Purchased resource quietly removed this morning from my library (and probably yours)!!

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Posted: Sun, May 29 2016 5:16 AM

I noticed that there was 'preparing library' activity this morning when I started Logos, and I discovered it had removed a resource (I think it's terrible that licenses are removed without any notification, but that's another issue).

I discovered using Steve Clark's LLR utility that the resource removed was Luther’s Commentary on the First Twenty-Two Psalms, part of the The Precious and Sacred Writings of Martin Luther collection that I purchased.

You may find it has been removed on your library too, I suspect this was some system-wide issue because...

There have been other issues with this collection, see this thread. In that thread you will see Matthew Miller said that the Lenker version of the 22 Psalms Commentary we were issued appears to have never been completed, but FL was going to produce and give us the Cole edition, which is very nice of them. However, he doesn't say the Lenker edition would be removed though, is that what happened?

I am not sure what has happened, can someone form FL comment on why this resource was removed?

Thanks

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 29 2016 3:00 PM

Don Awalt:
You may find it has been removed on your library too

yep, confirm.

I was part of that thread back then. Hopefully the removal of this resource is just the first step of Faithlife delivering the complete "Precious and Sacred Writings" of Martin Luther to us. 

Running Logos 9 latest (beta) version on Win 10

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 29 2016 5:00 PM

Don Awalt:
I discovered using Steve Clark's LLR utility that the resource removed was Luther’s Commentary on the First Twenty-Two Psalms, part of the The Precious and Sacred Writings of Martin Luther collection that I purchased.

At the risk of making myself a target for removal, I still have it.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Matthew Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 29 2016 6:39 PM

Sorry about the confusion here everyone.

Here's what's going on:

Shortly after The Precious and Sacred Writings of Martin Luther shipped we discovered that the resource we produced as Commentary on the First Twenty-two Psalms only covered Psalms 1–8. The original series published back in the early 1900s produced a few versions of this commentary, and we ended up with an incomplete edition.

Once we discovered this problem we ran down the complete commentary and put it into production. We then updated the product accordingly. 

It will ship to you once it is complete. It is prioritized, should it be delivered soon.


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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 29 2016 6:59 PM

Matthew Miller:
Here's what's going on

OK, but here is what <should> have happened:

  1. Owners should have been emailed when this was discovered, with the remedy. 
  2. Owners should have kept the current resource... If for no other reason than they may have created notes in the resource.
  3. Owners should be emailed when the new resource is released, prompting them to hide the resource if they so choose. 

There is no excuse for what has happened. 

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 29 2016 7:21 PM

alabama24:
There is no excuse for what has happened. 

Exactly.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 29 2016 8:45 PM

I think it's okay to retire resources which were produced in error. Those are extenuating circumstances.

However, users should always be kept informed, so that any notes can be migrated.

Posts 2857
Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 5:25 AM

Thank you Matthew for the update.

To Faithlife, I really think an underlying issue is that licenses can be removed without any notification to users. It is the electronic equivalent of someone taking a book off your shelf and not telling you, no one would appreciate that if their library was as extensive and crucial to our activities as the Logos library. How hard would it be to offer a notice in the top right corner when a resource is removed? 

This is not a library with a small finite number of books that you can eyeball to see if something is missing. It is being designed to be large, extensive, and to be used through numerous more sophisticated search/analysis tools. So if something you thought was useful to add to your library is no longer there, it will be very difficult for most users to know.

This doesn't even consider the normal vendor-customer protocol that if something given is taken away there should be communication. What if the airline voided your ticket and didn't tell you, and you only found out when you tried to scan the ticket at the gate? 

Without third party tools a mistake could occur, a license inadvertently turned off, unforeseen ramifications of changes in subscription status could occur, and no one would know.

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Matthew Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 9:40 AM

It's standard practice to send notifications anytime we update a collection or make any kind of change to your library. In this instance there was an unexpected delay between when the resource was pulled, the new resources added, and when the notification was to be dispatched. I apologize for this delay.

The assumption I operated on is that no one would want the incomplete commentary, and obviously that was a faulty assumption on my part for a few reasons.

I'll add the original version that downloaded when The Precious and Sacred Writings of Martin Luther shipped back to your libraries, and also keep the full version in there as well.

Again, my apologies for not getting the email out and for any inconvenience you incurred in having the resource removed.

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EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 9:44 AM

Matthew Miller:


I'll add the original version that downloaded when The Precious and Sacred Writings of Martin Luther shipped back to your libraries, and also keep the full version in there as well.

Thank you.

Posts 215
David J. Wilson | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 9:50 AM

George Somsel:
At the risk of making myself a target for removal, I still have it.

If you click on the listing in your Library, you may find that it comes up with a page saying

"This resource is no longer in your library."

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 10:02 AM

Matthew Miller:

It's standard practice to send notifications anytime we update a collection or make any kind of change to your library. In this instance there was an unexpected delay between when the resource was pulled, the new resources added, and when the notification was to be dispatched. I apologize for this delay.

The assumption I operated on is that no one would want the incomplete commentary, and obviously that was a faulty assumption on my part for a few reasons.

I'll add the original version that downloaded when The Precious and Sacred Writings of Martin Luther shipped back to your libraries, and also keep the full version in there as well.

Again, my apologies for not getting the email out and for any inconvenience you incurred in having the resource removed.

Thanks a lot, Matthew. 

Running Logos 9 latest (beta) version on Win 10

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 10:09 AM

alabama24:
OK, but here is what <should> have happened:

I remember once that it was reported that Amazon had removed a resource from Kindles.  While I was not affected, I was not happy about it because it seemed possible that Amazon might come in any time and remove something I had purchased.  I wrote to them expressing my unhappiness.  When they wrote back it was with the explanation that the person uploading the work did not have the rights to it.  It seems that there is usually an explanation.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 10:11 AM

David J. Wilson:

George Somsel:
At the risk of making myself a target for removal, I still have it.

If you click on the listing in your Library, you may find that it comes up with a page saying

"This resource is no longer in your library."

Nope, still there.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 2589
Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 10:20 AM

Matthew Miller:

I'll add the original version that downloaded.

I can't speak for this situation, but there should be times when it's simply better to withdraw the resource entirely.

Posts 215
David J. Wilson | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 10:36 AM

This thread provides some additional background re this collection:

https://community.logos.com/forums/t/125559.aspx?PageIndex=1

Posts 250
Colin | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 11:40 AM

Thanks Matthew. 

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 30 2016 1:33 PM

Thank you Matthew.

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 1 2016 12:50 PM

It's BAAAAAACK! (original/Lenker  incomplete version that is). Thanks again Matthew.

Posts 250
Colin | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 4 2016 1:54 AM

I'm a little disappointed because I still don't have that resource (the partial Psalms commentary) in my library. I'm also a little confused about what I ought to have at this point, given all of the input to the thread referred to above. I currently have 10 Lenker resources in my library. Do the rest of you have 11? 

Thanks, 

Colin. 

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