How Will Logos/Faithlife Handle This?

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This post has 191 Replies | 11 Followers

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 11:45 AM

Todd Phillips:
You probably get more in resale value now that the books are off the market

Only problem—You cannot break a set.

Posts 147
C.E.H. | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 12:19 PM

Josh:

I believe we should be able to keep these books AND get a small credit back. Just saying...

Only problem: That's a decision from Eerdmans not Faithlife, but you can write Eerdmans a mail

Posts 5637
Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 1:14 PM

Jack Caviness:

Todd Phillips:
You probably get more in resale value now that the books are off the market

Only problem—You cannot break a set.

D'oh.  Solution: Sell the whole set - rebuy current set.

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Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 1:33 PM

Best solution: Sell your entire Logos library and re-buy all your books in paperback. I'm sure CBD misses your business! 

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Everett Headley | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 1:41 PM

ah CBD...its been so longs since I even got  flyer from them...

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Fred Chapman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 1:48 PM

Everett Headley:

ah CBD...its been so longs since I even got  flyer from them...

I remember when they used to sell Libronix software.

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 1:49 PM

Everett Headley:

ah CBD...its been so longs since I even got  flyer from them...

Really?  I still get catalogs monthly, and I haven't bought from them in 10 years(?).   Sometimes I get two at a time.

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Justin Gatlin | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 1:54 PM

Todd Phillips:

Everett Headley:

ah CBD...its been so longs since I even got  flyer from them...

Really?  I still get catalogs monthly, and I haven't bought from them in 10 years(?).   Sometimes I get two at a time.

They're somewhat consistently cheaper than Amazon, but I find the tagging of paperbacks pretty poor. 

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Fred Chapman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 1 2016 2:12 PM

The CBD Visual Filter tool

Posts 542
Jonathan Bradley | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2016 4:22 PM

Everett Headley:

I'd like to know what the return value would be before making a decision.  Academically, it's dead to me.  Pastoral lyrics there's probably still value.  However there are other books I'd value more in Logos.

I agree with this as well. 

Posts 937
LogosEmployee

Quick update (sorry to be brief but I'm out of the office):

We will be working with Eerdmans to offer credits for those who want to return them. If you want to keep them you can--we will not take them away from you.

There are a few details we need to work out on our end to figure out the credits (e.g. dynamic pricing considerations).

When I get back in the office I'll work on getting something put together and post here with our plan.

Thanks!

Senior Director, Bible Study Products

Posts 2231
Kenneth Neighoff | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 10:27 AM

Thanks Paul for posting the link to the Porter article. 

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 11:23 AM

Paul-C:

a superb analysis of the situation. Thank you for the link.

Posts 934
Matthew | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 12:36 PM

Sean:
At most I'd perhaps like a note on the resource information panel that the publisher had later withdrawn the book.

Ben, any comment on whether this might be an option? Maybe even in a different font color so it stands out?

Posts 461
Bill Cook | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 12:46 PM

Jack Caviness:

Paul-C:

a superb analysis of the situation. Thank you for the link.

Indeed!

Posts 8938
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 4:18 PM

Bill Cook:

Jack Caviness:

Paul-C:

a superb analysis of the situation. Thank you for the link.

Well said Mr. Stanley, well said!!! I'm keeping my copies too! 👍

Let the weak in conscience return their copies...hehehe...😜

Indeed!

Posts 1523
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 4:56 PM

Everett Headley:

ah CBD...its been so longs since I even got  flyer from them...

I'm not sure how they are still in business. Perhaps a large part of their income now comes from selling Christian homeschool material. Which, by the way, I believe Faithlife/Lexham/Vryso should try their luck at.

As for the topic at hand, I've decided to keep my commentaries, but still wish they would refund "partial" credit back to those who bought them and want to keep them. This needs to be the third option. I don't mind paying for the books, but the price I originally paid was based on the original academic value this resource was suppose to provide. Since this academic value has decreased, so should the original price paid. 

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 6:18 PM

Josh:
Since this academic value has decreased, so should the original price paid. 

As Stanley Porter pointed out in the linked article, O'Brien merely did what almost every other commentary writer does. He just got called out for what is —to all intents and purposes—normal practice. If the academic value of his commentaries is decreased, then honesty would require that the academic value of 95% of all other commentaries should also be decreased.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2016 6:50 PM

Jack Caviness:
O'Brien merely did what almost every other commentary writer does. He just got called out for what is —to all intents and purposes—normal practice.

Okay, I stayed out of this but . . . The concept of an author owning their work is quite new - think 4 centuries or so ... So much of Porter's argument is anachronistic. Even so, ancient authors often specify their sources, when the resources to do so were available ... think of the authors we know only from the quotes in other authors or the the catenas ...

As for the self-evident point that current commentaries draw on the knowledge of previous commentaries without always giving credit, remember the rule of thumb for when information is "common knowledge" and therefore no longer requires attribution: "Generally speaking, you can regard something as common knowledge if you find the same information undocumented in at least five credible sources. Additionally, it might be common knowledge if you think the information you're presenting is something your readers will already know, or something that a person could easily find in general reference sources."

There are more subtle forms of plagarism beyond n consecutive words copied: see http://usingsources.fas.harvard.edu/what-constitutes-plagiarism

I fully accept the explanation that work flow created the problem ... it is very easy to develop such work flows with the ease of web access and copy & paste. But any undergraduate should have the rules in their head by the end of their first year. And sloppy work habits may well be indicative of sloppy thinking habits. So sorry, I have no sympathy for an author who got caught for multiple publications having refractions.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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