Notes and Highlighting have become useless

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 2:29 PM

Whyndell 

Whyndell Grizzard:

Graham

Not sure how your system is working- it does not matter what I highlight- it ends up under "notes" if I turn notes off- I lose my highlighting- in order to restore highlighting- I have to tick notes on- THEN- untick every other note file- since I "ONLY" want highlighting to show up.

I tried to explain above that I understand the issue you are describing. But that I don't think I have seen anyone express a similar use case before. At the moment I don't believe there is any option but to turn off the notes files you don't want to be enabled.

I have asked that someone from Faithlife comment on this thread but, as it is the weekend, it may be some days before they do.

Graham

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GregW | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 2:48 PM

Whyndell Grizzard:
Not sure how your system is working- it does not matter what I highlight- it ends up under "notes" if I turn notes off- I lose my highlighting- in order to restore highlighting- I have to tick notes on- THEN- untick every other note file- since I "ONLY" want highlighting to show up.

This isn't actually the case - if you click on the three circles at the top of the pane, go down to Notes, on the right-hand side of the Notes heading there is an option to unselect all - this unselects all notes. You can then just check the highlighting palettes you want to use. I think you can also set all your highlighting palettes to use the same notes document, which would make your workflow a two-click process. I did try providing a screenshot to illustrate, but I'm afraid I ran into a problem and don't have time to do it at the moment. 


Running Logos 6 Platinum and Logos Now on Surface Pro 4, 8 GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 3:10 PM

GregW:
This isn't actually the case - if you click on the three circles at the top of the pane, go down to Notes, on the right-hand side of the Notes heading there is an option to unselect all - this unselects all notes

GregW - great point, I wasn't aware of that

Whyndell - if you have all your highlights in notes files reserved only for highlights does this address your issue?

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 3:29 PM

Really John- I have spent the last 2 days trying to find a way that my highlights would not be affected by notes- there is none, without an ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF REWORK- TO ONLY HAVE TO REPAEAT EVERYTIME YOU DO SOMETHING.. 

The fact that I highlight and have to go to notes to not have it affected by notes- by LITERALLY- unticking every note for that particular resource is asinine.

I should ONLY have to untick notes to eliminate NOTE files- not have everything disappear.

And MIKE- not broken? it is sorry you can't see it, you must be another Faithlife worshipper who can see no wrong they do. 

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 3:45 PM

GregW:

Whyndell Grizzard:
Not sure how your system is working- it does not matter what I highlight- it ends up under "notes" if I turn notes off- I lose my highlighting- in order to restore highlighting- I have to tick notes on- THEN- untick every other note file- since I "ONLY" want highlighting to show up.

This isn't actually the case - if you click on the three circles at the top of the pane, go down to Notes, on the right-hand side of the Notes heading there is an option to unselect all - this unselects all notes. You can then just check the highlighting palettes you want to use. I think you can also set all your highlighting palettes to use the same notes document, which would make your workflow a two-click process. I did try providing a screenshot to illustrate, but I'm afraid I ran into a problem and don't have time to do it at the moment. 

You hae to unselect notes, the scroll down and choose your pallet- and you have to do this with every resource!

My highlighting HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY NOTES! notes is just notes my highlighting has to do emphasis and memorization. 

Thats why its so insane to have this way- you are forced to go in and do this on every resource you read through and highlight- with out making one single note in it.

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Doc B | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 6:14 PM

Graham Criddle:
GregW - great point, I wasn't aware of that

I wasn't either, or had forgotten.  Very useful.

Part of the problem with the implementation of highlights/notes is, there is not any good documentation that is easily understood unless you know the software jargon. The current implementation allows a much higher level of user control, and I like that; but it comes at the expense of ease of use, as Whyndell has duly noted.

Where I wish FL would make a tweak to the current implementation is to add a category to the documents menu for 'Highlights', and take these files out of the 'Notes' category. The implementation of resource-specific files has been a huge improvement, but it comes at the cost of a really long list of notes files in that category, and many of those are simply highlights for specific resources. It makes my actual note files that much harder to find.

Here's hoping.

In the mean time, Whyndell, to try to help, I'll write another post explaining how I do what you are trying to do. It'll be yours to take or leave, but maybe it will help ease some of your frustrations. (The level of frustration in linearly related to the cost of the software which is frustrating...and for most of us, in Logos, that goes pretty high.)

My thanks to the various MVPs. Without them Logos would have died early. They were the only real help available.

Faithlife Corp. owes the MVPs free resources for life.

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Doc B | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 6:47 PM

Doc B:
Whyndell, to try to help, I'll write another post explaining how I do what you are trying to do. It'll be yours to take or leave, but maybe it will help ease some of your frustrations.

OK, here's what I do to avoid some of the same frustrations you have. This'll be a bit long, but its because I'm adding a lot of pictures.

First, I created a special highlighting palette for highlighting my books. Here's a list of my palettes with that one in a red box-

When I open the palette you can see some of the styles I've created. You can make as many as you like (or as few).

One important thing to do here is to click the dropdown in the title bar of your palette and choose 'Resource-specific note file' in the Save-in area.

Now, when you are reading, you can use the palette to add highlights, and they will go into a note file which is identical to the title of your resource (book).

Now HERE is where some frustration might come in, and how to avoid it.

Since you've chosen 'Resource-specific note file' for your HIGHLIGHTS, if you decide to add a note (not a highlight, but a real note), you'll highlight a word/phrase and right-click, and the only option you are presented is your RESOURCE-SPECIFIC NOTE FILE. If you put the note there, you cannot turn off notes and keep your highlights turned on (as others have suggested in this thread) *because they are the same file*.

So to keep that from happening, before you start reading, open a DIFFERENT note file and put it in a small corner somewhere in your layout. In this example, I have a note file called 'Questions' open below my resource-specific note file that contains my highlights (which is called 'Chosen by God' because that's the name of the book I'm using in this example).

You can see my highlights (underlines) and one of those bothersome note flags where I've added a note. When I drag over text to add one of my highlights, I choose the highlight style I want from the palette. If I drag over text to add a note, I can right-click and choose my 'Questions' note file to add the note there; it will be an option in the context-menu since that file is open in the layout.

But now, since I've put the note in a separate file, I can turn OFF the notes and LEAVE MY HIGHLIGHTS ON, here-

I hope you find this helpful. Feel free to ask questions where I've been unclear. I try to stay away from jargon but sometimes it slips in anyway.

My thanks to the various MVPs. Without them Logos would have died early. They were the only real help available.

Faithlife Corp. owes the MVPs free resources for life.

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 19 2015 8:52 PM

Whyndell Grizzard:

My highlighting HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY NOTES! notes is just notes my highlighting has to do emphasis and memorization. 

I agree with you that functionally a note and a highlight are different.  However I do also get from a programmatic point of view notes and highlights are both the same thing - an annotations of  selected text with the differences only being in whether we turn on a flag so show/hide a note icon, whether or not  the selected text his 'highlighted' using either a) the  note colour or b) a formatting style from a palette, and whether or not the 'text' field for that annotation is left empty - as in a highlight, or populated - as in a note.

I don't see them going and changing that design anytime in the near future - but happy for them to prove me wrong - so I don't' see notes and highlights appearing under different sections of the visual filter menu anytime soon.  I think the wording on the menu is incorrect and it should say annotations.  Having say notes does muddy the waters when as users we think of notes and highlights as different things and using the parent name of annotation makes more sense.

So given that I don't know if you have tried the option below to try and alleviate the frustration you are having with your workflow:

Whyndell Grizzard:

You have to unselect notes, the scroll down and choose your pallet- and you have to do this with every resource!

Whyndell I thnk I am understanding your issue better.  When you uncheck a note file in a specific resource have you tried using the option available from the drop down at the end of a document name to opt out of showing that document in any resource ?

I personally have not used it so I can not say if it will get you closer to your workflow, but to me if I choose that option then that annotation will not show up in any resource and I should not have to unselect it in every resource, I simply have to unselect it once in the first resource.

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 3:01 AM

Ok DC some of what you show I have been trying- but its the continous in every resource you use you go through this, so I tried something different.

I took one of my pallets and renamed it by putting "1" in front of it- so far it has not appeared in notes- under the 3 circle - the old name remains- it does not affect highlights whether ticked or unticked- so ticking or unticking notes DOES NOT AFFECT my highlighting.

Now I just have to live with highlights being enabled- all the time.

Sooner or later I'll find a work around for that.

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 3:18 AM

Whyndell Grizzard:

Ok DC some of what you show I have been trying- but its the continous in every resource you use you go through this, so I tried something different.

I took one of my pallets and renamed it by putting "1" in front of it- so far it has not appeared in notes- under the 3 circle - the old name remains- it does not affect highlights whether ticked or unticked- so ticking or unticking notes DOES NOT AFFECT my highlighting.

Now I just have to live with highlights being enabled- all the time.

Sooner or later I'll find a work around for that.

Well that didn't work- for some reason after about 10 minutes the new named pallet showed up under notes. Well wasted enough time on this- better spent moving notes to MSW- at least that way ONLY hilites will be under notes, maybe I'll put all my notes in Wordsearch, BibleWorks or Accordance I have all 3- don't have this issue there.

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Doc B | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 10:58 AM

Whyndell Grizzard:
I took one of my pallets and renamed it by putting "1" in front of it- so far it has not appeared in notes- under the 3 circle - the old name remains- it does not affect highlights whether ticked or unticked- so ticking or unticking notes DOES NOT AFFECT my highlighting.

If you have 'resource-specific note file' enabled, then what you are seeing is happening because Logos will simply re-create a new file with the old name.  You'll find your highlights going into the file without the 1. Since nothing is being put into the file with the 1, it won't appear in the drop-down list. Only items with content appear there.

My thanks to the various MVPs. Without them Logos would have died early. They were the only real help available.

Faithlife Corp. owes the MVPs free resources for life.

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 11:43 AM

I have gotten 50% of my notes moved out of L6- moved to MS.This way highlighting will just be hiliting in L6- notes will be in MS. 

This way when I click notes on or off it will only affect the highlighting I have done on books and bibles.

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 11:44 AM

I'm through with Faithlife.

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Levi Durfey | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 11:59 AM

Doc B:

OK, here's what I do to avoid some of the same frustrations you have. This'll be a bit long, but its because I'm adding a lot of pictures.

Doc B, I wanted to thank you for your detailed post. The main point is use Resource Specific Note Files, and only use them for highlighting. Use other note files for "regular" notes.

I had been doing this for my Bible highlighting and Bible notes, but I think now I will expand using separate note files for all my books. I particularly like the idea of having a "Questions" note file—I think it will be neat in a few years to look back over all the questions that I asked in different resources; maybe I'll find an interesting pattern.

Anyway, thanks for helping me use my notes and highlighting better.

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 12:10 PM

The thing- I don't think anyone is getting- I don't highlight for specific notes- I just hilite for different reasons- I could care less about attaching hilites to a specific note.

So like I said notes are being moved out of L6 so I can just use highlighting without all the extra work and annoyance of note files, everything will just be highlighting.

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John Goodman | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 2:44 PM

Whyndell, its up to you if you are 'through with faithlife'.  I already posted above showing how to have one notes file for all your highlights which highlights go into by default. How is that any different from having a separate notes feature?

If you are really keen to have your notes in no way attached to a resource then just add them without selecting text or use a clippings document. Is a clippings document what you are after?

It is possible to take notes and do highlights in Logos and keep them separate. It's a good design for a number of reasons. IMHO it lacks a good quote+note view but that's a whole other story. If it's not your thing then that's up to you...

גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה

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SteveF | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 3:32 PM

Whyndell Grizzard wrote:

"My highlighting HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY NOTES! notes is just notes my highlighting has to do emphasis and memorization"..."I don't highlight for specific notes- I just hilite for different reasons"

Dear Whyndell:  I do agree with you.

[and thanks for your participation going back to the old "bulletin board "days]

Since this highlight/note change I, too, like you, do not really like the "new" system.

Therefore I have made few, if any notes. And almost all of my [real/actual] notes are in Word.

I now only highlight.

There are some things in Logos where I am willing to do all of these extra steps needed. But NOT for notes.

Sorry for your frustration.

Regards, SteveF

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 20 2015 7:30 PM

Whyndell Grizzard:

The thing- I don't think anyone is getting- I don't highlight for specific notes- I just hilite for different reasons- I could care less about attaching hilites to a specific note.

So like I said notes are being moved out of L6 so I can just use highlighting without all the extra work and annoyance of note files, everything will just be highlighting.

Wyndelll I do get what you are saying. I don't highlight for notes either.  As I have said the label in the visual filters drop down is incorrect.  It should say annotations not notes - that causes a lot of confusion about the design of the software. 

From a technical point of view notes and highlights are annotations with different flags and fields of the same basic object being populated.  From a functional point of view - the way we use them note and highlights a very different. 

I would prefer to see them treated separately in the user interface but they are not and I have worked around that fact.  Others here to have tried to help you work around that fact.  There are things that this company does that don't sit well with me, there are aspects of the software design that really frustrate me so I do understand why you feel like walking away - but I encourage you really think it through.  If you have a genuine alternative software program that can meet all your needs and in particular this need which you feel in not being met then I wish you well. But despite the things I don't like, the company practices I abhor - and there are some of those - I know if I went to an alternative company I will find things there I don't like about that software, and company practices that I don't agree with - they might be different but they will exist.

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Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 21 2015 2:35 AM

DOC-

it took 20 yrs to get them to add functionality to Notes- then they RUIN it all by this move- there is no way to turn "notes" off and keep your highlighting, without going back in and re-ticking the individual HL pallet or the resource you are in.

This is required on everything you do- THERE IS NO OTHER WAY. It is tedious and again- just plain stupid. the ability to turn notes and highlighting need to be separate- in the sense if you turn one or the other off or on - does not affect the other. And this is specifically egregious when it involves the bible text.

Posts 5309
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 21 2015 4:14 AM

Whyndell Grizzard:

DOC-

it took 20 yrs to get them to add functionality to Notes- then they RUIN it all by this move- there is no way to turn "notes" off and keep your highlighting, without going back in and re-ticking the individual HL pallet or the resource you are in.

I know the pain we went through on the old Logos Newsgroups to get Bob Pritchett to understand notes were not up to scratch in Libroinx and based on what we have today its clear he never really got it - because if he did we would not have the design we have today.

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