Indexing

Hi Keith,

When those more knowledgeable than I find your post, the 1st questions they'll ask are:

1. Please tell us about your setup?
2. Are there any installation and indexing log files you can post? (You may have to enable logging. see http://wiki.logos.com/Diagnostic_Logging)

Blessings, & hang in there. There's real help on the forums...

Can't afford W8 for at least another 4½ years. Does Vista Home Premium consume less SSD than both W7 and XP? I have  fresh W7 and XP installations but it's hard to compare them, which folders should I compare? Downloading L5.2 to the W7 installation right now over an extremely slow connection, resource progress is 64% of 7.06 GB right now: it gets more and more difficult to compare, but I did write down some folder sizes soon after the resource download started. (It's a different machine than the one on which I would install VMWare Player or https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Downloads.

Can allocate it 1.5 GB RAM:

Dave Hooton said:

Windows 8 32-bit is more frugal and try to give it at least 1.5 GB RAM:

Unix said:

Is Vista SP2 the OS that takes the least amount of GB on the SSD? Also have somewhat limited RAM.

Dave Hooton said:

Unix said:

Does Vista Home Premium consume less SSD than both W7 and XP? I have  fresh W7 and XP installations but it's hard to compare them, which folders should I compare?

Windows XP is much more frugal than either Vista or Win 7. Win 7 needs a little more space than Vista - just compare the size of their Windows folders.

Support for XP ends in April 2014. After that any vulnerabilities or bugs, even newly discovered nasty ones, will not be patched against. If you need an OS for the next couple of years, XP is not a good option.

XP support would have ended earlier, except that some big boys reliant on XP prevailed upon MS to extend it a couple of years.

After April of 2014, there will be no more extensions of any sort.

If only things were so simple... [:)]

When I was in touch with CS in the end of the summer, they told me that Logos 5 may run slower than Logos 4 on very old CPU:s. The CPU is an old 2009 or probably a year older Core 2 Duo laptop (the laptop model is from around mid-2009). I could look in the BIOS and see whether it supports virtualization engine acceleration.

Anyway, I've also today finished the download and indexing of Logos 5.2 beta on a desktop machine with Pentium D 3.4 GHz, Windows 7 Ultimate 32-bit, 2 GB RAM and 150 GB HDD. I haven't had time yet to compare how much slower than my other installation it runs - the laptop with an AMD 1.65 GHz two core CPU, Windows 7 Home Premium SP 1, 7.6 GB RAM available and 500 GB hybrid drive 5,400 rpm, (if I have other things running at the same time, such as Word, Basilisk II emulator (with Accordance 9) - takes ~750 MB, and VMWare Player - takes ~800 MB, just to consume some of that RAM). Maybe I shouldn't close IE10 in the AMD laptop while doing the comparison - I have many tabs open right now? I remember how slow this AMD laptop was with 300 GB HDD 5,400 rpm and 1.6 GB RAM available, at first I had L4 installed on it since L5 refused to install, but after a not too long time an L5 engine installation succeeded.

Considering not having other softwares open on the Pentium D desktop and several softwares open on the AMD laptop and many more installed on it, I expect there not to be a big difference:

Dave Hooton said:

Firstly, why not install Logos 5 via the free engine if you have Vista SP2?:

Unix said:

I'm thinking of installing L4 in Windows Vista running under VMWare Player 5.0...

All this time I've been worried how slow will L4 run in Windows Vista SP2 under virtualization? It doesn't have to be fast - I have other installations for that, but of course it's a bit annoying if the mouse moves extremely slow and if scrolling is unbearable. The library button will probably be slow enough. But I expect searches to be fast enough thanks to the SSD and indexing. Typing notes will be very slow, the latest Logos 4.6 engine doesn't have the improved coding of notes, does it? I admit this is a bit bad idea considering speed.

Here follows the benchmark. It was not as exact as possible, (I have no stopwatch):
Start Logos. Importance 5%:
Pentium D, HDD: at least twice as slow!   AMD, hybrid drive:
Click library button and scroll down to the bottom. Importance: 35%:
Pentium D, HDD:               AMD, hybrid drive: opened about 30% slower and about 20% less responsive
Search for the word "justification" in entire library. Importance: 8%:
Pentium D, HDD:               AMD, hybrid drive: 33% faster
Open menus. Importance: 20%:
Pentium D, HDD:               AMD, hybrid drive: about 30% slower
New Clipping. Importance: 2%:
Pentium D, HDD: about 80% faster        AMD, hybrid drive:
Scroll in Encyclopedia of Christianity vol. 1-3. Importance: 30%:
Pentium D, HDD: about 25% faster        AMD, hybrid drive:
RESULT: The Pentium D machine is currently ~8.4% faster.
... I was too lazy to close down Firefox 24.0 in the Pentium D machine during benchmark, 13 tabs open. Both had L5.
... forgot to have Basilisk II, VMWare and Word open in the AMD computer.

I think the reason why the AMD was this much slower, is that it has Office 2010 Starter installed and that there's many times more GB used on the disk (probably due to previous, removed, installations by the previous owner) and also because there's a few games, an unwanted web browser add-in which I've been unable to remove, something which is an almost malware (doesn't cause viruses but slows down computer), and Skype still installed.

Conclusion: Considering that despite the more than twice as high GHz the Pentium D machine was only ~8½% faster, and one task; starting Logos, was at least twice as slow, I conclude that a high age of the CPU has a very high impact on speed when using Logos 5. The AMD CPU is not so new that L5 would get a really big boost.

Well I sure hope that I'll be able to use a USB memory stick in the XP SP3 installation in VMWare that I already have since Sept. 22. 2013, where I have Libronix/Logos 3. I tried a FAT32 -formatted external HDD 7,200 rpm but XP didn't access it. With what file system should I format the UBS memory stick (I currently don't have any so I'm unable to test and I was planning on postponing the purchase of one hoping that I'll find my old one and manage by saving files to webmail meanwhile):

Bradley Grainger (Logos) said:

And disconnect the XP machine from the Internet. It's not just the browser you have to worry about; no security bugs in the OS (including Explorer, AutoRun, file sharing, print drivers, the TCP/IP stack, etc.) will be fixed at all.

(As soon as the Microsoft Security Update comes out in May 2014, hackers will reverse engineer it to find out all the bugs that were fixed in Vista and above, then attempt to exploit those same bugs in XP. They'll do the same in June, July, August, .... It won't be long before attackers will have a wide array of known exploits that will let them get into any XP box. Unless you can find a security software vendor that guarantees to provide protection on XP against these exploits, your only defense will be to make sure the machine has no Internet access.):

Dave Hooton said:

Just get another browser to replace Internet Explorer!:

Lee said:

If you need an OS for the next couple of years, XP is not a good option.

Workaround: can install a customizable firewall and set it to block everything except the webmail for transferring files and the servers for needed for keeping Logos software and books up-to-date, right?:

Bradley Grainger (Logos) said:

And disconnect the XP machine from the Internet. It's not just the browser you have to worry about; no security bugs in the OS (including Explorer, AutoRun, file sharing, print drivers, the TCP/IP stack, etc.) will be fixed at all.

.NET 3.5.1 seems to be included in all installations. Adding 4.5 will use up some disk space, I think it's like 40 MB (probably a little more after all the MS security patches to it) when I look at Control Panel - Programs in a W7 Professional installation that doesn't have much else than Office 2010. That's not a whole lot of course. But it's starting to seem like I won't be able to install in a virtualization engine in the Core 2 Duo machine at all, because of SDD space limits and space needed (I haven't done a calculation yet):

Bradley Grainger (Logos) said:

1) Logos 4 ran under .NET 3.5; Logos 5 uses .NET 4.5. Microsoft is always improving the .NET Framework and increasing performance is one of their goals, e.g., http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/hh882452.aspx 

I guess it's too late for deleting the profile. There's no documents, music or pictures from the previous owner. I doubt I'll get rid of those unwanted programs. I read about them on the internet and it said that those particular ones are very hard to remove. Chrome seems to be more insecure than IE10 on this machine. Perhaps the first thing to do would be to clean the registry - but I don't know of any reliable small installation that would take care of that (I don't think I want to install a whole antivirus security suite)? I have used Malwarebytes on it for a while - since the end of the winter. I run Roguekiller once in the end of the winter and it seemed to remove a few things. There's also MS Security Essentials, free McAfee Security Scan Plus, and: http://quickscan.bitdefender.com/?autostart=1 ... all of which I run regularly, McAfee not that often.

I haven't been able to locate the Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool in the computer but have kept it up-to-date. The language in the OS in this particular machine is Swedish (=svenska).
It seems to install basically everything from Windows Update. I think I did however skip the latest .NET 3.5.1 security updates since I updated from L4 to L5.
Windows Firewall is working correctly.

It's a shame that this computer is not working faster as it's my most expensive computer:

Dave Hooton said:

Get or use MS Fixit Program Install/Uninstall to remove unwanted programs. If it comes with the previous owner's Profile then create your own Admin User Account and get rid of the previous profile/account; tick the option to remove its data files (documents, music, pictures, etc)