What happened to the gold?

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Michael S. | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Dec 13 2018 8:36 AM

Anyone ever think to ask what did Mary and Joseph do with the gifts from the wise men?

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DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 13 2018 8:51 AM

We can only speculate 👍😁👌 Myrrh for stomach remedies, Frankincense to freshen up the house and gold to start a new carpentry business.

DAL

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John Fidel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 13 2018 8:52 AM

DAL:

We can only speculate 👍😁👌 Myrrh for stomach remedies, Frankincense to freshen up the house and gold to start a new carpentr business.

DAL

I have heard it taught that the gold may have been used to support the family while in exile in Egypt until their return to Nazareth. Again, speculation.

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Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 13 2018 8:59 AM

We do not know the quantity of gold received but they were refugees in Egypt for a few years and then hen going to  nazareth setting up a house and business would eat up capital too.

-dan 

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David Owh | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 13 2018 6:59 PM

Michael S.:

Anyone ever think to ask what did Mary and Joseph do with the gifts from the wise men?

2:13 Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream. In one Jewish tradition, a dream warned Moses’ father to protect him from Pharaoh. escape to Egypt. A large Jewish community already lived in Egypt. Alexandria, a Greek-founded city in the northern delta region of Egypt, included perhaps the largest Jewish community outside Judea and Galilee. Perhaps one-third of Alexandria was Jewish, so the family could easily find refuge there. Further, if they had means to transport safely even some of the gold and spices (v. 11) they would have means to support themselves for a long period of time.

Craig S. Keener and John H. Walton, eds., NIV Cultural Backgrounds Study Bible: Bringing to Life the Ancient World of Scripture (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2016), 1612.

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 13 2018 7:43 PM

Michael S.:

Anyone ever think to ask what did Mary and Joseph do with the gifts from the wise men?

Your question caught my eye .... 'wise men'. Not many seem to worry why they were 'loaded' either. It's interesting, the english 'wise' (in Logos) goes back to Wycliff late 1300s. Which in-turn tracks to the Vulgate (again, our trusty Logos) ... which supplies the greek magi. Well, ok.

The greek itself twists and turns on sorcerer as in Acts 13:6,8, a wizard or enchanter (Dan 2:2 greek OT), as well as a member of a Median tribe (LSJ). But it's LSJ's alternative readings that seem to fuel the early fathers, suspicious as they were of loaded wise men. Justin, in Dialog with Trypho 78, managed to move them up to Damascus, working for Satan, and even got the priests of Mithras involved. It was truly diabolical.

All this, while Mary and Joseph were locating the right cave (this little detail was also a crucial prophetic element).

Returning to Wycliff in the late 1300s, 'wise' didn't last long ... his 2nd version moved to 'astronomist' at least 3 years later. But the deal was done and later sealed by King James himself.

More seriously, I wonder what 'wisj' meant in early english.


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Allen Browne | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Dec 13 2018 8:57 PM

Michael S.:

Anyone ever think to ask what did Mary and Joseph do with the gifts from the wise men?

Paid for lodgings in Egypt?

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Liam Maguire | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 1:09 AM

I'm part of the group that think the wise men appeared around the time of Jesus birth. So I would say that in addition to paying for their time in Egypt, the gold would have also paid for the sacrifice required for Mary's purification after the 40 day period was over.

But, as others have said this is all speculation, especially since we do not know what quantity of gold was given. A small broach? A bag of coins? etc. etc. Fun though. :-)

Check out my blog 'For Fathers'

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Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 4:21 AM

Michael S.:

Anyone ever think to ask what did Mary and Joseph do with the gifts from the wise men?

Absolutely we can ask - and the answer will one day be given to us in eternity. Every question will be answered. Keep well Paul  

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Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 8:39 AM

Liam Maguire:

I'm part of the group that think the wise men appeared around the time of Jesus birth. So I would say that in addition to paying for their time in Egypt, the gold would have also paid for the sacrifice required for Mary's purification after the 40 day period was over.

But, as others have said this is all speculation, especially since we do not know what quantity of gold was given. A small broach? A bag of coins? etc. etc. Fun though. :-)

Yours is the greatest argu for later arrival of the wisemen. The sacrifice presented in the temple was of the poor two doves not the lamb of someone who could afford it with the gifts of the magi. As you say pure speculation. But Luke gives the impression that there was poverty for at least the first few months. 

-dan

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Randall Cue | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 9:35 AM

Dan Francis:

We do not know the quantity of gold received but they were refugees in Egypt for a few years and then hen going to  nazareth setting up a house and business would eat up capital too.

-dan 

Hey Dan, how do we know they were in Egypt for a few years?

Soli Deo Gloria

Randy

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Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 9:53 AM

Liam Maguire:

I'm part of the group that think the wise men appeared around the time of Jesus birth. So I would say that in addition to paying for their time in Egypt, the gold would have also paid for the sacrifice required for Mary's purification after the 40 day period was over.

But, as others have said this is all speculation, especially since we do not know what quantity of gold was given. A small broach? A bag of coins? etc. etc. Fun though. :-)

Yours is the greatest argu for later arrival of the wisemen. The sacrifice presented in the temple was of the poor two doves not the lamb of someone who could afford it with the gifts of the magi. As you say pure speculation. But Luke gives the impression that there was poverty for at least the first few months. 

-dan

Posts 5209
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 10:20 AM

Randall Cue:

Dan Francis:

We do not know the quantity of gold received but they were refugees in Egypt for a few years and then hen going to  nazareth setting up a house and business would eat up capital too.

-dan 

Hey Dan, how do we know they were in Egypt for a few years?

All we know is that they were there until after the death of Herod the Great and after it was settled about who was ruling Judea. I do remember that it was suggested by one commentary that the family came back to Nazareth about Jesus ag 5-6.. But the exact reasoning behind the dates are not something I recall off the top of my head. And that is a bit of speculation.  But you have a speculation that Jesus was 1-2 yo when the wise men arrived based on Herod demanding the death of all Children under 2. The angel ordering them into Egypt makes little sense unless they were going to be needed to reside there for a time. After Herod’s death it took months before Archelaus secured the throne. Which is the reason Matthew tells us Joseph went to Nazereth rather than to Bethlehem.  A return to Nazareth can take place no later than 6 AD when  Archelaus Was finally deposed but we do not have a firm time frame for any of Jesus birth and travels other than we know that he was born sometime before 4 BC when Herod the great died. This of course is assuming that you want to see Matthew and Luke reconciled as historic events and not pious legend as some would see them. 

-dan

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 14 2018 2:16 PM

What happened to the gold? Denise gives the answer OT: Struggles at Mt Athos 

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Liam Maguire | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 15 2018 12:04 AM

Dan Francis:

Yours is the greatest argu for later arrival of the wisemen. The sacrifice presented in the temple was of the poor two doves not the lamb of someone who could afford it with the gifts of the magi. As you say pure speculation. But Luke gives the impression that there was poverty for at least the first few months. 

-dan

Ah-ha! Thanks, Dan, I've never connected those dots before. Looks like I'll need to reassess my theory in light of new evidence. Thank you for sharing your observations. 

Check out my blog 'For Fathers'

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Paul Strickert | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 15 2018 2:49 PM

I agree with the (many) biblical scholars who have doubts about the full historicity of the infancy narratives.  So, this kind of question -- what happened to the gold? -- is probably beside the point.  Don't want to violate TOS, though.  ;)

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