TIP of the day: Added words in translation

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Oct 13 2015 9:39 PM

We all understand that a word in one language may require multiple words to translate into another language ... and that this is not "added" words as there is no added information. In fact, when I translate ἐστέ as "you are", I may be loosing information if the context does not make it clear that a plural subject you is intended.

However, we are less clear in those cases where the LEB flags a word as "added" what is going on. However, Logos provides the tools for us to track it down.

1. For an example, we will take the final "him" in Matthew 27.31 - shown here in both the ESV and the LEB.

2. Note the LEB has an asterisk noting the added word. Notice popup.

3. So why the added pronoun? The note indicates that it is to supply a direct object. If you read the sentence without a direct object in English, you will feel the language is "stilted". To verify this gut reaction of a native speaker, one can check the Case frames for English verbs from Martha Palmer's site.

As you can see all the frames in English require a patient role (direct object) so that an English sentence without a patient is semantically ill-formed.

4. However, as the BWS Case Frames for the Greek shows, in Greek the verb does not require a patient although it often takes the same forms as the English frame.

So the question is: in translating does moving information from implicit to explicit in order to meet the semantic role requirements of the target language "adding words"? I personally don't think so and prefer the terminology "making the implicit, explicit". I prefer to reserve "added words" to refer to things not required in moving from the source language to the target language. Just like I don't think of "grammatical gender" as something lost in translation when it doesn't exist in the target language (English).

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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James Taylor | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 13 2015 9:59 PM

MJ. Smith:
may require multiple works to translate
think you mean "words" :-)

MJ. Smith:
in Greek the verb does not require a patient although it often takes the same forms as the English frame.

interesting MJ.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 13 2015 10:42 PM

Thanks, I've fixed it ... but it may have been a slip Wink

Sanskrit allows word compounding of arbitrary length. Nouns and verbs can be expressed in one word. The longest word ever used in Sanskrit literature is (in Devanagari):

निरन्तरान्धकारित-दिगन्तर-कन्दलदमन्द-सुधारस-बिन्दु-सान्द्रतर-घनाघन-वृन्द-सन्देहकर-स्यन्दमान-मकरन्द-बिन्दु-बन्धुरतर-माकन्द-तरु-कुल-तल्प-कल्प-मृदुल-सिकता-जाल-जटिल-मूल-तल-मरुवक-मिलदलघु-लघु-लय-कलित-रमणीय-पानीय-शालिका-बालिका-करार-विन्द-गलन्तिका-गलदेला-लवङ्ग-पाटल-घनसार-कस्तूरिकातिसौरभ-मेदुर-लघुतर-मधुर-शीतलतर-सलिलधारा-निराकरिष्णु-तदीय-विमल-विलोचन-मयूख-रेखापसारित-पिपासायास-पथिक-लोकान्

In IAST transliteration:

nirantarāndhakārita-digantara-kandaladamanda-sudhārasa-bindu-sāndratara-ghanāghana-vr̥nda-sandehakara-syandamāna-makaranda-bindu-bandhuratara-mākanda-taru-kula-talpa-kalpa-mr̥dula-sikatā-jāla-jaṭila-mūla-tala-maruvaka-miladalaghu-laghu-laya-kalita-ramaṇīya-pānīya-śālikā-bālikā-karāra-vinda-galantikā-galadelā-lavaṅga-pāṭala-ghanasāra-kastūrikātisaurabha-medura-laghutara-madhura-śītalatara-saliladhārā-nirākariṣṇu-tadīya-vimala-vilocana-mayūkha-rekhāpasārita-pipāsāyāsa-pathika-lokān

from the Varadāmbikā Pariṇaya Campū by Tirumalāmbā,[24] in transliteration composed of 431 letters, thus making it the longest word ever to appear in worldwide literature.[25]

Each hyphen separates every individual word this word is composed of.

The approximate meaning of this word is:

"In it, the distress, caused by thirst, to travellers, was alleviated by clusters of rays of the bright eyes of the girls; the rays that were shaming the currents of light, sweet and cold water charged with the strong fragrance of cardamom, clove, saffron, camphor and musk and flowing out of the pitchers (held in) the lotus-like hands of maidens (seated in) the beautiful water-sheds, made of the thick roots of vetiver mixed with marjoram, (and built near) the foot, covered with heaps of couch-like soft sand, of the clusters of newly sprouting mango trees, which constantly darkened the intermediate space of the quarters, and which looked all the more charming on account of the trickling drops of the floral juice, which thus caused the delusion of a row of thick rainy clouds, densely filled with abundant nectar."

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Rodney Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 14 2015 4:32 AM

Really Enjoy these MJ..   I copy them into Word and create a PB of them.  Geeked

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James Taylor | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 14 2015 5:58 AM

Rodney Phillips:
I copy them into Word and create a PB of them

care to share? :-)

Logos 8  | Dell Inspiron 7373 | Windows 10 Pro 64, i7, 16GB, SSD | iPhone X | iMac 27" i7, 16GB, SSD | OS 10.13

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Rodney Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 14 2015 9:58 AM

I could.. Its kind of messy now. I just save each one in a word doc..   Pretty easy to do.  Cool

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