Encyclopedia of Ancient Greek Language and Linguistics

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Robert Neely | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Sep 4 2019 4:40 AM

Anyone picking this up when it comes out of prepub on13 Sep?  I would be interested to know how useful it might be.  

Thanks

https://www.logos.com/product/55646/encyclopedia-of-ancient-greek-language-and-linguistics 

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 5:06 AM

I pre-ordered it long time ago.

I think it has much more info than I can utilize, but I want to have a good reference.

Alea jacta est Indifferent

Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 8.1

Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 7:43 AM

I gave up on it. First, it was funded, then they re-calculated back to 50% funded. Slight adjustment. My guess, they need it to stay competitive in academic.

But I re-enlisted ... thanks for the reminder.

Useful-wise, like the etymo-dictionary, I'd think you'd need to enjoy language development. Greek is sort of like chinese, latin, and english. They spread by utility, and adjusted along the way.  The Biblical scholar portrait, I think is largely naive (just read the Zondervan James commentary). For the bulk of participants, greek would have been a 2nd language and barely understandable, theology-wise.

Actually, I really prefer the Brill hebrew one  ... maybe they're moon-walking the expensive Brill references, one at a time.


Posts 451
Liam & Abi Maguire | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 10:47 AM

Denise:

The Biblical scholar portrait, I think is largely naive (just read the Zondervan James commentary). For the bulk of participants, greek would have been a 2nd language and barely understandable, theology-wise.

Hi Denise, this is an interesting point you raise. If you have time, could you unpack it a bit more, please? If it is too off topic feel free to message me on Faithlife.

Check out my blog 'For Fathers'

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DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 11:38 AM

So how fast do you read, Denise? I get the impression that you read a book faster than it downloads to your computer and then if you didn’t like it you return it.

Maybe sharing  a technique or two on speed reading would be great 👍😁👌

DAL

Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 1:06 PM

DAL:

So how fast do you read, Denise? I get the impression that you read a book faster than it downloads to your computer and then if you didn’t like it you return it.

Maybe sharing  a technique or two on speed reading would be great 👍😁👌

DAL

Well, if you're already familiar with the text being discussed, and familiar with the previous commentaries, it doesn't take long to cut to the chase. There's no magic. A good violinist. A good plumber. I don't think I'm that unusual .. ha.

Refund-wise, yes, doesn't take long to see the author's circling the wagons. And if it doesn't even download, that saves even more time.  I am mystified why FL has trouble shipping. The lady at FL explained, they now only do digital. I tried to be nice.


Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 1:53 PM

Liam Maguire:

Denise:

The Biblical scholar portrait, I think is largely naive (just read the Zondervan James commentary). For the bulk of participants, greek would have been a 2nd language and barely understandable, theology-wise.

Hi Denise, this is an interesting point you raise. If you have time, could you unpack it a bit more, please? If it is too off topic feel free to message me on Faithlife.

Greek.

I'll tippy-toe across the theological mine-field. But we're all familiar with a 1st language, vs a 2nd. The latter struggles are so predictable, you can guess the 1st language. We go across Asian languages constantly. When they arrive in English, Japanese make different errors than Chinese or Korean. You can easily see the pattern on Amazon marketing texts. Of course, my Japanese is similar.

And religious concepts are far worse. A local couple helped translating in Mongolia ... the earlier translations had too much Buddhist-sounding words. Different meanings. They arrived here, to do the same in Navajo (tribe), where the words strongly overlap the spirit-world. I smiled; good luck on that.  So also the tribes south of us.

Similarly, the Roman empire was a conglomeration of misplaced slaves, commerce, and older villages, older languages. So, just how exact can a translation be? How touchy a theological concept? And the end-time was immediate ... no NT, no nesting pastors, etc. If you presume Divine guidance (Holy Spirit), you have to assume 'in the ball park' was workable. Who thinks Paul's Romans made any sense? To who?

When Christianity arrived in the Rio Grande valley (southwest US) in the 1600s, the first idea was to teach in the local language. That fell apart quickly, because there were so many languages just miles apart, and few knew each.  So, they switched  gears and tried to teach Spanish. That worked decently well, but only for the most basic of ideas to be communicated.

When Jesus said 'saved', have you checked 'saved from what' in the actual text? When Jesus demanded they recognize God, weren't these Jews?? So, another meaning? When you read 'Christian', followers of Jesus or the Annointed? Or did you notice the difference? Spirit ... what do you think that means? Exactly?  In the 1st century? How?

Then, you finally arrive at greek. Perfect greek (several of the writings). And watch, as the Protestant (mainly) scholars try to rationalize. Really? And once you have your perfect greek, who for? What group demanded/appreciated lovely greek? Really?

A last example, I previously mentioned years back. Our church is pretty fundamentalist (fundamentals). A night Bible class, an elder leading. A straight-forward text, and an honest question. But each Christian had a completely different understanding. It was amazing. How is that possible? And none too embarrassed, most literally heretical. No problem, in-the-ballpark.

Added: I know folks will try to argue the 3 centuries of greek as 'broad-use'. So, what language were the visiting Jews speaking at Pentecost? And a miracle to do the honors, too.


Posts 603
Steve Maling | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 4 2019 3:27 PM

Thank you for your wonderfully helpful "reminders", Denise. The quotes around "reminders" express the fact that (like many?), "I know that stuff! But I haven't truly internalized it. Sad"

Your example from the valley of the Rio Grande is a dandy.

Posts 432
Robert Neely | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 6 2019 4:00 PM

Just fyi, the Brill Greek Collection was reduced from $499 to $399 this week.

https://www.logos.com/product/53609/brill-greek-reference-collection 

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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 6 2019 4:21 PM

Robert Neely:

Just fyi, the Brill Greek Collection was reduced from $499 to $399 this week.

https://www.logos.com/product/53609/brill-greek-reference-collection 

If you already own the Etymological Dictionary of Greek (as I do) it is interesting to note the pricing difference.

To purchase the 5 volumes the price is...

But, if I only purchase the Encyclopedia of Ancient Greek Language and Linguistics my price is...

Even though the price has dropped it still is pretty steep but that's usually the case with Brill resources.

Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God

Posts 432
Robert Neely | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 6 2019 5:00 PM

Interesting.  Why are they selling something that is already live in a pre-pub package?

Well I would rather pay $60 for it than the $199 price.  Makes me think that the $399 collection price is a mistake.

Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 6 2019 5:16 PM

Bruce Dunning:
If you already own the Etymological Dictionary of Greek (as I do) it is interesting to note the pricing difference.

Thanks, Bruce!! $12 gets me a Big Mac with large fries!

When I tried the collection, it was $399. No credit for the etymo. Maybe they dynamic'd it.


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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 7 2019 4:48 AM

Denise:
Thanks, Bruce!! $12 gets me a Big Mac with large fries!

Enjoy your Big Mac. Smile

The pricing does appear to be a bit strange.

Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God

Posts 688
Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 9 2019 2:11 PM

Robert Neely:

Just fyi, the Brill Greek Collection was reduced from $499 to $399 this week.

https://www.logos.com/product/53609/brill-greek-reference-collection 

I have ordered, canceled, and reordered a few times. I'm already over my budget and there's a few sale items I'd like this month. Since this is pre-whatever, I can't put it on PP. It'll be interesting to see what I decide.

Will this ever be this cheap again? $399.

Posts 432
Robert Neely | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 9 2019 2:14 PM

Brill doesn't put their books on sale as i can recall and they are not in base packages.  I don't think it is likely you will be able to better this discount.

Still on the fence myself.

Posts 688
Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 9 2019 2:50 PM

Robert Neely:

Brill doesn't put their books on sale as i can recall and they are not in base packages.  I don't think it is likely you will be able to better this discount.

Still on the fence myself.

I pre-ordered the other Brill items at 60% discount. Perhaps another price drop will come along. I'm sure I have lots of time to decide.

Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 9 2019 4:21 PM

To further cause everyone pain (dinero), here's a slice discussing the pattern of greek to other languages (baptize, etc).

https://linguistics.ucla.edu/people/Melchert/Melchert%20C._greek%20and%20lycian.pdf 

Using duckduck and the book title, there's several sample pdfs from the volumes. And grinding of teeth at Brill.

My 2 cents, it's now or never, with a 30 day return choice. 


Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 13 2019 5:44 PM

Denise:
My 2 cents, it's now or never, with a 30 day return choice. 

Well, surprise, surprise. It downloaded to my mini. And I already learned something (aka found a rabbit trail).

I'd never even heard of aischrology. Apparently the greeks had it down to an art. Nothing in my library.

"... the semantic domain of aischrology: aiskhrológos, aiskhrorrḗmōn ‘foul-speaking’; kakḗgoros (kakēgoréō), kakológos (kakologéō), kakorrḗmōn ‘ill-speaking’; blásphēmos (blasphēméō) ‘evil-speaking’; loídoros (loidoréō) ‘abusive’ (Poll. 8.80)"

Hmmm ... blasphemeo.


Posts 688
Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 13 2019 6:11 PM

Dale E Heath:

Robert Neely:

Just fyi, the Brill Greek Collection was reduced from $499 to $399 this week.

https://www.logos.com/product/53609/brill-greek-reference-collection 

I have ordered, canceled, and reordered a few times. I'm already over my budget and there's a few sale items I'd like this month. Since this is pre-whatever, I can't put it on PP. It'll be interesting to see what I decide.

Will this ever be this cheap again? $399.

I loaned (paid) one of my sons $4,000 yesterday so he could have an operation, so I'm keeping this and a few other items as my gift to myself. My budget is in tatters and being ignored.AngelSad

Posts 10210
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 13 2019 6:50 PM

Dale E Heath:
I loaned (paid) one of my sons $4,000 yesterday so he could have an operation, so I'm keeping this and a few other items as my gift to myself. My budget is in tatters and being ignored.AngelSad

Well, I hope the operation does ok, and your son will be well. That's what matters.

To help your budget rationalizing, here's a good article. I didn't know Jesus quoted a greek proverb. Though I suppose I should have.


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