Touch Functionality

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This post has 11 Replies | 6 Followers

Posts 80
Daniel R Bartholomew | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Dec 30 2015 2:11 PM

I was wondering if Logos 7 (or another update of Logos 6) will incorporate more touch functionality.  There is some, which I appreciate, but more would be better.  It's nice having the full app on my Windows tablet, but better touch functionality would be nice.  It's a bit frustrating that my Android Logos app is a lot smoother in touch functionality than the full desktop version.

Posts 765
David A Egolf | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 30 2015 2:44 PM

Daniel R Bartholomew:

I was wondering if Logos 7 (or another update of Logos 6) will incorporate more touch functionality.  There is some, which I appreciate, but more would be better.  It's nice having the full app on my Windows tablet, but better touch functionality would be nice.  It's a bit frustrating that my Android Logos app is a lot smoother in touch functionality than the full desktop version.

I just received a Surface Book for Christmas and I am noticing the same thing.  I also have issues with procedures which require a <right-click> menu since my finger doesn't have a <right> button!

I will be following this thread to see if there are some suggestions.

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Reuben Helmuth | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 30 2015 3:06 PM

David A Egolf:
I also have issues with procedures which require a <right-click> menu since my finger doesn't have a <right> button!

Does a "long tap" not work to "right click"?

Posts 765
David A Egolf | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 30 2015 7:39 PM

Reuben Helmuth:

Does a "long tap" not work to "right click"?

Thank you!  I had been trying to use a long press on the pen button.  The long tap works much better.  Even better, it seems to work with both my pen and my finger.  However, in order to perform a select with my finger, I had to set the panel to multiple columns so that the text would not scroll.

Coming from reading on an iPad, it is quite a difference for note taking.  I seldom want the title of the note to be the highlighted text.  On an iPad I would select, highlight (making sure that the correct note file was selected, first), tap on the highlight to select it, copy it, tap it again to make it into a note, paste the copied text into the body of the note, add my own comments, and finally, type an appropriate title for the note.  I am treating my note file like a clipping file so that the notes will be readable without referring to the resources.

Knowing that long tap is a right click gets me a long way towards what I need.

Thanks, again.

Posts 2842
Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 30 2015 9:37 PM

It is really surprising and disappointing to me that Logos lags behind on touch functionality.  At least for Windows, touch is the future.  It is seldom that Logos is just not getting it, but this is one time they do not get it.

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

Posts 765
David A Egolf | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 30 2015 10:10 PM

Michael Childs:

It is really surprising and disappointing to me that Logos lags behind on touch functionality.  At least for Windows, touch is the future.  It is seldom that Logos is just not getting it, but this is one time they do not get it.

Over in the Windows App forum there are some very painful threads showing that Logos was attempting to supply an application suitable for early Surface models.  These early models had problems.  Even now Windows 10 is just finding its way with touch screens.  It may be awhile before Windows catches up to Apple in this area.  I don't think it is fair to fault Logos in this area.

I have had Apple, Microsoft, and Android systems.  Each has its strengths, but Apple products do have most of the best user interface features.  Apple IOS is much more user friendly than Android,  For instance, while I was typing this paragraph on my Surface Book using the keyboard, the screen blinked, the whole Firefox window "adjusted", and a couple of tones sounded.  After the tones, I found that my focus had been stolen by something which was probably trying to provide some sort of notification.  I have no idea what it was and I have no idea where the keystrokes went after the focus was stolen and prior to my noticing.  On Apple operating systems I never have my focus stolen and it is, thus, safe to type into an application without paying attention to the screen.

Apple iPad's have a wonderful magnification popup that assists you in placing a cursor.  Android only wishes they could accurately place a cursor.  So far, Windows has been placing the cursor under my finger, but the resolution is so high and the fonts are so small that it is hard to even place it on the correct line.  That is why MS supplies a pen.

So, I guess I just wanted to defend Logos and say that I think the fault is with Windows; at least so far.

Posts 146
Ross Strader | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 1 2016 1:58 PM

David, 

I hope I'm not changing gears of this post, but I am very curious about your Windows 10 experience and a touchscreen laptop with your Logos use. 

I have used the MacBook Pro since the relationship with Intel. I have not considered a PC in almost a decade, but I find myself tempted by Windows 10, touchscreen and the "2 in 1" concept. 

I am able to do a fair amount of Logos reading on my iPad. I can also, with split screen, write a sermon on my iPad. I preach from the iPad. I find my MBP is still the goto spot for searching and heavy lifting in Logos. 

So, I guess my question is:

1. What is your Windows 10 feedback in relation to Logos on Mac OS?

2. Your "touchscreen" experience so far. 

3. How do you feel about the Surface as a "tablet?"

Thank you for your time on this matter!

Ross

MacBook Pro 15' Retina  •  2.7 GHz Intel Core i7  •  16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3  •  Version 10.10

Posts 2704
DominicM | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 1 2016 3:32 PM

if its selecting text -that's driving you nuts -  go to program settings and choose "Smart" for your text selection

Click first word, press shift on keypad, and then click on last word and it will highlight selection, was driving me nuts before I figured it out..

Currently IMO, you need a laptop with touchscreen rather than tablet, have a 32gb Toshba Encore 8" with 1gb ram running win 10, love it, its slow (2mins to apply visual filter on bible on first load) but it works, indexing is a nightmare 4 days (due to low specs) , but use it 70% of time.

Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have

Posts 765
David A Egolf | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 1 2016 4:32 PM

Ross Strader:

David, 

I hope I'm not changing gears of this post, but I am very curious about your Windows 10 experience and a touchscreen laptop with your Logos use. 

I have used the MacBook Pro since the relationship with Intel. I have not considered a PC in almost a decade, but I find myself tempted by Windows 10, touchscreen and the "2 in 1" concept. 

I am able to do a fair amount of Logos reading on my iPad. I can also, with split screen, write a sermon on my iPad. I preach from the iPad. I find my MBP is still the goto spot for searching and heavy lifting in Logos. 

So, I guess my question is:

1. What is your Windows 10 feedback in relation to Logos on Mac OS?

2. Your "touchscreen" experience so far. 

3. How do you feel about the Surface as a "tablet?"

Thank you for your time on this matter!

Ross

1. I have not used Logos on Mac OS. My Mac experiences were in the '90s prior to my use of Logos.  My Apple experience with Logos is on an iPad.  I started with a Gen 1 and now use an iPad 3.  I like Logos on the iPad a lot.  I have done most of my reading and note taking on the iPad.  I do my research an lesson building on a desktop.  For organizing lesson presentations I have resorted to mind map software suggested by others on this forum.  I actually present mind maps rather than Power Point slides.  It allows the students to see the flow of the presentation where slides are "flat".

2. As I related, I find the touchscreen on the Surface Book to be lacking even with the pen.  I think it will be impossible without the pen due to the small text (which is wonderful, otherwise).

3. If I can work out a suitable paradigm for taking notes, I will probably migrate my reading to the Surface Book.  However, for the last few days (where I just got this beast) I have docked the tablet any time that I wanted to take extensive notes.  Fortunately, this is easy to do as long as the keyboard is close.  For purposes of battery consumption I may just turn the Book around in the dock when I use it as a tablet.  That will also guarantee that I can attach it to the keyboard easily.  I am not doing that now simply because my first attempt to reverse the docking resulted in a locked up machine which I could not undock without calling Microsoft support.  The solution was a hard boot by depressing the power button for 30 seconds.  But I really don't want to go through that again under my current circumstances.

The Surface Book is a screaming machine.  I find it as responsive as my desktop or even better.  This is probably due to the solid state disk.

Since Windows 8, the text to speech is greatly improved.  I have listened to several hours of Beale's NIGTC commentary on Revelation with no problem.  I think the Windows 10 is even better.  This is big for me since I will use it while I am exercising by walking or on my elliptical.

I am just a new user of the Book.  One of the folks in our Phoenix Logos Users Group (PLUG) asked me about the suitability for his wife.  I advised him that I was going to reserve judgment for a couple of weeks until I had a chance to investigate usage cases.  For instance, the idea of a long press for right click was very useful and gave me a leg up on a lot of things.  So I'll make you the same offer.  Ask me again in a couple of weeks on this thread and I'll update my status.  I'll make you the same offer. (As an aside, I have a big problem with the wide touch pad on the keyboard.  While I was preparing this reply, this entire paragraph somehow magically disappeared.  Thankfully, I remembered <CTRL>-Z.)

David

Posts 765
David A Egolf | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 1 2016 4:39 PM

DominicM:

if its selecting text -that's driving you nuts -  go to program settings and choose "Smart" for your text selection

Click first word, press shift on keypad, and then click on last word and it will highlight selection, was driving me nuts before I figured it out..

Currently IMO, you need a laptop with touchscreen rather than tablet, have a 32gb Toshba Encore 8" with 1gb ram running win 10, love it, its slow (2mins to apply visual filter on bible on first load) but it works, indexing is a nightmare 4 days (due to low specs) , but use it 70% of time.

With my dual core i5 processor and 8GB of RAM I have no problem with speed.  I'm not sure about Windows 10 requirements, but I would not attempt to run Windows with anything less than 4GB.

I loaded my entire library the day after Christmas.  The indexing for 2000 books was done in about 3 hours.  It didn't slow anything up, so I didn't think to time it.

Thanks for the help with selecting, but due to long-standing biases about how software should behave, I refuse to employ "smart" text selection.  I have too many cases where I really do not want to select entire words.  I usually want the computer to select exactly what I tell it to do.  Also, my selection issues are in tablet mode where I do not have a keyboard.

Posts 602
Bill Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 1 2016 4:42 PM

Logos must be redesigned for use with tablets, and not just with high-end hardware like the Surface Pro 4, but with lower-end hardware like the Surface 3. Other Bible programs work well on tablets like this, but Faithlife is so heavily invested in WPF that they can't or won't cut ties and build a more flexible and scalable platform. We want our full library, including personal books, and the full feature set available to us on these devices. 

Posts 33
Rodney Ochs | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 4 2016 5:13 AM

David - great feedback. I am also interested in your surface feedback as you learn and gain more experience in the weeks to come. If you have a chance, Im interested in the mind map program you mentioned. Thanks 

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