in the dative as the object of the preposition, and some word in the genitive modifying ὀνόματι.

lemma.g:ἐν BEFORE 2 WORDS lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND BEFORE 4 WORDS morph.g:NG

Keep Smiling

Thanks for the suggestion. This will also include false hits, like 2 Chronicles 28:15: καὶ ἀνέστησαν ἄνδρες οἳ ἐπεκλήθησαν ἐν ὀνόματι καὶ ἀντελάβοντο τῆς αἰχμαλωσίας. I'm thinking a syntax search must be the right route, but I'm unsure of how to construct it.

For Septuagint searching, changing BEFORE proximty from 4 to 3 WORDS removes 2 Chronicles 28:15 from search results:

lemma.g:ἐν BEFORE 2 WORDS lemma.g:ὄνομα@ND BEFORE 3 WORDS morph.g:NG

Keep Smiling [:)]

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1325994#Comment_1325994

To cater for both cases, you could do something like this

Or, more generally, you could do this. Note the use of the Matching skips levels option for both Nouns

Brett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1326144#Comment_1326144

To cater for both cases, you could do something like this

Or, more generally, you could do this. Note the use of the Matching skips levels option for both Nouns

Thanks so much. I think this is the solution. I applied matching skip level throughout the whole nominal phrase construction, which seems to have gotten me all of the relevant hits while not giving me any false positives. Sadly, I also just found out that there isn't a similar syntactical resource for the Septuagint on Logos.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1326436#Comment_1326436

Thanks so much. I think this is the solution. I applied matching skip level throughout the whole nominal phrase construction, which seems to have gotten me all of the relevant hits while not giving me any false positives.

Glad it was helpful

Sadly, I also just found out that there isn't a similar syntactical resource for the Septuagint on Logos.

Unfortunately, that is the case.