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Posts 4
Tony Shoemaker | Forum Activity | Posted: Sun, Jun 27 2010 12:28 PM

First off I wanted to let Logos staff know that I will be calling them on Monday to order replacement DVD's. Mine arrived in a substandard cardboard mailer that didn't protect them from rough handling while in transit. Both DVD's were scratched on the read surface and one was nicked on the outer circumference. I really expected more from a quality Bible software company like Logos.

Secondly I am not sure how to interact with them as shown in the sample preview videos:  http://www.logos.com/products/details/5876

From what I can tell all that I received were videos, not software as depicted in the preview videos. Am I missing something?

Thanks, Tony

 

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 1:00 PM

Tony,

I don't work for Logos so I cannot comment on the condition of your DVD's...however, they are a company who will do what it takes to remedy the situation.

On the other point, the DVD's are only videos about how to use Logos software...you must be an owner of the software itself, to use what's found in the videos.

Do you own any Logos software package?

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 1674
Paul Golder | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 1:05 PM

Tony Shoemaker:
From what I can tell all that I received were videos

They are videos only, the software is a separate purchase

From the product page:

Additional Details

  • Over 15 hours of content taught by Dr. Mike Heiser and Johnny Cisneros using Logos 4. That is equivalent content of an entire college class!
  • Covers the tools you would get in three years of traditional Greek and Hebrew classes.
  • Videos come on 2 DVD-ROMs. The DVDs are designed for your computer and will not play in a normal DVD player. The videos are formatted in h.264 (HD) and optimized for Quicktime 7 and Windows Media Player 12.
  • A web-like user interface is included.
  • Leave the content on the DVD, or copy it to your hard drive.
  • All videos have chapter markers, so you can easily navigate to the exact spot you need.
  • No knowledge of Greek or Hebrew is required. Even English grammar is explained.
  • No rote memorization of vocabulary lists, grammatical forms, or paradigms.
  • Scholar’s Library is recommended. Also recommended, but not required: BDAG and A Concise Hebrew and Aramaic Lexicon of the Old Testament (Holladay).

"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

Posts 4
Tony Shoemaker | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 1:22 PM

I have the Logos Bible Software 3 Leaders Library.

I read the additional details that you so kindly referenced, but did I misunderstand? Is the Scholors Library  REQUIRED or is the Leaders Library sufficient.

Please let me know what additional resources are Required in order to get full benifit from this product.

Thanks for your help, Tony

Posts 1145
William | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 2:15 PM

Tony Shoemaker:
Is the Scholors Library  REQUIRED

Well, the sales page said recommended.  I would recommend it as well.  The reasoning for them recommending this package that you may not get with the Leader's Library are the original language tools.   If you take a look here http://www.logos.com/comparison more than half-way down you will see that there are basically 6 "language" resources.  As they mention, BDAG is recommended but that is not as high.  Others have said that BDAG is extremely important to really study the origninal languages but you can add this on later.  I just went back to that comparison page and notice some of the features and databases that you do not have.  It seems that some of those things would be used in the language work that are not in the Leader's.  I very much think these dvd's are worth it especially for non language trained people.  If you have the discs.  Keep them.  They are worth it....Just save them until you can afford the upgrade to Scholar's.  I have not thought about this but the Original Language package might be enough for these.  Again the thing that might be missing are some of the commentaries. 

Hope this helps.

 

Posts 18827
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 2:16 PM

Tony Shoemaker:

I have the Logos Bible Software 3 Leaders Library.

I read the additional details that you so kindly referenced, but did I misunderstand? Is the Scholors Library  REQUIRED or is the Leaders Library sufficient.

Please let me know what additional resources are Required in order to get full benifit from this product.

The product description page says that Scholars Library is STRONGLY RECOMMENDED. It doesn't say required. You can still do some of the stuff from the videos in your Leader's library, but you will be limited in what you can do. Once you get the replacement DVDs (I'm sure Logos will gladly replace the defective ones for you for no charge) you can watch them and decide later if the limitations are such that you really want to upgrade to Scholar's. Only you can make that decision. The resource and feature differences between Scholar's and Leader's Library are listed on the comparison chart. Scroll down and look under "Original Language Grammars and Tools," "Original Language Lexicons," and "Features and Databases." In my opinion, the Bible Word Study features missing in Leader's Library would severely cripple your ability to follow along and do the things shown in the video. I haven't watched more than the first three videos of the Hebrew lessons yet, though. It could be that there would be other major gaps in your experience. If you decide after watching a number of the videos that it just isn't going to work for you with Leader's Library and you can't afford to upgrade to Scholar's, I'm sure Logos will honor their 30-day refund policy, even once they've already sent you a replacement for the defective DVDs.

Posts 401
Sam West | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 6:47 PM

All videos have chapter markers, so you can easily navigate to the exact spot you need.

will someone direct me to the chapter markers?

please how do you highlight in a  reply?

Posts 18827
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jun 27 2010 7:12 PM

SAM WEST:

All videos have chapter markers, so you can easily navigate to the exact spot you need.

will someone direct me to the chapter markers?

I am wondering the same thing. I can see when the video moves to a new chapter, because the new chapter title shows up in the lower right covern of my QuickTime player. But I don't see any minute markings or chapter markings along the scroll bar so I don't know where to drag the scroll thumb to in order to get to a particular chapter. I have to do it by trial and error.

SAM WEST:

please how do you highlight in a  reply?

You're talking about a reply on the forum, I presume? Are you asking how to use background shading within your own text in in a reply? Or are you asking how to quote another person's reply in that shaded box?

For #1: (While not composing a reply) Click Edit in the upper right corner of the Forum screen, to edit your profile. Click "Site Options."  For Content Editor, select "Enhanced." Click Save down at the bottom of this screen. Click Save again down at the bottom of the next screen. Now next time you're editing a reply, you should have a control available that lets you apply background color to any selected text.

For #2: Don't use the Quick Reply link at the lower right of a post, but rather use the Reply button at the upper right of it. (Optionally) select the portion of the person's message that you want to quote (otherwise by default it will quote the whole thing). Click the blue "Quote" link at the bottom of the message you're responding to.

Posts 779
LogosEmployee
Sean Boisen | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 10:07 AM

Rosie Perera:
I can see when the video moves to a new chapter, because the new chapter title shows up in the lower right covern of my QuickTime player. But I don't see any minute markings or chapter markings along the scroll bar so I don't know where to drag the scroll thumb to in order to get to a particular chapter. I have to do it by trial and error.

If you are using the QuickTime player, the lower right corner is actually a pop-up menu that you can use to select a chapter, and the video will play from that point. I don't think that information shows up on the scroll bar, though.

Posts 4
Tony Shoemaker | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 5:23 PM

Rosie Perera:

[

The product description page says that Scholars Library is STRONGLY RECOMMENDED. It doesn't say required. You can still do some of the stuff from the videos in your Leader's library, but you will be limited in what you can do. Once you get the replacement DVDs (I'm sure Logos will gladly replace the defective ones for you for no charge) you can watch them and decide later if the limitations are such that you really want to upgrade to Scholar's. Only you can make that decision. The resource and feature differences between Scholar's and Leader's Library are listed on the comparison chart. Scroll down and look under "Original Language Grammars and Tools," "Original Language Lexicons," and "Features and Databases." In my opinion, the Bible Word Study features missing in Leader's Library would severely cripple your ability to follow along and do the things shown in the video. I haven't watched more than the first three videos of the Hebrew lessons yet, though. It could be that there would be other major gaps in your experience. If you decide after watching a number of the videos that it just isn't going to work for you with Leader's Library and you can't afford to upgrade to Scholar's, I'm sure Logos will honor their 30-day refund policy, even once they've already sent you a replacement for the defective DVDs.

 

Thanks for your very informative response. I upgraded my software to the Scholars Library and am looking forward to studying God's word in the original language. I also wanted to commend Sue at customer support and  Santiago in sales. Both individuals were extremely helpful. Replacement software is on the way for discs that were damaged in transit... no hassels at all. Thanks Logos.  

Might I suggest that your description of the videos emphasize that they are best utilized with Logos 4 Software generally and The Scholars Library specifically as opposed to just “recommending” them. Thanks again…

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 6:24 PM

Sean Boisen:
If you are using the QuickTime player, the lower right corner is actually a pop-up menu that you can use to select a chapter, and the video will play from that point

Thank you for that valuable bit of information. I had not noticed the little carets before.

Posts 18827
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 7:53 PM

Tony Shoemaker:

Might I suggest that your description of the videos emphasize that they are best utilized with Logos 4 Software generally and The Scholars Library specifically as opposed to just “recommending” them. Thanks again…

The title of the videos is "Learn to Use Greek and Hebrew with Logos Bible Software," and under Additional Details it says "Over 15 hours of content taught by Dr. Mike Heiser and Johnny Cisneros using Logos 4." I don't know how much clearer that can get, besides perhaps putting it in boldface like I just did.

I agree that they should probably increase the emphasis on Scholar's Library (which implies Logos 4 because you can't buy it for Logos 3 anymore and it isn't a standalone library -- it comes with and requires Logos Bible Software), by adding the word "strongly" before "recommended." The authors have expressed as much to us here on the forum.

Posts 46
Greg Hoerter | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jul 17 2010 1:05 PM

does anyone know if the Note Files for these videos are available?  I have been typing them as I'm going through the videos, but it's distracting.  Maybe it's possible to just download them from the authors?

I'm learning a lot, but want to focus on the content rather than pausing to type out the notes.

Posts 3578
steve clark | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jul 17 2010 1:26 PM

Greg Hoerter:
does anyone know if the Note Files for these videos are available?

Haven't heard of any yet.

But here is what i copied from L4's notes on the video Hebrew07 Verbs

7266.Notes in Heb07 Verbs.doc

Edit: the bold text is the title for each note. The normal text under them goes in the body of that note. All these i put into a single note file named Heb07- Verbs

Edit2: i've built several of the charts, but Logos might frown on putting them up publicly here.

QLinks, Bibl2, LLR, Macros
Dell Insp 17-5748, i5, 1.7 GHz, 8G RAM, win 8.1

Posts 3673
Floyd Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jul 17 2010 1:29 PM

Greg Hoerter:

does anyone know if the Note Files for these videos are available?  I have been typing them as I'm going through the videos, but it's distracting.  Maybe it's possible to just download them from the authors?

I'm learning a lot, but want to focus on the content rather than pausing to type out the notes.

I have not seen them - but I expect a number of us would appreciate seeing the notes you are creating.  I would prefer some notes that I can mark-up - either with LOGOS or with PDF Annotator.  I don't know how LOGOS would feel about this though - it would be far better if they published a "text" that could parallel the lectures.

Blessings,
Floyd

Pastor-Patrick.blogspot.com

Posts 19
Jason B | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2010 8:09 AM

Yes, I have been wishing Logos would post the note files for us to download, as I like the concise wording and I am too lazy to want to type it all myself at the moment, so that would be wonderful if they would compile that and give it to us to download... :)

Posts 1145
William | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2010 1:54 PM

I don't want to make anyone mad at me but I think your wanting a bit too much. 

Personally, I am glad I don't have the notes already typed for me.  Each of us will find different things notable about the videos.  It is a proven fact that if we are required to write something ourselves as opposed to "read" it....we will remember more  and thus learn it for ourselves. 

Ok, I will stand back and allow the food to come flying. 

 

Posts 18827
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2010 3:30 PM

JasonBorror:

Yes, I have been wishing Logos would post the note files for us to download, as I like the concise wording and I am too lazy to want to type it all myself at the moment, so that would be wonderful if they would compile that and give it to us to download... :)

I have suggested it and got this reply: "That’s a great suggestion Rosie: Kent has passed it along to Reuben Evans, who’s coordinating our forum posts and other follow-up for the Learn to Use products." Then Reuben replied: "This may be something we can do in the future, but right now we are focused on tightening up the editing. I think that is going to be our focus for the next few weeks."

I agree that fixing the editing should be their first priority, but it's good that they might consider providing the notes in the future. For those who don't like that idea (William), you wouldn't have to use them. To each his own. I too think I'd learn something by typing them in myself, but I doubt I'd ever get around to it.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2010 5:23 PM

William Bingham:
It is a proven fact that if we are required to write something ourselves as opposed to "read" it....we will remember more  and thus learn it for ourselves. 

I agree.

William Bingham:
Ok, I will stand back and allow the food to come flying. 

No food, I ate it.

Rosie Perera:
I too think I'd learn something by typing them in myself, but I doubt I'd ever get around to it.

Rosie! I thought you could do all things with time to spare. Geeked

 

Posts 18827
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2010 8:37 PM

Jack Caviness:

Rosie! I thought you could do all things with time to spare. Geeked

Ugh! I wish. I never seem to have enough time to do all the things I want to do, in spite of sacrificing sleep over them. You don't know how many projects I am in the middle of that I haven't finished because I got sidetracked by another one. There are a few pages on the wiki that are a lasting legacy of my habit of biting off more than I can chew. It's been a lifelong problem. In my kindergarten report card there was a note from the teacher saying I had trouble completing tasks started. I'm still habitually late for deadlines. All those "things I do with time to spare" are usually things I didn't really have time for but did instead of something else that I was procrastinating on. I'm really efficient at doing stuff that doesn't really need to get done! Smile

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