Logos on eInk/eReader Device

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This post has 129 Replies | 15 Followers

Posts 59
Eric Ruhnow | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 4 2016 5:01 PM

Honestly, the return of the Send to Kindle feature would be my preferred option (it was one of the determining factors for my initial L6 purchase). I really would prefer to not have to spend more money on "yet another device".

However, I seriously doubt that will return (I can only imagine the licencing nightmare this caused with Publishers due to the fact that the files produced were unencrypted and could be shared by unscrupulous people).

I really like Logos, but my schedule of late does not give me much time to sit at my computer and use the main program. I've always wanted a simple, plain reader to be able to access my Logos books on the go (have a 1hr one-way commute as a passenger). Send to Kindle filled that role perfectly, until it was removed. Now, my only real (supported, and inexpensive) option would be to pick up a tablet, but with the way my eyes are, glossy screens get very difficult to focus on for longer than a few minutes.

The app.logos.com route is not an option for me, for multiple reasons.

  1. I'm not rarely around an available and open WiFi network when not at home
  2. I have an EXTREMELY small data plan on my phone (plus there is the whole glossy screen and screen size issues)
  3. app.logos.com is currently behind the Logos Now paywall, which is not really in my budget (plus, I really don't like the rent-a-dataset route)

However, I would reconsider Logos Now (or a new subscription option), if it brought back Send to Kindle (as long as all titles that can be accessed through Android/iOS apps could use the Send to Kindle feature).

Lenovo TS130 Xeon E3-1245V2 | 20GB | 256 GB SSD (OS and Logos) | 3TB WD Red | Windows 10 Pro x64

L4 & L5 Platinum, L6 Gold, L5 Reformed Gold, L6 Reformed Bronze, L7 Lutheran Silver, L7 Reformed Starter, L7 Full Feature Set

Posts 4264
LogosEmployee
Kevin Byford (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 4 2016 5:40 PM

Eric Ruhnow:
Honestly, the return of the Send to Kindle feature

This thread isn't about Send to Kindle but about running the full Logos App on an E-Ink device, and whether or not there is enough customer interest for us to potentially improve the experience. Please help us keep this thread on topic.

Please post any Send to Kindle issues to https://community.logos.com/forums/t/123765.aspx .

Posts 59
Eric Ruhnow | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 4 2016 5:49 PM

Sorry, Kevin, I was writing while your previous "please keep on topic" was going up.

Lenovo TS130 Xeon E3-1245V2 | 20GB | 256 GB SSD (OS and Logos) | 3TB WD Red | Windows 10 Pro x64

L4 & L5 Platinum, L6 Gold, L5 Reformed Gold, L6 Reformed Bronze, L7 Lutheran Silver, L7 Reformed Starter, L7 Full Feature Set

Posts 427
Mark Nolette | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 4 2016 6:53 PM

I have run the Verbum app on the Boyue T62+ and the Onyx Boox C67ML. The Icarus you have here is similar to these two. In fact, I believe that the Icarus is actually a rebranded Boyue device. The Verbum/Logos app runs pretty well, as a rule, on these devices. I would be interested in seeing if something could be done with contrast and colors, as some links come up as very light gray on an eInk device. Maybe a grayscale theme that could be selected to replace the default color scheme? This would also help with highlighting. 

A second way that our FL team could help improve the mobile app experience on an eInk device would be to see if the app could interface with the physical page turn buttons on devices that have such buttons. That could make page-turning and scrolling easier. Some Android reading apps do work with the physical page turn buttons, while others do not. 

Like others have said, my main concern is that all these eInk devices run Android 4.2.2.  As of now, this is not a problem for the Logos/Verbum mobile app. It could be a problem if the mobile app requires a newer Android version. One possible way around this would be if Logos/Verbum Now continues to develop its website, so that one could use one's browser to access one's library, run a passage guide, and so on with an eInk device. 

Another problem is that some eInk devices seem to lack some hardware acceleration functions that the mobile app requires. The Onyx Boox C67ML runs the Logos/Verbum app just fine, while the Onyx i86 does not. Not all eInk devices are created equal. Anyone who wants to buy an Android eInk device with the intent of running the Logos/Verbum app needs to be aware of this. 

Posts 32
Benny | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 10:10 AM

Interested!

Posts 41
Fr. Nicklaus Winker | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 12:06 PM

I am interested. I had an early version of the logos app working on a e-ink nook years ago. I think simple things to make e-ink work better; physical button support, better color dithering, turning off animations, would help us get even more value out of our logos investment. 

Posts 170
NYSERVANT | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 12:13 PM

I'm Interested

Posts 170
NYSERVANT | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 12:15 PM
Would it be crazy to have a "logos reader" that is a designated device? Not sure how all that works but just throwing that kind of an idea out :)
Posts 25
Kevin Maples | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 12:22 PM

I'm extremely interested. e-Ink is so much easier on the eyes. I love my Paperwhite, but can't sync highlights etc... I'd be willing to invest in a e-Ink device if I could get Logos functionality like my iPad.  

Posts 427
Mark Nolette | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 2:31 PM

NYSERVANT:
Would it be crazy to have a "logos reader" that is a designated device? Not sure how all that works but just throwing that kind of an idea out :)

Not crazy at all! The folks at Logos could approach one of the companies that makes Android eInk devices and request a custom device that meets certain specs (recent Android version, generous internal storage, for example). If enough Logos users are interested and willing to buy into such a device, one of these companies might be willing to do it. If users of other Bible software Android apps were interested, that increases the potential market even more. It's a bit of a long shot, but not impossible by any means.  Actually, for some of these devices, a custom device might mean simply a more recent version of Android (5.0? 6.0?) to insure long-term compatibility with the Logos app. However, if the Logos app can maintain its current minimum requirement of Android 4.1, we're good with what's out there now.  

Now that I think of it, the Nook Glowlight Plus runs Android 4.4.  However, it would need some kind of hardware or settings upgrade to run Logos. People who have tried it get the infamous black screen when they open many resources. But the folks at B&N could use more customers for their device, so maybe they would be open to some dialogue about this.  

Posts 72
Andrew116 | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 5:53 PM

Logos could write a slimmed-down version of their app specially for e-ink readers? I would be interested.

Think about it: everyone who owns a kindle (which is me) spent money on a device to read books from just one retailer (Amazon). I have a bigger library on Logos than on Amazon... I would be prepared to spend a little to have my Logos library easily accessible on a better reading platform!

Logos' #1 edge on it's competitors, for me anyway, is how nice the reading experience is. In an industry of electronic BOOKS, being distinguished by a pleasant reading experience is a pretty good competitive advantage. Worth the investment, I say!

Posts 471
Leo Wee Fah | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 6:18 PM

Yes, that would be an excellent reading experience!

Posts 130
NK | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 6:33 PM

Definitely interested.  Wondering if one of the big guys (A or B&N) would be interested in selling some of their hardware to FL.  Answer:  Unlikely.

Posts 2616
Jan Krohn | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 5 2016 8:46 PM

NK:

Definitely interested.  Wondering if one of the big guys (A or B&N) would be interested in selling some of their hardware to FL.  Answer:  Unlikely.

Sure they wouldn't. They're competitors.

"Small guys" that primarily focus on hardware, would be a lot more likely. Onyx has produced branded devices for ebook companies before. Icarus might possibly do the same.

I'd be highly interested in running the Logos app on an up to date eInk device, however, only under two conditions:

1. minimum Android 5.0, so that ongoing support for another couple of years is secured.

2. SD card support so that a large portion of my library would fit on it.

A connector for ear plugs would be a nice bonus.

Past IT Consultant. Past Mission Worker. Entrepreneur. Future Seminary Student.
Why Amazon sucks: Full background story of my legal dispute with the online giant

Posts 250
LogosEmployee
Daniel Di Bartolo | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 6 2016 2:21 PM

Thanks for the feedback, everyone!

Here's what we're hearing from you all:

  • Many of you like the idea of reading Logos resources on an e-ink device. 
  • Many of you are concerned that buying this device might lock you into an Android version that we may stop supporting in the future
  • You might be interested in simplified version of the Logos app on an e-reader

We will continue to have internal discussions about potential ways  to distribute Logos content on e-ink devices. However, we are not recommending that you purchase this Icarus e-reader due to the fact that it's running an older OS which we will likely drop support for in the six months.

The purpose of this post was to gauge general interest and to hear feedback from those who have a particular interest in e-reader devices. 

Thanks for your candid, detailed feedback. We'll use it to fuel our further discussions and will make sure to let you know if we come across a really good option for you in the future. 

Cheers,

-Daniel Di Bartolo, Mobile Product Manager

Posts 2047
Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 6 2016 8:00 PM

Just another thought...

Why not explore having your own "kindle app" that an be installed on any tablet, phone, desktop that would have the functionality where we could download resources we own and read them in that app.  Why cant the Vysro app for example be the reading app that (like Kindle), can be installed on many devices.  Kindle would not allow such an app on their machine.  I understand that.  Apple and Microsoft also might not allow such an app on their systems.  But android e readers would.  This would be very appealing to many.  We already have an app for tablets and phones.  Why cant that same app be available for android e readers?

Posts 1518
Forum MVP
Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 6 2016 11:18 PM

Daniel Di Bartolo:

We think we've found a good option for those of you who prefer reading in that format-- the Icarus e-reader.

Daniel Di Bartolo:

However, we are not recommending that you purchase this Icarus e-reader due to the fact that it's running an older OS which we will likely drop support for in the six months.

I am very interested in using an e-reader for the app, and was hoping to buy an e-reader specifically for Verbum this year. I was very happy to see an unofficial suggestion of a good e-reader for the Verbum / Logos app... and am now sad to see that unofficial recommendation taken back. I hope better support for e-readers, or at least one or more specific e-readers such as the 8" Icarus, can be had in the future. If that meant a simplified version of the app for e-ink to support Android 4.2 for longer without slowing development of the main app, I would be all for it!

I also support the suggestions mentioned on this and other threads - hardware button support, better contrast, and an option to turn off page-turn animations to improve performance.

Daniel Di Bartolo:

Thanks for your candid, detailed feedback. We'll use it to fuel our further discussions and will make sure to let you know if we come across a really good option for you in the future. 

Cheers,

-Daniel Di Bartolo, Mobile Product Manager

Thank you for your positive and constructive style! Great to see that in Android discussions in the forums from a Faithlife representative.

Posts 2616
Jan Krohn | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 7 2016 1:50 AM

Fr Devin Roza:
I am very interested in using an e-reader for the app, and was hoping to buy an e-reader specifically for Verbum this year. I was very happy to see an unofficial suggestion of a good e-reader for the Verbum / Logos app... and am now sad to see that unofficial recommendation taken back.

Don't worry about it too much. If support ends in 6 months, that doesn't mean the reader/Verbum app will stop working from one day to the next.

All that's gonna happen is that you won't receive any app updates/new features, and that any resources that are released after Android 4.2 end of support can't be installed on the device.

If you're interested in using an e-reader, just go for it. It's agreat investment.

I'm still running an ancient Logos version on my Android 2.3 device, and it's still just about sufficient for daily use. More than 95% of resources are still running on that system, even most of what came with L7 Bronze.

Past IT Consultant. Past Mission Worker. Entrepreneur. Future Seminary Student.
Why Amazon sucks: Full background story of my legal dispute with the online giant

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Forum MVP
Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 7 2016 3:18 AM

Jan Krohn:

Don't worry about it too much. If support ends in 6 months, that doesn't mean the reader/Verbum app will stop working from one day to the next.

All that's gonna happen is that you won't receive any app updates/new features, and that any resources that are released after Android 4.2 end of support can't be installed on the device.

Thanks, Jan. Sounds like good advice. I had actually just recently (about two weeks ago) taken a look at the current e-reader market and was leaning towards the Icarus 8" device for Verbum anyway, so I was glad to see that confirmed as a good option by Faithlife. 

Posts 339
Steve Farson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 7 2016 9:43 AM

Daniel Di Bartolo:

....

Thanks for your candid, detailed feedback. We'll use it to fuel our further discussions and will make sure to let you know if we come across a really good option for you in the future. 

Cheers,

-Daniel Di Bartolo, Mobile Product Manager

Daniel... Please do.  Let us know if FL has come across "a good option." 

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