Tagging parameters questioned

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Delta Austin | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Jun 14 2018 12:57 PM

Search for <Person David> NEAR <Person Holy Spirit> in All Bible Text and in All Passages in ESV only brought up results for the New Testament; it did not bring up these verses from the OT:

1 Samuel 16:13 "Then Samuel took the horn of oil and anointed him in the midst of his brothers. And the Spirit of the LORD rushed upon David from that day forward. . . ."

1 Samuel 18:12 "Saul was afraid of David because the LORD was with him but had departed from Saul.

1 Samuel 18:14 "And David had success in all his undertakings, for the LORD was with him.

2 Samuel 7:9 And I have been with you wherever you went and . . .

I did another search but chose from the drop down suggestions, <Sense spirit (God)>. This search resulted in 1 Sam. 16:13, but not the verses in 1 Sam. 18, nor other verses I found only by a time consuming reading of 995 search results for Lord (Match case). I admit in some cases, it is hard to distinguish whether it is the Lord himself or the Lord in the sense of the Holy Spirit, or both, i.e.:

1 Sam. 16:18 One of the young men answered, "Behold, I have seen a son of Jesse the Bethlehemite, who is skillful in playing, a man of valor, a man of war, prudent in speech, and a man of good presence, and the LORD is with him."

1 Sam. 18:28 But when Saul saw and knew that the LORD was with David, and that Michal, Saul's daughter, loved him,

2 Sam. 5:10 and 1 Chron. 11:9 And David became greater and greater, for the LORD, the God of hosts, was with him.

Am I expecting too much that my search using the parameters <Person David> NEAR <Sense spirit (God)> only brought up 1 Sam. 16:13 and 2 Sam. 23:2 and not any of the other verses in 1 & 2 Samuel?

Out of curiosity, I searched All Bible Text in Old Testament in ESV for <Person Holy Spirit> and only got 51 results in 38 verses. When I substituted <Sense spirit (God)> as the parameter, I only got 77 results in 69 verses. Surely the sense of God's Holy Spirit appears more than 77 times in the whole Old Testament.

Why does that search not bring up more verses?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jun 14 2018 1:11 PM

Delta Austin:
it did not bring up these verses from the OT:

I would not expect any Old Testament entries because the concept of a Triune God came with the New Testament. That is not to say that the idea is not implicit in some OT passages but it is not explicit. The tagging is on the explicit meaning.

If your question was mine, I would bring up passages that I thought should be included, see that tagging they have and see if that provided an answer.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jun 14 2018 5:00 PM

Delta Austin:
Am I expecting too much that my search using the parameters <Person David> NEAR <Sense spirit (God)> only brought up 1 Sam. 16:13 and 2 Sam. 23:2 and not any of the other verses in 1 & 2 Samuel?

Spirit  = 80 hits  -->  Match case excludes lower case 'spirit' in ESV

Spirit INTERSECTS <Person Holy Spirit>  = 42 hits

Spirit INTERSECTS <Person God>  = 21 hits  --> represents incorrect tagging, including the verses you mention above.

Note that 4 instances are tagged with both Persons, which means 21 instances (not 17) are not tagged as Person Holy Spirit.  Four of these occur in 1 Samuel in connection with Saul

Dave
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Posts 8
Delta Austin | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jun 14 2018 5:07 PM

M.J., Thanks for your response. How does one see all the tagging of particular verses? I have Visual filters turned on for Community tags, Speaker labels, and Addressee labels, but I don't see anything else applicable.

You are probably right about the tagging being according to the explicit meaning--I must be considering some verses as explicit in context (e.g., 1 Samuel 18:12), whereas the taggers did not. I had hoped this tagging feature would bring up more of the implicit meanings as well as the explicit.

I'm new to this tagged searching, so I'll know now to scroll through all the suggestions. I had expected <Person Holy Spirit> to cover <Sense spirit (God)>, but I can see that there is an OT vs. NT perspective.

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Delta Austin | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jun 14 2018 8:53 PM

Dave, Thank you so much for your input. I can see I have a lot to learn about searching, especially the trick about the INTERSECT Logical Operator. It took me awhile, but I finally figured out how you arrived at your conclusion. So you've proven that not even all the explicit instances have been tagged. Is there a way to report these instances that have not been tagged?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 16 2018 4:16 PM

Delta Austin:
Is there a way to report these instances that have not been tagged?

Yes, from the Context Menu (right-click on selection) choose "Report typo" or more appropriately email the address provided under help -->report a problem. Remember that it is the original Hebrew or Greek that is tagged not the English.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 16 2018 4:21 PM

Delta Austin:
How does one see all the tagging of particular verses?

One can use the right-click Context Menu for the selected passage or open the Information Panel Tool-->Lookup-->Information.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 23131
Forum MVP
Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 17 2018 3:51 PM

Delta Austin:
Is there a way to report these instances that have not been tagged?

I created a Bug report at https://community.logos.com/forums/t/170199.aspx

Dave
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Windows & Android

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