Hebrew textual criticism question
Comments
-
The best work ever written on OT textual criticism—one that walks through each major textual problem—is online in PDF format for free (I know "best ever written" sounds like an exaggeration, but it isn't :-). Unfortunately, it's in French. I have links to a couple articles introducing Barthélemy’s Critique textuelle de l’ancien Testament and the work of the Hebrew Old Testament Text Project in this post.
1 -
I used "Surface Text" not "All bible text" to tell Logos not to accept footnotes and such as valid hits - then it will work smoothly and pick up the indicated verses including ranges without giving spurious results.
Hi @NB.Mick,
Thank you for the screenshot! I will for sure save this layout as "more than one verse" or something. I have two questions though.
- Is there a way for it to not look like a rainbow ice cream cone? I sort of think there isn't, but I figured I would check.
2. As my test, I searched: "gen 1:1" OR "ex 1:1" OR "lk 1:1" I already have the Hebrew and Greek as a parallel, but it is ONLY showing for the Hebrew. Is there a way to fix this? I thought if I scrolled down it would produce Greek, but it doesn't.
The best work ever written on OT textual criticism—one that walks through each major textual problem—is online in PDF format for free (I know "best ever written" sounds like an exaggeration, but it isn't :-). Unfortunately, it's in French. There's nothing like Dominique Barthélemy’s
Critique textuelle de l’ancien Testamentand the work of the Hebrew Old Testament Text Project. I have links to a couple articles introducing the project and links to each volume ofCritique textuellein this post.Hi @Brian Davidson,
Thank you for the link! French or not, I will check it out! :)
0 -
If you can put up with the search highlighting, you can also use this syntax in an inline search. That avoids capturing the cross-references:
1 -
Hi @NB.Mick and @Mark Barnes (Logos),
Thank you both for your help, but I have three concerns. First, if I search for verses in the OT and NT, the parallel will ONLY show one of the original texts, but not both (even though both are in parallel). Is there a way to fix this?
Second, since the Logos method of searching multiple verses is arguably a bit convoluted, I decided to save it as a layout so that all I would need to do is type over verses. However, even though I saved the layout, when I re-opened it, it had completely destroyed my search set up. Is this a bug, or is there a reason for this?Third, I discovered that I can type Gen 1:1 OR Ex 1:1 OR Lk 1:1 without the quotes, which is helpful, but the OR command is truly a problem. Obviously on pretty much any site which is listing verses, the verses are listed with commas. For example, the author would write as a reference (see Gen 1:1, Ex 1:1-3, Lev 1:1) or whatever. So then I can take my mouse and copy those verses, and paste them most places. Accordance, BibleGateway, even Google. However, if I go to Logos I can't just paste the verses since I need to right OR between every verse. This seems unusual enough that I am wondering if I am missing something. Or is there really not a way to copy and paste a string of verses into this program?
Thank you for any clarity you are able to provide.0 -
After I posted on this, I wondered if it would work by removing the footnotes, but I had not considered surface text as the way to achieve this!
The cool thing is, you can work up stuff like this in inline search, then save it to a passage list. Then of course apply it to the text if you want to strip out the highlighting. 🙂Thanks everyone. This is another helpful text studies/OL hack for Logos. Every day is a school day!
0 -
This is also a useful way to get this done. Note to self to remember the parenthesis!
The highlighting is not my favourite for this use case, but it is not bad.
0 -
The cool thing is, you can work up stuff like this in inline search, then save it to a passage list. Then of course apply it to the text if you want to strip out the highlighting. 🙂
Hi @Donovan R. Palmer ,
Ya, I liked it as an inline also. I created a new tab with the "send results here" and set up my search thing and saved the layout. Yet when I opened the layout that search thing didn't stick (though it ironically does in the preview). I can post a screenshot if it would help, but would you mind confirming if it is my user error or a bug or something? If you create an inline tab with the "send here" and set up the search, save, close, and re-open the layout, what happens?
Thanks everyone. This is another helpful text studies/OL hack for Logos. Every day is a school day!
That's how I feel too. :)
0 -
If I understand what you are trying to achieve, it appears that Logos does not save the 'state' of the inline searches in a layout.
Here's before - you can see the inline search active and the results I have sent to the search panel.
Here's after I have saved and closed it. - When I open the layout again, it appears to revert to the base text, with the highlighted word from the active search panel on the right, but it has lost the inline search. You can build the search again, by right clicking one of the highlighted words and rerun the search though.
I don't know if this is by design or a bug that the state of the inline search is not saved in a layout. Someone from Logos would need to comment, or we would need to start a fresh post to get it looked at.
0 -
Regarding only showing one of the texts, that looks like a limitation/bug. It appears as though Multiview is looking at only the active reference (usually the one at the top) to determine which books to show. It should look at all the visible references. I'll report this as a bug.
I don't know why we don't save inline search to the layout. I'll ask around.
The only place to copy/paste a string of verses that I'm aware of is the Passage List. That actually works pretty well, either from the Add Passage box at the bottom, or the Add → Clipboard menu at the top.
If you do this sort of thing frequently, I wonder if the best solution would be to create a Passage List called "Bible Filter" or something, filter your Bible by that list, and just keep editing that one document whenever you need to update the filter.
1 -
@Mark Barnes (Logos) wrote
If you do this sort of thing frequently, I wonder if the best solution would be to create a Passage List called "Bible Filter" or something, filter your Bible by that list, and just keep editing that one document whenever you need to update the filter.
This is what I do and I keep it at the top of the passage list so that it is always handy.
0 -
Hi @Donovan R. Palmer, Thank you for the screenshots. On my end it isn't even saving as much as on your end, but I think it is because I had been using an inline tab. (I had duplicated the tab, then clicked "send here" and ran the inline to that tab). I can post a screenshot if it would help, but I suspect it isn't necessary given that it is a bug.
Hi @Mark Barnes (Logos), Thank you very much for reporting this as a bug, and also for the idea about the Passage List and gif. That was helpful. However, I hope this doesn't come across wrong, but I am still confused what the point of the Passage list is though, as it seems to just be a place to see verses next to different versions?
Typically if I am reading something on a website and the author makes an interesting point, I want to consult a commentary I trust. So I copy and paste the verses and open a book I want to consult (or multiple books if I want), and as I scroll through the verses the commentary auto-updates to scroll with the verses, even if they are out of order. Also, just to be clear, I just copied and pasted the verses. I didn't need to format them with writing OR or something between them.
In case it is helpful, I can attach a screenshot of a workspace in Accordance with a list of random verses and a random commentary. If I am understanding correctly, I can't replicate this in Logos. I can EITHER see all the verses in a Passage List, OR I can see one verse and a commentary. But not a list of verses like my screenshot. Is this correct?
0 -
@Kristin The purpose of Passage List is pretty straightforward. It allows users to save a list of Scripture passages. Its purpose isn't necessarily to allow passages to be seen next to different versions (the text comparison tool may be more suitable for this), though it can be used that way. What makes it very useful is how it is integrated into the software. One can, for example, quickly save search results or references from a book to a passage list to work through or refer to later or, as is being discussed here, use it as a Bible filter. There are many use cases where it serves as a helpful feature.
I was able to utilize the method laid out by Mark to quickly add the Scripture references from your screenshot to a passage list from the clipboard, which automatically filtered my Bible. In Multiple Book View I can click on any one of the passages to see what my commentaries have to say. If I would like to read more, I can click on the reference in the commentary to do so.
0 -
I was able to utilize the method laid out by Mark to quickly add the Scripture references from your screenshot to a passage list from the clipboard, which automatically filtered my Bible. In
Multiple Book ViewI can click on any one of the passages to see what my commentaries have to say. If I would like to read more, I can click on the reference in the commentary to do so.Hi @Aaron Hamilton,
Thank you for clarifying this. Given what your wrote, I just tried to create the verses as a passage list to try to replicate what you are describing, but all I can find is something called a passage "guide." I also typed "passage list" into the general search bar but that didn't work.
I see how to do it in Mark's gif, but unless I am mistaken, that seems to be how to do it in v11, as my toolbar doesn't seem to have that option.
0 -
Oh, sorry, I just found it. I had been looking under Guides and Tools, but it is under Documents. I will go try to create it now….
0 -
Hi @Mark Barnes (Logos), @Donovan R. Palmer, and @Aaron Hamilton,
Thank you all for your help, and I was able to set up the Passage List to show multiple verses with commentaries! I saved the layout and reopened it, and while I needed to re-open the verses, that isn't a big deal at all, so I will for sure remember this.
That said, I am still having issues with the Hebrew and Greek. In my multiple book view I have both the Hebrew and Greek selected, but it ONLY shows the Hebrew and just cuts off with the NT verses.
Is this a bug, or am I doing something wrong?
0 -
In my multiple book view I have both the Hebrew and Greek selected, but it ONLY shows the Hebrew and just cuts off with the NT verses.
If you add both a Greek and Hebrew Bible to Multiple Book View, they should (only) display when applicable based on the location of the leading book. Personally, I created a custom series titled "Original Languages", which consists of my favorite Greek and Hebrew versions. If I add that series to Multiple Book View, it will seamlessly carry over from Greek to Hebrew and vice versa.
0 -
If I add that series to Multiple Book View, it will seamlessly carry over from Greek to Hebrew and vice versa.
Hi @Aaron Hamilton,
Ok, great. Given this, I closed the layout and reopened it, and now it is working. So I am actually not sure if it was a fluke or I had done something wrong, but I am grateful that it is working now. Thank you.
0
