4 King James Version in Logos

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This post has 36 Replies | 2 Followers

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 6 2021 7:06 PM

Jerry Rockwell:
The publishers do what they want to with the text of the KJV. There have been word changes and other alterations

This has been true from the beginning which is why there is no ur-text Authorized version. Not to mention all those without the apocrypha.deuterocanonicals is untrue to the original.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 6 2021 10:09 PM

Jerry Rockwell:
The only KJV Bible I have access to is the KJV 1900, KJV (WS) and the KJV Cambridge Paragraph. I tried to find a place to make it "one line per verse" but that too does not exist.

The KJV (WS) can be made into a single verse per line, however I do not when this is done, the chapter numbers disappear in the example below of Psalms for chapters 3 onwards.

Image

Posts 11
Jerry Rockwell | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 7 2021 6:00 AM

I have been a TR advocate because I have compared the "Majority Text" of Hodges and Farstad and they take a lot of liberties and even have some Critical Text readings that are not easy to find. At one time Zane Hodges was a "Majority Text" advocate and at that time it was a reference to the TR. That was changed when he and Farstad published the Greek Testament According to the Majority Text with Thomas Nelson. As far as I am concerned it is an eclectic text of the Greek NT. Hodges goal was to produce a Byzantine text with a critical apparatus which he accomplished but if one checks the apparatus they will find some of the Critical text readings creeping in. Just a thought. I am glad you use the Majority Text and hope your tribe increases. There are not many around and that probably explains Thomas Nelson not producing any further editions. Also, the two editors are both deceased. 

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David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 7 2021 7:04 AM

Jerry Rockwell:
The only KJV Bible I have access to is the KJV 1900, KJV (WS) and the KJV Cambridge Paragraph. I tried to find a place to make it "one line per verse" but that too does not exist.

But it DOES EXIST and you already have it!

Although the KJV (WS) does not identify itself as a 1769. A few months back somebody did a comparison of different KJVs and the WordSearch edition appears to be the 1769. As I show below, the KJV (WS) CAN be displayed in a one verse per line.

I do not know which of these are currently available. Some were included in earlier Logos bundles and the WS is not available for purchase, but came over in the transition. I CONCUR that it is difficult to find many of these in the Logos Website [sometimes I have to search for KJV, King James, Cambridge, Authorized, etc.) But to accuse Faithlife of an anti-TR bias when I have 7 different resources in this translation family seems (in my opinion) a little harsh.

Additionally, I found an English KJV that is included in a bundle from the Brazil Bible Society - Authorized King James Version | Logos Bible Software 

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 7 2021 8:33 AM

David Thomas:

I do not know which of these are currently available. Some were included in earlier Logos bundles and the WS is not available for purchase, but came over in the transition. I CONCUR that it is difficult to find many of these in the Logos Website [sometimes I have to search for KJV, King James, Cambridge, Authorized, etc.) But to accuse Faithlife of an anti-TR bias when I have 7 different resources in this translation family seems (in my opinion) a little harsh.

I'm smiling. First, using the FL site, you describe your concurance with the chaotic KJV situation. Then, describe 7 different resources, of which most(?) can't be purchased ... which ones kind of demands already having them. And this conversation goes back .... way, way back. Some participants are already in Heaven reaping their rewards. And lastly (as with most older resources; Bibles, OL), it's quite difficult to determine what FL is using as a source (doesn't just pick on KJV, whew). Then ... there's the FL blog ... and  ... the FL forum.

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Kolen Cheung | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 7 2021 4:33 PM

Jerry Rockwell:

I KNOW THIS POST WAS A LONG TIME AGO, BUT THE MODERN "Logos" software does not have the 1769, 1873 available. Also they have changed the KJV 1900 to match the "New Translations" layout. For instance, the "Song of Deborah" in Judges 5 is laid out by the new translations as if it is poetry. Logos has made the KJV 1900 to look the same. No KJV Bible has ever had that scripture laid out as a poem. It is clearly prophecy. Maybe they are trying to condition KJV users to accept the new translations.

Thanks for reviving a ~11.5 yrs old post! It is interesting to see my own naïve questions that long ago (and having others addressing them nicely anyway.)

Others has said a lot already. Just to sum up

1. Regardless the "specially formatted version" of Bible you have, Logos ultimately gave the end user the power to format it the way you want. This is a very useful feature, especially combined with something like discourse analysis, etc. that you may find multiple different "visual filter" useful in different situations.

2. It is simple to speculate Logos somehow is evil and trying to impose their bias on you. But trust us they have no ill intent. And if you give them the benefits of doubt first and you'll find it easier to resolve/understand the problem you're dealing with. Claiming Logos is "anti-JKV", "treating WS customers differently", etc. may sounds like an easy answer to an apparent situation. But in the real world Logos is a business and what you said is anti-business. It will be hard to understand, in terms of business, how Logos can becomes such a large Bible software company if they are doing that. In the end, it is hard to be completely bias-free. I'm certain they are trying hard to be bias-free and please everyone. If only all the users are doing just that (to be bias-free) though.

IMHO, anyone who cling to the past and think JKV is somehow the best; Authorized version is somehow "the only authorized version", Majority is the best, TR is the best, whatever, is a huge bias limiting their potential growth. To be bias-free, I think it is fair to say that all Bible translations has their pros and cons (each has their own unintentional bias, some are limited by the knowledge of their time), all manuscripts should be judged by what it is (certainly text types should be one of the factor but not the final one.) For those who believe otherwise, I think it is their responsibility to argue why such believe is not a bias.

P.S. there's now 6 different JKVs in my library. Some said 7 and I'm not sure which one I'm missing. May be the only actual "new version" is the recent conversion from WordSearch:

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 7 2021 11:22 PM

Shall we now debated the TR vs. PATr?

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 6:38 AM

MJ. Smith:

Shall we now debated the TR vs. PATr?

It could be tricky to stay within the forum guidelines. That said, Logos does offer both editions of TR and an edition of PATr, so you can compare their differences

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Jerry Rockwell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 8:21 AM

This is going to be my final post on this issue. A couple of the participants speak of having 6 or 7 editions of the KJV and I do not doubt that. They probably have if from being a long time user of Logos. I am new to the program and find that only three editions of the KJV are available to me. Because I am a Word Search customer being transported to Logos I have access to the KJV (WS), the KJV 1900 (evidently formatted by Logos staff) and the Cambridge Paragraph edition. The only question to Logos is why do you not want to provide KJV editions that the customer has a desire to use, especially if they had copies of it earlier? Thank all of you who have tried to help me with the problems I have with Logos and those who have helped me with operating the software. God bless you and have a good day.

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Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 10:41 AM

There are 1,069 items available listed under king james. You might find something here.

https://www.logos.com/search?query=king%20james&sortBy=Relevance&limit=15&page=1&ownership=all&geographicAvailability=availableToMe

Posts 1054
Kolen Cheung | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 12:19 PM

Jerry Rockwell:

This is going to be my final post on this issue. A couple of the participants speak of having 6 or 7 editions of the KJV and I do not doubt that. They probably have if from being a long time user of Logos. I am new to the program and find that only three editions of the KJV are available to me. Because I am a Word Search customer being transported to Logos I have access to the KJV (WS), the KJV 1900 (evidently formatted by Logos staff) and the Cambridge Paragraph edition. The only question to Logos is why do you not want to provide KJV editions that the customer has a desire to use, especially if they had copies of it earlier? Thank all of you who have tried to help me with the problems I have with Logos and those who have helped me with operating the software. God bless you and have a good day.

I feel your pain. It is not a problem specific to King James Version. E.g. consider different versions of a version, say, NASB. They have revisions, and people cannot buy older revisions or original version. That's a bigger problem (beyond formatting) that they cannot e.g. research how the different revisions has evolve over time. A quick search shows all 3 revisions of NASB are currently available here, but the same probably is not true for other translations.

Another example is Peter O'Brien's books. We can't buy them anymore.

Those I mentioned is basically a problem from the publishers—they do not wish to sell them anymore due to various reasons.

For those KJVs, I'm not sure why. But there are reasons behind it. Again, calling it "anti-KJV" is one (conspiracy) theory, but on the other hand, especially given the context (that this post 11.5 yrs ago is asking why they are so many copies of seemingly the same version), another possible reason is just that they want to deduplicate (and trust that their "visual filter" feature is good enough to replicate other formats.

But who knows, and why should you care about it? At least you have the one from WordSearch that you have been using and works for you.

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Kolen Cheung | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 12:20 PM

Dale E Heath:

There are 1,069 items available listed under king james. You might find something here.

https://www.logos.com/search?query=king%20james&sortBy=Relevance&limit=15&page=1&ownership=all&geographicAvailability=availableToMe

This is (unintentionally) deceptive as NKJV is included.

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 3:09 PM

Faithlife has provided to you what you had in Wordsearch, both myself and others have demonstrated how to change the formatting to what you desire. So I and others don’t understand your issue.

Jerry Rockwell:

This is going to be my final post on this issue. A couple of the participants speak of having 6 or 7 editions of the KJV and I do not doubt that. They probably have if from being a long time user of Logos. I am new to the program and find that only three editions of the KJV are available to me. Because I am a Word Search customer being transported to Logos I have access to the KJV (WS), the KJV 1900 (evidently formatted by Logos staff) and the Cambridge Paragraph edition. The only question to Logos is why do you not want to provide KJV editions that the customer has a desire to use, especially if they had copies of it earlier? Thank all of you who have tried to help me with the problems I have with Logos and those who have helped me with operating the software. God bless you and have a good day.

Posts 1054
Kolen Cheung | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 3:12 PM

He does mention

DIsciple II:
The only question to Logos is why do you not want to provide KJV editions that the customer has a desire to use, especially if they had copies of it earlier?

which is not entirely unreasonable. (And I hope I‘ve answer that in some way.)

Posts 125
Darrell Tan | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 8 2021 6:24 PM

Yes, to be fair to the OP, visual display is not so straightforward. I tried getting Judges 5 (one of the passages mentioned) to be displayed as it would in a verse-per-line print version, and I can only do it with the Wordsearch KJV text, not the KJV1900 one. In the latter, the poetic line breaks remain. I think a proper verse-by-verse edition should be made available as it is with the NASB1995, which comes in two downloads.

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 9 2021 2:51 PM

But it does exist in Logos.…

Kolen Cheung:

He does mention

DIsciple II:
The only question to Logos is why do you not want to provide KJV editions that the customer has a desire to use, especially if they had copies of it earlier?

which is not entirely unreasonable. (And I hope I‘ve answer that in some way.)

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 9 2021 7:12 PM

Kolen Cheung:

He does mention

DIsciple II:
The only question to Logos is why do you not want to provide KJV editions that the customer has a desire to use, especially if they had copies of it earlier?

which is not entirely unreasonable. (And I hope I‘ve answer that in some way.)

For the same reason that people wanting the Knox Bible can't get it, or wanting the Community Translation can't get it, or wanting the original Jerusalem Bible can't get it (and they need it for liturgy), or ... you get the picture.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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