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This post has 18 Replies | 4 Followers

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Adam Borries (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Jan 30 2019 4:37 PM

8.3 beta 1 introduces a major new feature to library management in Logos: selective download, aka "Cloud Resources."

This feature is in response to user requests to make Logos's hard drive footprint smaller, particularly for installing to computers with limited storage space. It will also offer the potential for faster installation times, and perhaps performance gains when a smaller library set is downloaded.

Control which resources are downloaded; search those that aren't.

Cloud resources consists of four components:

1. Download management in the library

You can now control which resources are downloaded on your hard drive.  Un-downloaded resources are represented in the library by the "download" icon in Tile view, and counted by the "Not on this device" facet. You can choose to download or remove resources in the context menu and the Information pane.

Resources that are not downloaded are not expected to function in the software, with the exception of cloud resource search, and resource text preview (see below). They will not appear in Guides, Factbook, searches*, keylink lookup, etc.  

*Note: removing a resource deletes the file from the hard drive, but does not remove it from the Library Index. To reclaim hard space from the Library Index after removing a large number of resources, use the command Rebuild Index.

 

2. Alternate resource panel state

Cloud resources open an a preview panel, similar to locked resources. The full text of the resource is available in a simple view with limited functionality in terms of interaction with the context menu, etc.

 

3. Cloud resource search.

A new section in Everything search, Cloud Resource search returns results from all licensed resources that aren't hidden or downloaded on this machine.  

See note above regarding removed resources in "library results."

 

4. New program setting to Automatically Download New Resources.

This determines whether newly-licensed resources are downloaded by default. It defaults to Yes.

The setting to automatically download updates to resources that are already downloaded remains a separate setting.

Also worth noting: in the 8.3 beta cycle, we will also ship a new configuration screen that will be shown when installing to a new computer. It will offer the options of Minimal download (only datasets and a few resources), Recommended (Minimal plus a curated list of high-value resources), or Everything (same as previous versions of Logos). This resource-set picker will only be shown the first time a user signs in on a given machine. More details to come.

 

Help us break it.

Cloud Resources represents a major change to how the Logos application downloads and interacts with resources. We have invested a lot of development effort into safeguarding that it will work smoothly, but there is still some level of risk.

Here are some ways you can help us:

  1. Download or remove large numbers of resources at a time.

  2. Download a resource, and cancel the download.

  3. Remove a resource, and immediately download while it’s still in the “removing” state.

  4. Select a mixed set of downloaded and cloud resources, and modify them with rating, tag, download/remove, add to collection, etc. Does everything work as you expect?

  5. Are you ever surprised by a resource you thought was downloaded but wasn’t, or vice versa?

  6. What do you think might confuse novice users about this feature?

  7. Do you notice any performance improvement in Logos when many resources have been removed from the library? What are the conditions you tested/ compared?

We've been working on this one for a while, and we are eager to see how you like it. As always, thank you all for testing, and offering your thoughtful feedback. 

--Adam 

 

Adam Borries | Product Manager, Logos desktop application

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Sean | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 30 2019 7:10 PM

I don't do beta, but thank you for responding to this longstanding request. I'm hopeful that this will meet a great number of varied user needs.

 Logos Now Subscriber -- 22/2/2018

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Forum MVP
Reuben Helmuth | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 1:36 AM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
Also worth noting: in the 8.3 beta cycle, we will also ship a new configuration screen that will be shown when installing to a new computer. It will offer the options of Minimal download (only datasets and a few resources), Recommended (Minimal plus a curated list of high-value resources), or Everything (same as previous versions of Logos). This resource-set picker will only be shown the first time a user signs in on a given machine.

Thanks for this! The current process for new installations is definitely less than ideal (as I'm personally experiencing 😉).

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 2:33 AM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
Also worth noting: in the 8.3 beta cycle, we will also ship a new configuration screen that will be shown when installing to a new computer. It will offer the options of Minimal download (only datasets and a few resources), Recommended (Minimal plus a curated list of high-value resources), or Everything (same as previous versions of Logos). This resource-set picker will only be shown the first time a user signs in on a given machine. More details to come.

I'm looking forward to this. I had to remove Logos from my laptop because of drive space issues.

Posts 108
Pastor Greg | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 2:43 AM

I'd like to see a "Mark for Removal" option, so that a user could identify resources to remove, and then remove them all at once. As it is, removing a number of resources occupies the system, and makes it clumsy to continue to mark resources for removal until the update is complete.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 2:49 AM

Pastor Greg:

I'd like to see a "Mark for Removal" option, so that a user could identify resources to remove, and then remove them all at once. As it is, removing a number of resources occupies the system, and makes it clumsy to continue to mark resources for removal until the update is complete.

You might be able to tagging or collections to accomplish this. I suspect collections would be less disruptive as the library doesn't need to get updated in the same way.

Posts 169
James Hudson | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 11:45 AM

Yes!! Thanks for this option.

This is a fantastic addition - this one feature makes 2.8 worth the price - one I can tick off my wish list.

Now just waiting for tables and graphics in notes and canvas and additional levels of indent in Workflows!

Thanks

Posts 1463
Forum MVP
Levi Durfey | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 11:57 AM

It would be nice to have some indicator in the Library panel of the amount of space that a resource takes up (rather then drilling down into the resources folder). Any plans for this?

How To Get Logs - macOS or Windows

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 4:53 PM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):

Here are some ways you can help us:

4. Select a mixed set of downloaded and cloud resources, and modify them with rating, tag, download/remove, add to collection, etc. Does everything work as you expect?

See below!

Adam Borries (Faithlife):

6. What do you think might confuse novice users about this feature?

The All Library count and list remains the same after removing resources.

Removed resources are not distinguished in Details view.

Filtering Library via the Find box can return different results to a Collection sidebar Filter that uses the same rule i.e. a Collection will only show what is on the device. Other sidebar filters would reflect the Find box filter.

Bug: when filtered by title:Anglican after some Anglican resources had been removed, the right-click menu would alternate status e.g. "Download" when on the device, or "Remove" when it had been removed. Click again and the status would be different.

It would be much less confusing if the Library list and count, together with Find box filters, only reflect what is on the device. The "Not on this Device" Filter would allow manipulation of removed resources, and avoid the need for your question 4.

EDIT: another factor is to be consistent with hidden resources.

Dave
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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 31 2019 8:04 PM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):

3. Remove a resource, and immediately download while it’s still in the “removing” state.

I removed 4 together and quickly clicked on  "Download". The notification was "4 resources updated" (listed ok), and the Devices filters were correct. Two of the 4 lectionaries were opened and closed before removing (see log).

7713.Remove+Dwnload.zip

One question is whether the download should have been notified as available, as I have the 2x Auto Download options set to NO.

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
5. Are you ever surprised by a resource you thought was downloaded but wasn’t, or vice versa?

Still surprised by the varying right-click menu status, as per Bug: in previous post.

Dave
===

Windows & Android

Posts 1959
LogosEmployee

Dave Hooton:
One question is whether the download should have been notified as available, as I have the 2x Auto Download options set to NO.

Since you have made an explicit choice to download the resource, we start the download immediately rather than prompting you to start the download.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Feb 1 2019 1:59 PM

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):
Since you have made an explicit choice to download the resource, we start the download immediately rather than prompting you to start the download.

Fair enough, as the new "Updated" notification let me know what had happened.

Dave
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Windows & Android

Posts 2815
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Feb 1 2019 2:21 PM

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):

Dave Hooton:
One question is whether the download should have been notified as available, as I have the 2x Auto Download options set to NO.

Since you have made an explicit choice to download the resource, we start the download immediately rather than prompting you to start the download.

Will that automatic download be limited to the resource in question, or will it also download anything else that's waiting, e.g., books from a new purchase?

EDIT: On that note, with the beta installed but not having played with this feature, I made a 'purchase' of this month's Spanish free book. It downloaded automatically, which I did not want it to do. Other books that I picked up (today) before downloading the beta did not auto-download. In Program Settings, I see that my preference has been changed to Automatically Download New Resources. I did not do that. I have now changed it back.

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LogosEmployee
Adam Borries (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Feb 1 2019 2:45 PM

SineNomine:
In Program Settings, I see that my preference has been changed to Automatically Download New Resources. I did not do that. I have now changed it back.

I think you are confusing that setting with the "automatically download updates" setting. As noted in the OP, this is a new setting, which is independent of the "download updates" setting.

Automatically Download New Resources currently defaults to Yes. We can change the default to respect the setting for auto-update when you update to 8.3 from a previous version, and be independent afterward.

Adam Borries | Product Manager, Logos desktop application

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LogosEmployee

SineNomine:
Will that automatic download be limited to the resource in question

Yes.

Posts 2815
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Feb 1 2019 2:54 PM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
Automatically Download New Resources currently defaults to Yes. We can change the default to respect the setting for auto-update when you update to 8.3 from a previous version, and be independent afterward.

I recommend doing that. I expect that most people who had Verbum/Logos set to not automatically download updates don't want Verbum/Logos to automatically download updates.

Posts 2815
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Feb 1 2019 2:54 PM

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):

SineNomine:
Will that automatic download be limited to the resource in question?

Yes.

Thank you.

Posts 2202
LogosEmployee
Philana R. Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 20 2019 1:48 PM

SineNomine:

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):

Dave Hooton:
One question is whether the download should have been notified as available, as I have the 2x Auto Download options set to NO.

Since you have made an explicit choice to download the resource, we start the download immediately rather than prompting you to start the download.

Will that automatic download be limited to the resource in question, or will it also download anything else that's waiting, e.g., books from a new purchase?

EDIT: On that note, with the beta installed but not having played with this feature, I made a 'purchase' of this month's Spanish free book. It downloaded automatically, which I did not want it to do. Other books that I picked up (today) before downloading the beta did not auto-download. In Program Settings, I see that my preference has been changed to Automatically Download New Resources. I did not do that. I have now changed it back.

This has been fixed in 8.3 Beta 4, the setting will match setting for "Automatically Download Updates".

Posts 2815
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 20 2019 7:39 PM

Philana R. Crouch:
This has been fixed in 8.3 Beta 4, the setting will match setting for "Automatically Download Updates".

Thank you Philana!

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