If I had a million dollars (to grow Logos Bible Software)...

One more addition my "raffle" idea.  For marketing, you could offer a draw for free Logos 4 BDAG/HALOT bundles and/or AYBD bundles to those who not only have purchased, upgraded and/or cross graded, but to those who have simply tried Logos 4.  These resources are valuable (although I still do not own them myself due to some dental bills in the near future). 

My thinking is this - even if the person who wins is a person who tried the product and returned it (thus "no purchase is necessary to win these items") they would be more likely to invest in a base pacckage having won one of those valuable resources.

Giving away iPods and Bible is a nice service, but I think draws to products like the BDAG/HALOT or AYBD might connect people better with the Logos system.  And for those who win and have those products already, you can offer, not cash, but a similarily valued product from you vaste library.

Just an idea.

1. I would use the 1mm dollars to stabilize the Logos 4 software package.

2. Hire technical/customer service staff 24/7 to accomplish goal #1.

3. Expand the mobility capability of the Logos 4 software package via kindle, nook, palm-pre, Apple's new products.

4.  Fix my little problem on case 50988. Perpetual downloads/updates.

5. Offer customer-selected bundles equal to the current packages you are offering now. Let the customer choose what they want. You will need to modify your website to accomplish this.

6. Improve the bible chapter and look-up feature. User selected book and chapter menu. See Sword Searcher 5.5 to view the ease of use. It makes going to chapters and verses easy without typing. This does could be a virtual pull down menu.

Bob Pritchett said:

What's your idea?

I will now put in my $1.00 (inflation you know).

I can not recommend highly enough to get the average church goer involved in this software.  A few things would be needed.  First, a lower end package...$49.95 sounds really good to me.  Second, Webinars or "use" video's.  The idea of a "college" for bible study in the 21st century is great.  As was stated, that might be too much now.  Concerning the webinars or videos, make some very basic (free).  Introductory (low cost) and one or two levels above.  The next need is for current and new customers combined.  Look at the price point of the resources outside the base packages.  It seems the overall cost of these resources could be lower. 

This is not me ( I wish it was).  Hire a consulting actuary for risk models of business.  I assume you have data that this actuary could design some tests and obtain further information.  Current academic users are buying product as follows.  What if we lowered cost?  If we see a bigger base of buyers (mr. or mrs. church goer) what happens to sales of additional resources?  Selling more at a lower price generally would make more money.                                                                                                  

Finally, put a real slow down on "new" resources.  Task all possible to work on getting everything up to date.  There are lots of missing features of L4.  There is lots of in development stuff for excessive lengths of time.  (Hebrew pronunciation)

As a seminary student, I would like to see more of my required resources available in LOGOS format.  For $1M, you can market a process that tenured professors teaching large classes can submit the required reading list for Logos format. Have a project team get this done quickly.  Sell it as a bundle at  a discount to students every year/semester for years to come.  Repeat the process for new classes.

It sounds like you have some great ideas, like expanding your product's appeal to a greater audience ("Keyboarding the entire Patrologia Graeca") and more advertising.

While I would love your business to grow, I also really like hearing that you're interested in hiring more software developers. I just hope that whoever you hire has a passion for developing extremely user-friendly software. One of the most important pieces of wisdom that should be stressed to any software developer that's developing a GUI is to "Use concrete
metaphors and make them plain, so that users have a set of expectations
to apply to computer environments." (Apple Human Interface Guidelines) I'm sure you've heard it before, but I don't think easy operability can be stressed enough.

And thank you for your passion that lets us take advantage of such a great product!

P.S. In case you felt like the quote wasn't very helpful, an example of a metaphor for software such as Logos would be to create a sort of Library viewing option (it is library management software, after all) that would display collections of books in virtual bookshelves (like BestCommentaries.com does).

Jon Rumble said:

Joe Miller said:

4. Website improvements to ensure pre-pubs and all orders can be downloaded with L4 and no more requirements to ship. Also integrating POS options for locked books into the L4 UI.

5. Hire part time web developer/moderator just for the Forum ( and wiki) which is a large part of the Logos support strategy and needs some attention.

I think it would be worth spending the entire $1 million (or more) to completely redevelop your websites. The way I see it, your website is your shopfront and at present it is functional but ugly - 'busy-ness', colour coordination, font selection and consistency, lack of graphics.

When purchasing bible software I'm sure people take into account all sorts of factors - and hopefully fully explore the capabilities of the program - but first impressions are very important! To be sure it could be a whole lot worse (gramcord.org) but it could also be a lot better! The marketing material like the videos is very slick and well done, I think the website needs the same treatment. As a sort of thought experiment; put your feet in the shoes of Jo Lay-Christian -a very large market- go to logos.com and the website for the very recently released program aimed at this market.. what do you think? On the one hand some of the web based stuff Logos is doing (library.logos.com, cloud syncing) is cutting edge and revolutionary.... ... but some money needs to go into the design side of things too

As well as the aesthetic improvements, I think it would be worth investigating web-based mechanisms like formal bug reporting, support systems that allow for submitting support tickets online (depending on how you currently manage your customer support it could have some follow through cost savings), a better forum platform.

That's my 2 cents...

I also think that a better web presence would  be worth an investment.  The website is currently not on a par with the program.

And I understand the difficult hard costs involved in help and customer service.  Logos has built up an incredible cadre of users who are happy to help new customers.  Leverage that.  To be blunt: the current forum is horrible for serious help.  The search function is very inferior, and the lack of multiple fora makes it almost impossible to find anything.  After I run a couple of (usually useless) searches, I simply (re)post my question.  How much could vBulletin cost?  It is (for example) far more robust, and searchable.  You could even further leverage user base help by giving credits for4 new material for time spent on the forum answering questions.

I would continue to expand to base markets.  While an individual resource might be excellent (and I might clamor for it), what will it actually mean in terms of new business?  I would LOVE Patrologica Graeca or Loebs, but really, how many users is that going to bring?  Are gobs of Classicists (if that many even exist, speaking as a former one) going to buy Logos instead of use Perseus?  I think not.  So maybe a better way to link into Perseus via the web (at less cost) is better.  Would you really want to focus the company's future on doing everything to bring Mac platform up to speed?  It might be nice, but it is still 2-5% of the computer market in the US, and almost zero in emerging markets (China, India).

No way would I pay anyone to watch a video.  If you really want seminary distribution, give a significant discount to a seminary student who sends you a new customer.  Same for profs and pastors.

By the way, Bob, I like that you are thinking about this. It only make sense to step away from the current tasks to look to the future.

My two cents would be a $50 base package or a massively free package that includes several public domain books, even if the public domain books are already available as a paid resource through Logos. This makes Logos more of a workable demo. You may not be able to do "x" with this book (like you could if you had the full version) but you can do "y".

I live in a rural area. I am an ambassador for Logos. I get hit with the I use the other software because it is free or it is cheaper.

Maybe Logos could do something completely non-Logos software related with a million dollars? Give a matching donation (with Logos users) to an important cause or causes.

Print a Logos Cook-off Cook book...maybe use some Logos user recipes (or at least give us an extra Bible Study Magazine edition with all the recipes).

all about Christ,
David Buckham

Oh yea, I think someone already mentioned it but create a book store much like Apple's app store for the iPhone. This would allow user to create/write books using PBB (once it works with Logos 4) and the submit them and have them sold in the book store. You could do a split much like apple does with developers. While this might now be a great revenue generator it would cause people to get Logos just to get the book store ability. Apple's main use for the App store is to get people to buy iPhone/iPod touch. As more users started using Logos that would mean more potential customers for Logos created books.

Churches could also use it to create digital versions of lesson plans/study/books for their members. You could then start subscriptions (i.e. Bible Study magazine) for periodicals or Churches could have a small subscription fee to get digital copies of sermon notes/lesson plans for their services. Again, while this in itself might not be a great revenue generator it would get more people using Logos. Especially if you have a very basic base package (6 bibles, 5 basic commentaries, strongs) with a very minimal number of resources. The average believer doesn't necessarily use a lot of the resources you have. price point about $25.00. If they wanted more resources they could purchase them. With the additional basic users it would create a larger audience for the Bible study institute/video lessons. As they began to use Logos more they would want to know how do I study the bible with logos? inductive bible study. Lesson preparation for home cell groups/Sunday school teachers. Practical application of doing word studies with Logos. All the lesson would need some practical application and lesson assignments. Walk them through building a bible study on prayer from start to finish and them have them build another study on their own (assignment). You could eventually grow this into an online school. I'd love to go to one of Morris Proctor's seminars but they can be limited. the closest one to me is about 4 hours away. It's also during the week and at a critical time at work where I can't take the time off. This means I a have to wait 6 months to a year to where it would be close enough and cost effective for me to attend. I know he has the videos of the seminars but I don't really want videos of a seminar. I'd rather have structured lessons.

I know I am repeating, but here they are anyway:

- Have a strategic team to research and stay on top of alternative and new delivery methods - IPhone, Kindle, Linux, Apple Tablet, Blackberry, smartphones etc. I think the Mac roll out is going far too slow and seems to have been an afterthought.

- Deliver via online subscription service. Great for those who may not have the internal computing or network (ie download) capacity, those who want to easily access from different computers (work, home, travel) or those who just prefer cloud computing and the advantages that come with it. Gives the ability to "rent" resources instead of having to commit to them. Offer a 30-day free online trial. Great way to test drive.

- Different package options including a lower end package. Not everyone needs 1,000 resources to do their study. It can make it very daunting for some. I realize there are already a number of packages, but I found it overwhelming/confusing to try to figure out which ones.

- Offer lower-cost packages/sponsorship for qualified students, seminaries and missionaries. Could be under "bulk" licensing.

- Expand non-English resources - Chinese, Russian etc.

- I would like to have my seminary text books in Logos so I can use them for the course and then for future reference.

- Create a good note taking and lesson and sermon preparation module. Many are studying the Bible to use it in their work/ministry, so give them the tools to do so efficiently.

- Consider other multi-media that would also be useful for pastors of small churches, church-planters, missionaries or traveling teachers
who could use an all-in-one resource to create all of their bulletins, handouts, presentation materials, worship etc. I realize that these are at the core of Logos, but I am sure many Logos customers could use them.

In my opinion the best way to attract new users, is to have a basic package that is free, so users can see what they get when they buy a package. Just include some public domain resources, that are also in other bible-studie-software packages that you can download from the internet for free (like E-Sword). So include at least:

1. KJV (and in each language at least one public domain bible translation)
2. A public domain Greek and Hebrew text
3. Strongs dictionary
4. Some free images / timelines / etc (just a few, so users can get an idea, with the message "you get plenty more when you buy one of our packages)
5. Maybe a small public domain bible dictionary and a small commentary, so users can get an idea of how those work in Logos

I think it wouldn't cost you a million bucks to offer, but I believe it will attract a lot of new buyers.

Another idea is, to create an "upgrade adviser". Just a long list with all the books that are included in all the packages. Let the user select (with a checkbox) the books he want to buy, and let the "upgrade adviser" calculate the worth of the books when bought seperate, and advise the best fitting package.

There has been some discussion about how much cheaper than at present the entry level package should be. Personally, I am strongly of the opinion that the best way for Logos to be used by more people ... especially if one of the aims is reach the average person sitting in the pew ... is for the entry option to be free. I say this knowing that this will probably be bad news for eSword, which I have a soft spot for, because it was the first Bible study software I ever used.

Actually, this was how I first used Logos-3: I "purchased" a free book (the Gospel Coalition documents) ... and downloaded the free Logos engine. I would never buy software I wasn't sure would run on my computer - especially over the internet, and I suspect I'm not alone in this. It was only because I had seen eSword that I had an inkling of what Logos would be able to do ... therefore I eventually plunged for the Original Languages base-product, as I thought this would best support my academic research.

This target group, however, will not have this academic motivation ... and may not have experience of eSword ... so how would they know they could benefit from Logos, unless there was a free version to play with? Logos shouldn't have to build its user base on the assumption that people know eSword!!

A few select basic public-domain documents (creeds, commentaries, dictionaries) (like one has on e-Sword) - or ones totally owned by Logos - should be given away with a couple of popular Bibles, so that someone could learn to love Logos ... and want the better resources. I agree with an earlier commentator, better integration of "sales" with L4 should make this migration into being a purchaser of L4 resources as painless as possible for the user.

Then there should be an attractive general user base-package for somewhere between $10 and $30; to capture those who think that anything worth having has to be bought. This only has to have a relatively small number of desirable popular resources not in the free version.

That is how I would like to see the $1 million spent for the growth of Logos.

This on a modern e-Reader could really capture a large market.

I have a couple of questions based on Bob's comments.  How many of you Logos users also have one of the free programs like E-Sword or The Word???

I know that I own Logos today because I first saw the usefulness of electronic bible study through E-Sword and the Online Bible.  Those programs gave me the idea that this idea of electronic bible study was worth paying to get the resources that I could only get through Logos.

If I had ever seen a free Logos program and could have started out with a program like Logos 2 or 3, I would have started spending money on more resources sooner.  The way things were I was afraid to try Logos, what if I didn't like it??? 

How many of you Logos users have ever seen a free Logos program and package?

How many of you would love to be able to hand a free Logos 3 or 4 program and a small package to one or more of your friends?

Now the truth is I think this attacks only part of the problem that we are faced with today.  The main problem is actually that the average believer does not understand how much a bible software can help him to understand the Word of God,  I am all for a limited give away, for people to use. Currently I use The Word and give out 100's of copies each year, but I also show people how to use the program, and that is what sells them on bible study.  Muybiggest problem currently is getting believers that are using the Word to convert to Logos.  The Word is a very good program and after getting started using it, most people want to keep using what they are comfortable with.  If I could start people out on a small but free Logos package, they would not have to change, they would only have to be shown all the resourcs that Logos carries and start adding to the package they already have.  Logos would have a life time friend and they would have a system they would never out grow.

The way things are now, the Word works so well and they are so comfortable with it that they are afraid to change and start putting money into products they have never used.

If you really want to sell more Logos programs people have to be shown what it can really do and be allowed to try it out for a very small investment or none at all. 

For now I will keep giving The Word away and teaching believers how to use it.  There must be nearly 1000 modules on line for it now, and it does bible and book searches has a note taking feature, allows you to put your own public domain books in it and search them, and hyper-link references, you can also make your own collection groups.  Oh and you can save your layouts!

It is not near the level of Logos, in function or resources, but it isn't no E-Sword or Online Bible either.  Until Logos gives me a tool to compete with it, I will have to use the tool I have to introduce members of the body to electronic bible study!

In Christ,

Jim

Bob,

Just a thought on these previous experiments you've done regarding Free/Discounted packages. When I first signed up to Logos many years ago it was because you offered a resource I couldn't get elsewhere (I was at the time using PC Study Bible). I later bought Pradis to get additional resources. In other words in the days when you ran your experiment there wasn't much to choose between the different packages apart from price and the resources themselves.

Now, things are a bit different. Many people no longer see Bible software as a means to reading/searching a resource. Whole new 'non-serious' markets are opening up (think Illumina and Glo). People actually want to know what the software is like, and at entry-level the software itself is more important that the resources. That wasn't true 10 years ago.

If Logos was to offer a free-base package with the same resources as the free iPhone version, I do believe it would significantly increase sales. If nothing else, it would provide a demo for other customers who are considering purchasing Logos but want to know what it's really like before spending several hundred dollars. I wouldn't expect there to be massive upgrade sales, it's only cost you the bandwidth costs.

Some suggestions of converting non-paying customers to paying customers. If you did all of these people would feel nagged, so I'm suggesting you choose from these:

• Offering a limited trial of pay-for features of Logos 4 from within the program (I'm thinking Biblical People etc.)
• For the first ten weeks after install, sending a weekly "How to get the most out of your new software" email to new customers, that concentrates on what you can do for free, but adds a small section on what extra you can do if you upgrade.
• Changing the homepage for free users, which from time to time displays upgrade links with benefits clearly explained. Several times a year these should be discounted.
• Using the log of the searches etc. people do (assuming they don't turn on the privacy option) to recommend specific paid resources or packages within the program.
• Create some videos which explain the benefits of upgrading between each base package.

Bob,

Thanks so much for your continual interest in what we, your customers, think and want.

I love Logos and have used it fo many years and have gotten other people involved. I would have gotten more involved, but the cost is the major thing. You may have used "free" products in the past to get more users to your software, but how many of us knew about them? Somehow I missed it or otherwise would have been handing them out to friends and students. One major way to increase your customer base will be to have a cheaper beginner level product. I would suggest under $50. It doesn't have to have massive programs, but it would need to have quality. So include a Bible, such as the ESV or NAS95, a concordance, and a good commentary on the whole Bible. And include your latest map set. This would be enough for us to show others how easy it is to use software to do some serious Bible study.

Also I would suggest you use the money to get all the pre-pubs ready and shipped. Along these lines I would suggest you not offering more pre-pubs, until you catch up! I know, I can't believe I am saying this, as I love most of what you offer. BUT even though I have been a major supporter of Logos and Pre-pubs, presently it is becoming "too many" to choose from. Thus I am having to choose less, in order to "cover" what I have already ordered. You are spreading yourself too thin, and the customers are being overwhelmed with the massive Pre-pubs coming our way.

I would also suggest that you get PBB working for Logos 4 and then hire some faithful Logos users to get the "free domain" books available to the public in this format at a lower price and you spend your efforts with newer books.

Another way to develop your customer base is to make sure that the present customers understand how the program works. It is great that you offer the videos on the different aspects of the program, but many of us are visual learners and need a written manual to refer to; something that we could quickly look up a feature, without having to go online and try to find out the appropriate video or solution. I appreciate what Morris is providing through his manuals, but they are too expensive even apart from shipping. I would suggest that you spend money on developing manuals that can be downloaded as part of the program itself. Then as we (your long time customers) know how to use the program effectively, then we can get others involved. The best advertising has always been word of mouth.

And of couse continue opening up other venues of accessing your books, such as Kindle, etc.

And as previously mentioned, update your web site and forums. The forum is too difficult to find answers to problems that have been previously. The searches attempted often have nothing to do with the problem at hand. Thus another reason to have a downloaded manual, one that can be constantly updated, as new features are being added.

Thanks again, Bob, for all that you are doing. Your hard work is making a difference in many lives!

Bob,

I think the market is changing with regards to e-books. The introduction of the Kindle (and other e-readers) and the upcoming iBook on the iPad seems to be convincing people that ebooks are a viable alternative to print. My attitudes towards e-books have changed a lot since I bought Scholars back in '02. I think another trial run at a free/cheap package might be appropriate.

Charlene said:

You may have used "free" products in the past to get more users to your software, but how many of us knew about them?

Charlene,(don't feel too bad)  I believe Bob has to be talking almost 15 years ago, and in computer stuff that is a "lifetime" ago.

I also agree with the comment that in terms of competition back then, all of the few companies seemed to be trying to "re-invent" the same "wheel."

But it was one of those "freer" starter packs that introduced me.

And the one that "hooked" me forever was the Logos-Nelson ("green colored?) 100 book unlock in the $10-20 range. That CD convinced me as to just what Logos could really do. It had a nice mix of commentary, dictionary, language etc  I gave one of them to a family member AND both of us have upgraded "big-time" since then.

It can work.

For the first time in many years I see that there is a chance for a real change in the body of Christ, and how we train one another and our leaders. I hope Logos can be a leader in this change!

With the current level of research ability and the resources that can be found in Logos 4, we have a way of training each person in a fellowship group to the level that even pastors would love to be trained to.  One of the draw backs at this time is still a lack of vision to see what is possible and enough people that really understand how to use Logos or any electronic bible study program, so they can train others to use Logos or another program, but that day is coming when that will be over come, although it may or may not be Logos they use.

For example people may or may not be aware of what is going on along these new educational lines, but here is an example.  The church of Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa has already put out a CD of The Word bible study program with over 600 free resources on it for free.  They have also already had their first big event where people could come to the fellowship, get a free CD and learn how to use the program right there at the fellowship!!!

They are currently getting ready to have another big meeting on how to use The Word bible study program in Febuary that will be streamed on the internet and also posted for free on Youtube. You can see the annoucement here http://forum.theword.gr/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1583 Can you imagine the impact this would have on the future of Logos, if they were giving away free Logos programs instead of the Word program!!!

One of their pastors Doug Hamp has a web page that deals with the Word http://thefirstsixdays.com/TheWordBibleSoftware.htm if Logos is interested in what the future could be in electronic bible study and how the local church may use it someone should get in contact with these guys and see what is going on.

Along  these same lines, I personally am using electronic bible study programs to show members of the local fellowships that I attend how to educate everyone and everyone how to study at levels never seen before. 

On top of that I have taught several elders from near bible churches how to use the Word and it is changing their lives, they can not believe the research they can do, without going back to school, they can learn right where they live!   Of course they do not get a degree, but they are more interested in what they can learn than in getting a degree.  These elder have caught on and are giving out free programs to members of their fellowships although they have not gone the next step of showing the members how to use the free programs, right now I end up doing that.

At the present time it is these free packages that allow these programs to get started, but none of these programs have either the features of Logos or the resources of Logos, but they have enough features and resources to change how people learn and they also allow anyone anywhere to start learning at a level only dreamed of before!

In Christ,

Jim

JimVanSchoonhoven said:

For the first time in many years I see that there is a chance for a real change in the body of Christ, and how we train one another and our leaders. I hope Logos can be a leader in this change!

With the current level of research ability and the resources that can be found in Logos 4, we have a way of training each person in a fellowship group to the level that even pastors would love to be trained to.  One of the draw backs at this time is still a lack of vision to see what is possible and enough people that really understand how to use Logos or any electronic bible study program, so they can train others to use Logos or another program, but that day is coming when that will be over come, although it may or may not be Logos they use.

For example people may or may not be aware of what is going on along these new educational lines, but here is an example.  The church of Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa has already put out a CD of The Word bible study program with over 600 free resources on it for free.  They have also already had their first big event where people could come to the fellowship, get a free CD and learn how to use the program right there at the fellowship!!!

They are currently getting ready to have another big meeting on how to use The Word bible study program in Febuary that will be streamed on the internet and also posted for free on Youtube. You can see the annoucement here http://forum.theword.gr/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1583 Can you imagine the impact this would have on the future of Logos, if they were giving away free Logos programs instead of the Word program!!!

One of their pastors Doug Hamp has a web page that deals with the Word http://thefirstsixdays.com/TheWordBibleSoftware.htm if Logos is interested in what the future could be in electronic bible study and how the local church may use it someone should get in contact with these guys and see what is going on.

Along  these same lines, I personally am using electronic bible study programs to show members of the local fellowships that I attend how to educate everyone and everyone how to study at levels never seen before. 

On top of that I have taught several elders from near bible churches how to use the Word and it is changing their lives, they can not believe the research they can do, without going back to school, they can learn right where they live!   Of course they do not get a degree, but they are more interested in what they can learn than in getting a degree.  These elder have caught on and are giving out free programs to members of their fellowships although they have not gone the next step of showing the members how to use the free programs, right now I end up doing that.

At the present time it is these free packages that allow these programs to get started, but none of these programs have either the features of Logos or the resources of Logos, but they have enough features and resources to change how people learn and they also allow anyone anywhere to start learning at a level only dreamed of before!

In Christ,

Jim

Jim - I appreciate your heart for training people, and I have a few questions.

Something that I have found is that 1) I like computers, so an electronic (local install) or web-based bible study program just makes sense, whereas my wife may never use something beyond bible.logos.com. So I don't know if lack of a free program/free resources, or dislike of using your computer for Bible study is a bigger obstacle for people.  Also because of those who can't/won't afford a laptop, it would be hard for some churches to have a training session (or series) like you describe.  I'm not saying it's impossible, but aren't there more obstacles to broad acceptance of electronic Bible study than merely the cost of software or electronic books?

Also, 2) Bible study takes work and time, regardless of whether you use printed materials or electronic. The tools (ie search functions) cannot substitute for reading, rereading, and thinking about the Bible text. While some kind of brief training in tools would be great, it would have to be carefully structured. Some basic instruction on hermeneutics would be essential to prevent misuse of
the text or the tools, ie looking up a word's definition and picking the one
"I like best" rather than the most likely meaning (see lexicons) in a particular
verse/context.  But you're probably doing some kind of basic hermeneutics training in addition, right?

People also need a framework, and I think a few good concise OT/NT introductions/surveys, some kind of systematic theology, a concise commentary, and a concise Bible Dictionary, plus a few modern translations would help most people understand the Bible far better than they do (quality vs. quantity). It would be great if Logos had an inexpensive package along these lines to help people get started.  Something (not necessarily these) like Paul Benware's OT/NT survey books (not currently available in Logos?), maybe Ryrie's Basic Theology, Holman Concise Bible Commentary, and the ESV, NIV, NASB, as an example. What do you think?

Daniel Lee, first off I have been doing this for several years and I have already seen the results of what happens when folks start studying the Word of God for themselves.  Faith comes from hearing and hearing the Word of God.

You are correct some people are afraid of computers and some can not afford them.

But, Ithe first problem  is usually related to age, the older the person is, the more likely they will fear computers and the younger they are the more likely they are to fear books! 

Kids that would never pick up a bible will read a bible on a computer!  Education goes along way when it comes to training people on how to study the bible on a computer, and I have found that netbooks help older folks to get use to handling computers, and yes I have to start at the very start and show them how to use a computer, how to turn it on and turn it off.  And how they can make the print bigger or smaller!

I personally have my own personal laptops along to loan to those that do not have a lap top.  I also go directly to people's homes to teach them on their desktops.  What ever it takes to get them into the word. I have also seen small groups of believers pitch in and buy computers for those that could not afford them.

Currently one of the big draw backs concerning Logos is the computer requirement, it was not like this with Libronix 3, but Logos 4 will be a much bigger problem.  However with programs like the Word or even E-Sword you don't have this problem.

Also the church itself may want to buy some computers that are inexpensive, and either allow fellowship members to either check them out for home use or allow them to use them on site.

Of course I am not saying that everyone will become a part of such programs, but I am saying I have already seen the results and they are life changing!

As for what you teach, you are right you have got to show them not only how to use the program, but also good bible study methods, and since you control what is being taught and what passages you are using, it is easy to show them good methods and bad methods.

As a Pastor, I liked to preach, but over the years I have discovered I see more results in people's lives, if I lead people to Jesus and let Him teach them.  I no longer preach, I spend my time encouraging believers in Christ.  I spend time teaching them how to study the scriptures and I am confident that the same God that reveals the scriptures to me reveals it to them!

I am big on home bible studies, but a bible study is not a place where some one comes and listens to me or some one else as we tell them what we got out of the scriptures, a home bible study is where a group of us go, to get into to certain passages of scripture and actually apply bible study methods in real time to that passage, we read it through several times, remind ourselves how the passage fits into the over all book, we check out background materials, lookup and read cross references, look up every usage of key words, use dictionaries and lexicons to define key words, plus everything else that comes with bible study.  We actually do it right there!

This has changed people's lives more than any preaching that I have ever done.  I get people calling me up day and night wanting to talk about something they saw at these bible studies that lead them into more bible study at home and they want to share with me what God has shown them!

My little netbook allows me to get into the scriptures with any one any place.  Although my netbook died a few weeks ago when it blew off the roof of my car at 50 mph and was than ran over by another car.  I am saving up for it's replacement because it is such a great tool for the ministry that God has me in.

We have to be open to change and flexible in what we do, our purpose is to lead others to Christ, and then to keep pointing them back to Him.  We desire to get them into the Word and trust Him to change their lives as He has ours!

In Christ,

Jim

I think the idea is to get more people into using Logos to help them in studying the Bible.  Isn't that right?  And in order to do that, people have to know that your product is out there and you have to be able to show them what your software is capable of doing. 

Best way to do that is to make a free or low cost entry package available to people, and you make it easier to use.

OF COURSE this would mean that you will give away 50 free or low cost entry level packages for every 2 people who will upgrade to a higher level package - but so what?

You can't be afraid of attracting low life's who are only seeking free stuff.  That's where I came from. But now I'm at the Scholars Library (L4) level, even though it took some years for me to get there.

The way it started for me was that I was actually given a low cost Logos 3 package (The Norman Geisler Apologetics Library) several years ago, and it sat, basically unused, on my PC for a long time. 

Oh, every once in a while I'd open it up and try to use it but it was difficult to learn.  So, many things to remember to make the Logos 3 program work.  It wasn't just intuitive.  There was a lot of configuring to do before hand.  You couldn't just sit down and start using it to study the Bible.  At least I couldn't.  So every once in a while I'd watch a video of how to use some feature in L3 and each time I did I learned something new and began to use it more and more.

Then I bought the e-Bible package called The Ultimate Bible Reference Library ($20.00 if I remember correctly), and began to use Logos 3 even more.  And now I use the L4 Scholars package.

So, if you really want to grow Logos, you have to increase sales - along those lines, my thoughts are these:

• Advertising - more people need to hear about Logos 4.  I know several who have never even heard of Logos.  Not sure it was such a good idea to remove Logos from the retail market (i.e.; Christian book stores) - at least people were aware that there was a Bible study program called Logos.
• Make an entry level package (free or very low cost).  Right now it is cost prohibitive for many people I know - hence the use of e-Sword and The WORD.  Like it or not, these free programs are part of your competition.  In my experience, I have found that people are hesitant to shell out several hundred dollars without being able to actually "test drive" the software first and see what it can do.
• Make purchasing new (additional) resources less expensive - especially those that are in the public domain already.  Why should people buy them at a premium price when they can have them for free in some of the free Bible software programs out there?
• Include the ability to purchase more resources from within the program (and make it very easy to find and use)
• Make the L4 program even easier (beyond just the Home page) for new users (without dumbing down the product) - include some default entry level layouts so new users can just type in a topic or passage and go.
• Make Logos books available to be read on e-book readers like Kindle and the Sony eBook Reader - this is what people want, and it's only going to increase in the future.

Most of my friends and colleagues could be described as computer geeks (could whip up web sites in minutes writing raw HTML, work in programming or  IT support, advise people, have long technical discussions with Microsoft staff, software purchasers with large budgets and generally spend many hours staying on top of their field) and they are mostly all Bible-believing Christians.

BUT most of them, technically savvy Christians, have never heard of Logos (or those that have are under the impression that it is expensive). I want to ask WHY is that?. They have all heard of e-sword and commonly talk about Quickverse (yes I know...), but don't have much of a clue of the existence or the unique selling points of Logos. WHY?

I wonder if you carried out a survey of every Church-goer to "Name some Bible Software and tell me some of it's features" where you think Logos would rank?

(PS I'm not suggesting you actually do this).

• Do people even know about Logos? If not, why not?
• If they do, WHAT do they know about it? How did they get these impressions?
• How can you correct misconceptions?

Get Logos 4 out into every seminary, bible-school with free scholar's libraries (or equiv) to pastors, students. It's amazing the power of a Pastor's recommendation to his congregation!!

James

PS PLEEEEEEEASE update notes - there has just been posted YET another thread about the lamentable state of them! Perhaps then I can recommend Logos to my techie friends!

James Hudson, you make a point that I did not cover, when I made the jump from free resources like the Online bible, The Sword Project, and E-Sword, to Logos, I did not go directly to Logos, I went to many other products including the one you mentioned first, and part of the reason why did was, I did not know the difference in features offered by Logos, and in many cases the other brands had huge sales on packages that I could afford to buy and try out just to get the copyrighted resource.  My first contact with Libronix did not come from buying a Logos package, but rather one of Nelson's eBible packages at a huge discount.

I still buy many other cheap packaged programs, because I want to see what they are offering and since I try to teach believers how to use bible software, I run into many different programs and I have to know what is going on in order to teach them about the software they are using.

Many people that have these other softwares have no idea how much difference there is between their program and Logos. They bought the program they had because of the lower price and to get copyrighted books or bibles.  However even if there was a Logos program at the same price these people would still not have known there was a real difference and many would have bought what ever their friends had.

So education is still the answer to Logos selling bigger and better products.

I have ended up with Logos because I learned it was better through the school of hard knocks, I have also learned that in many cases when you compare the same level of package in the other brands to Logos, that Logos is the better buy, but for many that does not matter because the buy in price is to high and they don't know the difference in the software anyway. Hey they wouldn't put 899.00 down for Logos or another brand, they don't know the value in either.

i believe the way to reach and teach these people is through the local church rather than seminary.  Focus on the guy they already know and count on, teach Him how to teach them to use these programs, teach Him the value in electronic bible study.  Call Him Pastor or Elder, if you get his attention the rest of the body will hear about.  Seminary and bible schools are also good natural markats, but I think you will miss something just going to them.

The whole body has to see the need to study the Word of God!

Dan I just saw some of your ideas they are great ideas!

In Christ,

Jim

Ok here is my input as a senior .net developer  currently a disabled vet probably a year or two away from entering back into the workforce. It pains me to say that I don't think adding loads of new developers will solve anything. It really relies on two areas architecture, and advisors that is where you can improve a bit in this market. What I would suggest is taking a look at your base packages and improve there in the area of ease of use etc.

I also think it would be wise to consider consulting with the various denominations and theological backgrounds to identify the best commentaries of each or might I say the most recommended from each come up with a strategy to bundle these in your base packages to improve the well roundness of each package ( I find that the main definciency with your product is not enough commentaries come with your base packages) Now for the positive your language ref material is super to say the least, historical background works awesome as well as your graphics illustrations maps charts these are excellent keep up the good work there now all you need is to concentrate on beefing up the theology portion and clear sailing ahead. Also target the average user not the just the seminary students or pastors there are a growing number on non denominational traditionalists out here kepp that in mind. Kudos for logos 4 gold I love it and won't dwell on the bugs because of self condemnation on my developed software (joking plus try as we might MS owns that dep)