OT: Don't let Logos programmers see this ...

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Dec 15 2016 6:15 PM

Rev. Franklin Graham told CNN's Carol Costello that he backs President-elect Donald Trump's plan to bring back manufacturing jobs because people are not proud of modern jobs in computer science.

Thank heavens in the Pacific Northwest parents brag about their children's jobs in high tech. And from personal experience I can vouch that there is very little as satisfying as an elegant programming solution to a difficult problem.

So let's give a shout out for the Faithlife programmers and make sure they are proud of their work - if they take pride in their work the quality will be high

Yes, this should also include the programmers exiled to the Southwest.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 15 2016 7:21 PM

Two shouts for me ... the dynamic pricing coding ... that's amazing (if complex). I wish Anazon did that. And the coding that keeps my L7 150 book layout cruising along. That too is amazing.

I can't agree on exile in sunny Arizona. I aim to get a Mac whose sole use will be to enjoy Logos 'made in Arizona'!


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Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 15 2016 7:37 PM

MJ. Smith:

Rev. Franklin Graham told CNN's Carol Costello that he backs President-elect Donald Trump's plan to bring back manufacturing jobs because people are not proud of modern jobs in computer science.

Thank heavens in the Pacific Northwest parents brag about their children's jobs in high tech. And from personal experience I can vouch that there is very little as satisfying as an elegant programming solution to a difficult problem.

So let's give a shout out for the Faithlife programmers and make sure they are proud of their work - if they take pride in their work the quality will be high

Yes, this should also include the programmers exiled to the Southwest.

I wholeheartedly agree MJ.  While not decrying manufacturing jobs (which I have experienced) for people, many people in IT can be proud of their achievements. Faithlife programmers and designers in particular have every right to be proud not only of the innovation they bring, but also to the many lives that are changed through their work as people study, share the gospel and teach others about God's Word using what they have provided.    Keep well Paul

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JAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 15 2016 10:16 PM

MJ. I am disappointed, the misrepresentation of Franklin Graham's statement is so far below your norm. I never thought I'd see false witness, lying, spreading false reports, etc., ever from you.

Here is a link to the source I used to evaluate what you posted, on the page there is an embedded video clip of the pertinent interview so anyone can hear what Franklin Graham actually said: https://www.rawstory.com/2016/12/franklin-graham-pray-for-trump-to-succeed-because-theres-no-pride-in-computer-programming/

I still can heartily join you to give Faithlife programmers a shout out, though I hope all Faithlife employees take pride in the work they do, even those who don't want to be computer programmers.

"The Christian mind is the prerequisite of Christian thinking. And Christian thinking is the prerequisite of Christian action." - Harry Blamires, 1963

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 15 2016 10:37 PM

JAL:
MJ. I am disappointed, the misrepresentation of Franklin Graham's statement is so far below your norm. I never thought I'd see false witness, lying, spreading false reports, etc., ever from you.

Sorry I disappointed you. There was certainly no misrepresentation intended and certainly no "false witness, lying, spreading false reports". The quote is from the article you reference and corresponds with the meaning of the direct quote of Franklin Graham further down re: having taken pride away (as well as hereditary occupation). Note computer programmers build things - those things are called programs - and there are 3rd generation programmers ...Now I have no problem with people not wanting to be programmers but I doubt very much that programmer is the only thing that one can retrain for - at least in our part of the country, building trades, mechanics, ... are also in high demand. If you think Graham's emphasis was on the "hereditary" rather than "pride" part of his sentence, I'm sorry but farriers and scriptoriums come to mind.  But I do insist, as did my rancher father, that there is pride in programming.

“This is terrible. I live in North Carolina where so much of our manufacturing base has gone to other countries,” he insisted. “And people are out of jobs, are out of work. And they say, ‘But we’ll retrain you, we’ll let you be a computer programmer.'”

“They don’t want to be a computer programmer!” Graham continued. “They want to do the same job as their fathers and their grandfathers. There was pride in the manufacturing and the building. And we’ve taken all that away and it’s sad.”

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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JAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 16 2016 12:01 AM

Franklin Graham didn't say people are not proud of modern jobs in computer science.

I can't conceive that you intended malice, though I believe that the quote you selected states a falsehood, and with intended malice in the original conception.

MJ. your efforts are such a great blessing, I won't drag this out further.

"The Christian mind is the prerequisite of Christian thinking. And Christian thinking is the prerequisite of Christian action." - Harry Blamires, 1963

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Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 16 2016 2:22 AM

JAL:

Franklin Graham didn't say people are not proud of modern jobs in computer science.

I can't conceive that you intended malice, though I believe that the quote you selected states a falsehood, and with intended malice in the original conception.

MJ. your efforts are such a great blessing, I won't drag this out further.

I agree MJ's efforts are a blessing - but I don't think your comments were on this occasion.

Overall, MJ's statement was fair and reasonable while by comparison I think yours were not.

Just my personal opinion and nothing more. Keep well  Paul

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