4.3 beta 3: Feedback on "Last updated" column
Thank you for including a 'last updated' column. It will go some way to helping people know which resources have been updated.
However, as you say in the release notes, all the entries are for today. Please could this be pre-populated with the data from the updates table of UpdateManager/Updates.db so that the majority of resources have an accurate date from the beginning? Resources that don't have an entry in updates.db could be given the file-creation date of the Logos 4 folder, or perhaps the earliest date in the Updates table.
Second, I think there's some potential for confusion. By 'last-updated', you presumably mean when the most recent install date was, not when the file was actually published. I don't have a better suggestion but I wonder if there is a choice of words that makes this distinction clear.
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Comments
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Mark Barnes said:
However, as you say in the release notes, all the entries are for today. Please could this be pre-populated with the data from the updates table of UpdateManager/Updates.db so that the majority of resources have an accurate date from the beginning? Resources that don't have an entry in updates.db could be given the file-creation date of the Logos 4 folder, or perhaps the earliest date in the Updates table.
Yes, I had the same thought!
Mark Barnes said:Second, I think there's some potential for confusion. By 'last-updated', you presumably mean when the most recent install date was, not when the file was actually published. I don't have a better suggestion but I wonder if there is a choice of words that makes this distinction clear.
How about "Last Downloaded"? Or (same number of letters and a bit prettier): "Latest Download"
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Or "Last Installed"?
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Mark Barnes said:
Please could this be pre-populated with the data from the updates table of UpdateManager/Updates.db
How many resources will this actually affect; you indicate "majority" but will it be more useful for an older installation that has many updates vs. a recent installation with no updates?
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Mark Barnes said:
By 'last-updated', you presumably mean when the most recent install date was, not when the file was actually published. I don't have a better suggestion but I wonder if there is a choice of words that makes this distinction clear.
I agree it is ambiguous as it has to accommodate my new resources and updated ones. last-installed is better.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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BTW, I second Mark's suggestion.
Thanks
Peter
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Dave Hooton said:
How many resources will this actually affect; you indicate "majority" but will it be more useful for an older installation that has many updates vs. a recent installation with no updates?
In my own case, it's all resources since March 2003. That's a total of 495 resources that would have more accurate dates. (Perhaps there's none before that date because the table wasn't populated before 4.0c beta 1, but there could be some other reason.)
But if someone's only installed recently, then the "last updated" column could just be set to the date of installation.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Mark Barnes said:
In my own case, it's all resources since March 2003. That's a total of 495 resources that would have more accurate dates. (Perhaps there's none before that date because the table wasn't populated before 4.0c beta 1, but there could be some other reason.)
But if someone's only installed recently, then the "last updated" column could just be set to the date of installation.
Some resources have never been updated, so presumably they are not in Updates.db? If you are still referring to our current installations where does the date of installation come from?
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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I would rather Logos focus there attention elsewhere rather then trying to input old dates. The important thing is to know which resources are updated moving forward. Given the system they set up it seems like we will now know that information.
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Dave Hooton said:
Some resources have never been updated, so presumably they are not in Updates.db?
Correct.
Dave Hooton said:If you are still referring to our current installations where does the date of installation come from?
I'm suggesting that resources that have never been updated are either (a) given the date that Logos was installed (you can look this up by seeing when the {random-name} folder was created, or (b) the date when updates started to be recorded in updates.db, whichever is the later.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Mark Barnes said:
However, as you say in the release notes, all the entries are for today. Please could this be pre-populated with the data from the updates table of UpdateManager/Updates.db so that the majority of resources have an accurate date from the beginning?
No; doing so would introduce complications beyond the scope of this feature.
However, if you do want the dates copied over, I've written a tool that should copy them for you. It's barely tested, unsupported, carries no warranty, back up your files before using, etc. If it works, I'll take full credit; if it destroys your system, I disclaim all responsibility. [:)]
It won't set the "last updated" date correctly for resources from an original DVD install, or resources imported from LDLS3, or resources discovered by using the "scan" command.
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Thanks, Bradley. It worked fine here - I'd made a brief failed attempt with a nested SQL query, so a PHP script was next on my list. You saved me the trouble, and yours will work for people without webservers installed!
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Bradley Grainger said:
It won't set the "last updated" date correctly for resources from an original DVD install, or resources imported from LDLS3, or resources discovered by using the "scan" command.
Well, it worked, kinda: it only set the date on 106 resources, and the earliest date set was May 25, 2010. I would have expected to see dates for most of the resources I purchased this year. For example, the only Zondervan resource to get a new date was the NIDOTTE (Jul 2, 2010), the rest (EBC and NIDNTT) still say "Tuesday". Since the Zondervan resources were added in March and April, the NIDOTTE date must be an update, so it just looks like May 25th is the cutoff date for me.
Is it possible I did something to my library that would have removed the dates before May 25th?
MacBook Pro (2019), ThinkPad E540
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Todd Phillips said:
Well, it worked, kinda
Thanks, Mark
this is a great 'start' to something that could be quite helpful.
Blessings
Regards, SteveF
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steve clark said:
What is the syntax on using the new Last Updated in the Find box?
There is none; the only interaction with that data is to show the column and sort it.
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Bradley Grainger said:
There is none; the only interaction with that data is to show the column and sort it.
Thanks!
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Todd Phillips said:
Well, it worked, kinda: it only set the date on 106 resources, and the earliest date set was May 25, 2010.
Similar problem here. For me it is Jule 7th, 2010. Any idea?
Bohuslav
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Bohuslav Wojnar said:Todd Phillips said:
Well, it worked, kinda: it only set the date on 106 resources, and the earliest date set was May 25, 2010.
Similar problem here. For me it is Jule 7th, 2010. Any idea?
Have you ever deleted the UpdateManager\updates.db file? (If so, any dates that had been stored in it will have been permanently lost.)
Deleting ResourceManager.db will also cause the UpdateManager DB to be cleared (and there may be other triggers, too).
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Not wanting to be overly complex here, but doesnt each built resource have that build date in all formats (logos4, lix. etc) in its file header?
why cant/isnt the program looking at this, and using this to populate, surely this would be more logical, and more accurate...
secondly, might there be a way of allowing a custom collection to say updatedate within [no of days] so we can have a dynamic collection for new books..
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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Bohuslav Wojnar said:Todd Phillips said:
Well, it worked, kinda: it only set the date on 106 resources, and the earliest date set was May 25, 2010.
Similar problem here. For me it is Jule 7th, 2010. Any idea?
Same problem for me. Only 129 resources had the date set, earliest date was May 27, 2010, and latest was Aug 15, 2010, even though I've received many pre-pubs since then.
Bradley Grainger said:Have you ever deleted the UpdateManager\updates.db file? (If so, any dates that had been stored in it will have been permanently lost.)
No, I haven't.
DominicM said:Not wanting to be overly complex here, but doesnt each built resource have that build date in all formats (logos4, lix. etc) in its file header?
why cant/isnt the program looking at this, and using this to populate, surely this would be more logical, and more accurate...
This would be a useful column to have. But I would see that as desireable in addition to the current column of laste updated. Particularly for newly purchased items a person might still want a way to see when they downloaded that purchase as opposed to when the file was last updated by Logos.
DominicM said:secondly, might there be a way of allowing a custom collection to say updatedate within [no of days] so we can have a dynamic collection for new books..
Again, this would make more sense if there were different columns for last updated by Logos vs. last downloaded by user. A dynamic collection of books updated in the past [n] days wouldn't be as interesting as a collection of the books I've aquired recently. I already do that anyway since I tag all my books with a Bought date when I acquire them. That way I can easily browse through and continue familiarizing myself with my newest books. I don't think such a collection would need to be a dynamically generated one. It would be easy enough to filter the library by, say, "LastDownload:>=2010-10-01" And that way the user could be in control of how recent the list would be. They might want to see all the books they'd downloaded since they started seminary, for example.
EDIT: Also I'm not sure I like the "Today" and "Tuesday" display of recent dates. I personally would rather see them all as dates. I know they sort correctly in chronological order with the weekdays for recent dates, but still I would visualize the changes from recent dates to less recent dates more easily if they were all shown as dates. Not that this is a big deal to me at all one way or the other. I'm just delighted to see this feature was introduced.
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DominicM said:
Not wanting to be overly complex here, but doesnt each built resource have that build date in all formats (logos4, lix. etc) in its file header?
why cant/isnt the program looking at this, and using this to populate, surely this would be more logical, and more accurate...
There is the date that is the L4 version for the resource and there is a Windows Date Created for each file. The latter would do very well for a date installed if there is no date in Updates.db (please, Bradley).
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Bradley Grainger said:
There is none; the only interaction with that data is to show the column and sort it.
It would be useful to be able to use it as a field and perform date comparisons like:
lastupdate:<3 ie. younger than 3 days
lastupdate:0 ie. installed today
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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I've had wonky responses from window's "date created" it changes sometimes almost as if you've run a Linux "touch" command on it. I've never been able to figure out what changes some of the dates, but I've suspected even Antivirus software occasionally.Dave Hooton said:There is the date that is the L4 version for the resource and there is a Windows Date Created for each file. The latter would do very well for a date installed if there is no date in Updates.db (please, Bradley)
Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 0 -
I always merge straight away tho...
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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Bradley Grainger said:
However, if you do want the dates copied over, I've written a tool that should copy them for you.
Hi Bradley
I got the following error
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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ok after looking into it more updates.db already has this date of last update to resource that I was asking for [Resources.LocalVersion] , although it would be nice to see it, in that library list at least I know where I can get it from
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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