Looking for resources which address this seeming contradiction

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John Kaess | Forum Activity | Posted: Sun, Sep 16 2018 11:00 AM

In Matt 10:33 and Luke 12:9 Jesus says that those who deny him before men, he will deny in heaven. However, Peter denied Jesus and received forgiveness and was instructed to "feed my sheep".

Using the passage guide, the only help i've found addressing this apparent contradiction is in BECNT on Luke 12:9. "In contrast to the idea in the previous verse, the one who denies Jesus before other people will be denied in heaven. The passive mood does not specifically indicate who does the heavenly denying, but it is clear that rejection from heaven is in view. People have two options: to accept Jesus or reject him; there is no neutral position (Manson 1949: 108). But is Jesus referring to a single incident or a pattern in one’s life? Peter’s failure to confess Jesus suggests that one incident is not in view (contra Nolland 1993a: 679). In contrasting Peter with Judas, it might be better to speak of denial of nerve versus denial of the heart. Peter did deny Jesus publicly three times, but he regretted his act and responded later with numerous public declarations of Jesus. Judas denied Jesus through betrayal"

I'd appreciate help finding any other resources which address this or a search which might aid me in resolving this. I have a pretty large library, but i'm just not sure how to approach using it to resolve a conflict between different passages.

Thanks for any help you may have.

John

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Robert Neely | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 16 2018 1:16 PM

here are a couple of basic searches.

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John Kaess | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 16 2018 1:24 PM

Thank you. That's a great start.

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Gregory Lynne | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 16 2018 9:58 PM

10:32–33

32. Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
33. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

CHRYSOSTOM. The Lord having banished that fear which haunted the minds of His disciples, adds further comfort in what follows, not only casting out fear, but by hope of greater rewards encouraging them to a free proclamation of the truth, saying, Every man who shall confess me before men, I also will confess him before my Father which is in heaven. And it is not properly shall confess me, but as it is in the Greek, shall confess in me, shewing that it is not by your own strength but by grace from above, that you confess Him whom you do confess.

HILARY. This He says in conclusion, because it behoves them after being confirmed by such teaching, to have a confident freedom in confessing God.

REMIGIUS. Here is to be understood that confession of which the Apostle speaks, With the heart men believe unto justification, with the month confession is made unto salvation. (Rom. 10:10.) That none therefore might suppose that he could be saved without confession of the mouth, He says not only, He that shall confess me, but adds, before men; and again, He that shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

HILARY. This teaches us, that in what measure we have borne witness to Him upon earth, in the same shall we have Him to bear witness to us in heaven before the face of God the Father.

CHRYSOSTOM. Here observe that the punishment is manifold more than the evil done, and the reward more than the good done. As much as to say, your deed was more abundant in confessing or denying Me here; so shall My deed to you-ward be more abundant in confessing or denying you there. Wherefore if you have done any good thing, and have not received retribution, be not troubled, for a manifold reward awaits you in the time to come. And if you have done any evil, and have not paid the punishment thereof, do not think that you have escaped, for punishment will overtake you, unless you are changed and become better.

RABANUS. It should be known that not even Pagans can deny the existence of God, but the infidels may deny that the Son as well as the Father is God. The Son confesses men before the Father, because by the Son we have access to the Father, and because the Son saith, Come, ye blessed of my Father. (Mat. 25:34.)

REMIGIUS. And thus He will deny the man that hath denied Him, in that he shall not have access to the Father through Him, and shall be banished from seeing either the Son or the Father in their divine nature.

CHRYSOSTOM. He not only requires faith which is of the mind, but confession which is by the mouth, that He may exalt us higher, and raise us to a more open utterance, and a larger measure of love. For this is spoken not to the Apostles only, but to all; He gives strength not to them only, but to their disciples. And he that observes this precept will not only teach with free utterance, but will easily convince all; for the observance of this command drew many to the Apostles.

RABANUS. Or, He confesses Jesus who by that faith that worketh by love, obediently fulfils His commands; he denies Him who is disobedient.


THOMAS AQUINAS, Catena Aurea: Commentary on the Four Gospels, Collected out of the Works of the Fathers: St. Matthew (ed. J. H. NEWMAN) (Oxford 1841) I, 393-394.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 16 2018 11:06 PM

You can search Commentaries with  deny, repent WITHIN  {Milestone <Bible Mt 10:33>}, {Milestone <Bible Lk 12:9>}

But the actual text of Lk 12:8-12 actually says a lot more than some comments I've seen!

Dave
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DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 17 2018 2:06 AM

Personally, I don’t see this as a contradiction.  It is obvious that denying Jesus is the equivalent of rejecting him (non believers) and also living a double life as they say “you’re a Saturday night devil and then a Sunday morning saint” (believers).

However, if a none believe has a change of heart and decides to give his life to Jesus, then he won’t be denied.  Same goes for the believers when they repent of their double life.

DAL

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Paul Caneparo | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 17 2018 3:15 AM

DAL:

Personally, I don’t see this as a contradiction.  It is obvious that denying Jesus is the equivalent of rejecting him (non believers) and also living a double life as they say “you’re a Saturday night devil and then a Sunday morning saint” (believers).

However, if a none believe has a change of heart and decides to give his life to Jesus, then he won’t be denied.  Same goes for the believers when they repent of their double life.

DAL

I essentially agree. I see one "deny" as a permanent, fixed state by a non-believer and the other as a lapse by a believer.

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 17 2018 9:06 AM

DAL:

Personally, I don’t see this as a contradiction.  It is obvious that denying Jesus is the equivalent of rejecting him (non believers) and also living a double life as they say “you’re a Saturday night devil and then a Sunday morning saint” (believers).

However, if a none believe has a change of heart and decides to give his life to Jesus, then he won’t be denied.  Same goes for the believers when they repent of their double life.

DAL

I suspect 'denying' was switching horses under pressure (persecution). Ergo 'the Rock' could change colors. But early Christians (who act as witnesses to Inspiration) allowed only one get-out-of-jail card. Peter used his up.

Dave's Luke reference is interesting. Why would Jesus being notifying the angels. Maybe they keep score, though believers have to judge them. Apostle Paul also adds you have to practice judging, to get good at it. Pretty tangled up, given Jesus' warning.


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