Plural Nouns with KAI Search
Comments
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George Somsel said:
Where did you get that? The listing is consistently αὐτόπτης, ου, ὁ.
George, you don't know how much it pains me to say this—"You are correct" αὐτόπτης is a noun, and Logos' tagging is in error. I now repent with bitter tears [:$]
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Jack Caviness said:George Somsel said:
Where did you get that? The listing is consistently αὐτόπτης, ου, ὁ.
George, you don't know how much it pains me to say this—"You are correct" αὐτόπτης is a noun, and Logos' tagging is in error. I now repent with bitter tears
I wouldn't be too concerned about it. After all, even I make mistakes occasionally though I don't recall when the last time was. [;)] [;)] [;)]
The dislike of being found in error is what makes us be a bit more careful.
george
gfsomselיְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן
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Bradley Grainger (Logos) said:
To make sure I understand correctly: you're running a syntax search for "plural-noun kai plural-noun" and it's not returning Lk 1:2? If so, there is no bug here, because the first word is tagged as an adjective, not a noun.
It's tagged as both at the Word level. My query was at the Word level, not the Terminal Node, so it is reasonable to expect a hit else why tag as Adj, Noun?
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Dave, it's tagged as an adjective, nominative. The "nominative" refers to the case of the word (nominative, accusative, dative ... ). It does not mean that it is tagged as a noun.
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Lee said:
It does not mean that it is tagged as a noun.
At the Node level it is adjectival, but the Word level morphology allows it to be a Noun.
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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Hmmmm... noun phrase. Care to comment, Logos?
[By the way, at the raw level, morph and form are just servants, not masters. What's really there is also important, if not of primal importance.]
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Is anyone at Logos taking note of the algorithm / tagging error? [8-|]
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Bump. Please, can someone at Logos look into this issue...
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We are looking into it.
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Syntax search is unfortunately only able to handle one morph code per word. In this case, the primary analysis is adjective, so searching for a noun won't find it. When displaying the resource, the alternative analysis (noun) can also be seen, but it's not actually there in the syntax search database. This is not a bug or tagging error, but a limitation in the syntax search technology.
(As to whether the primary analysis should be noun or adjective, that has room for legitimate disagreement.)
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In the database upon which the syntax search is based, we are limited to only one morph code. When there is more than one, the first listed (which is the 'primary' morph code for the instance) is the one the embedded in the database that syntax search uses.
The syntax graphs represent the information of the associated morphology, so both are listed there as I figured it was best to err on the side of listing more data than less. This is a chicken-and-egg thing; if we had only listed one morph code in the graph, then the question would be about disparity between the syntax graph and the morph edition of SBLGNT (or NA27, which has the same morph data for this word).
I reviewed αυτοπται in the lexica (even the Spanish ones!). I've adjusted the coding in our internal data sources to list the noun first, then the adjective. This means that syntax searches for noun-και-noun will find this instance when the updated databases are released. That won't be right away; we will be releasing an update to this and also to the Lexham Hebrew Bible in concert with a future update to the Bible Sense Lexicon.
Hope it helps.
Rick Brannan
Data Wrangler, Faithlife
My books in print0 -
Dave
===Windows 11 & Android 13
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