The Next Chapter in the EEC

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This post has 116 Replies | 13 Followers

Posts 2519
Ronald Quick | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2021 12:37 PM

I know absolutely nothing about publishing.  So, I have a curiosity question about the process.  After the author has completed their commentary and submitted it, what are the series editors doing when they review the author's work?

Posts 7
Jacob Sowles | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2021 1:06 PM

Thank you for the update!

Posts 33258
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2021 2:39 PM

Ronald Quick:
what are the series editors doing when they review the author's work?

Don't, don't, stop .... sorry I can't control myself Embarrassed What do editors do? They edit Big Smile Okay, my sister was a proof-reader for an educational software firm but she also did some editing - in her case she was looking primarily for unwanted ambiguity as well as spelling, punctuation, grammatical errors, incorrect choice of words ... anything that made the software appear unprofessional, inaccurate, confusing, beyond the grasp of the intended audience. Full-fledged editors go beyond her work to insure a smooth flow of text, that something was actually said before it was referred back to, that the style book of the company is adhered to ....

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 116
LogosEmployee
Jake Mailhot (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 19 2021 2:46 PM

Ronald Quick:
what are the series editors doing when they review the author's work?

MJ. Smith:

In her case she was looking primarily for unwanted ambiguity as well as spelling, punctuation, grammatical errors, incorrect choice of words ... anything that made the software appear unprofessional, inaccurate, confusing, beyond the grasp of the intended audience. Full-fledged editors go beyond her work to insure a smooth flow of text, that something was actually said before it was referred back to, that the style book of the company is adhered to ....

MJ is essentially describing copyediting and proofing, the final two steps of the editorial process. For these volumes in the EEC, those two steps occur after the series editors perform their review and go though their revision process with the author. The series editors are ensuring all the critical issues are covered by the author in their manuscript -- in short, making sure everything is covered correctly and properly to fulfill the scope of the series. Once they're finished with their review and the author has had a chance to address any concerns, then the manuscript is sent to Lexham. At this point, the "meat" of the volume is finalized and all those details MJ referenced above are worked through in the final steps of the editorial process.

Posts 2519
Ronald Quick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 20 2021 7:28 PM

That makes sense.  Thanks.

Posts 5846
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 25 2021 12:20 AM

Thanks Jake and MJ for explaining the why and when of the process. 

Jake Mailhot (Faithlife):

Ronald Quick:
what are the series editors doing when they review the author's work?

MJ. Smith:

In her case she was looking primarily for unwanted ambiguity as well as spelling, punctuation, grammatical errors, incorrect choice of words ... anything that made the software appear unprofessional, inaccurate, confusing, beyond the grasp of the intended audience. Full-fledged editors go beyond her work to insure a smooth flow of text, that something was actually said before it was referred back to, that the style book of the company is adhered to ....

MJ is essentially describing copyediting and proofing, the final two steps of the editorial process. For these volumes in the EEC, those two steps occur after the series editors perform their review and go though their revision process with the author. The series editors are ensuring all the critical issues are covered by the author in their manuscript -- in short, making sure everything is covered correctly and properly to fulfill the scope of the series. Once they're finished with their review and the author has had a chance to address any concerns, then the manuscript is sent to Lexham. At this point, the "meat" of the volume is finalized and all those details MJ referenced above are worked through in the final steps of the editorial process.

Posts 5
David Duckitt | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2021 10:55 PM

After being a customer for more than 10 years, I am now thinking of suing Faithlife over the EEC. Is anyone else?

I appreciate(d) the released volumes and would like to see the set completed. I also understand that there may be delays in publishing. However, some of the outstanding volumes were due in 2013 and they still haven't arrived 8 years later. Faithlife have released EEC commentary on around a sixth of the verses in the bible after 10 years and have no publicly available plan for releasing other volumes.

I have suggested that they give me temporary access to a comparable set until they can release the EEC volumes or swapping for another (cheaper) commentary set. Instead they have unilaterally given me a refund of the money I paid more than 10 years ago and a small credit. So I now don't even have the released commentaries and it will cost me money just to get back to where I was before I had the temerity to ask for help.

I have recommended Logos to countless friends and colleagues over the last 10 years (despite the EEC debacle). I don't see how I can recommend Faithlife now. 

Posts 440
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2021 6:15 AM

David Duckitt:
After being a customer for more than 10 years, I am now thinking of suing Faithlife over the EEC. Is anyone else?

No. From your description, I think I'll check out Logos for some more great buys!

- They refunded you, plus. I'm surprised.  I thought they wouldn't..

- Before FL took EEC on, it was in trouble. Customer-investors were on a rescue mission. The mission seems to be fraying.

- The book business, and Christian market have changed drastically. 'They say' the primary EEC market is 10-15 years from retirement. 

In summary, you should be enjoying your NIC series (guessing).  But yes, FL's communication talents are abysmal.

Posts 4705
Mattillo | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2021 6:32 AM

I’m not a lawyer so I cannot comment on that but it sounds like they tried to help. 

As previously stated, they are terrible with communication. I got hopeful when they changed editors that communication would get better but it hasn’t. A quarterly update isn’t too much to ask. 

Posts 5846
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2021 7:34 AM

On what grounds? You have already received  a remedy from them that includes a release from the contract you had with them.

Personally I would not take legal action against them over EEC. Seeking to harm the company and as a result potentially it’s customers is not something I want to do.  

David Duckitt:

After being a customer for more than 10 years, I am now thinking of suing Faithlife over the EEC. Is anyone else?

Posts 5548
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2021 6:32 PM

DIsciple II:
On what grounds?

Possibly loss of the volumes he had (which he was refunded for).

Posts 3308
Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2021 8:26 PM

EEC is off my buy list- sold the set I had previously purchased several years back when it was first on pre-pub, why you ask- I'll be dead before I get them all- so took the $$ and ran with it.

Posts 5
David Duckitt | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 4 2021 10:13 PM

Thanks for your reply. I didn't ask for a refund - I expressly said that I didn't want one. I was looking for help getting use of an equivalent commentary series as they hadn't been able to deliver on their promises. I am sure I would enjoy the NIC (or something similar) if I had it. That was the whole point of me "reaching out" to FL in the first place. Incidentally, not once in my communications with them have FL offered any explanation for the delay or indication of when any further volumes will be available.

Posts 5
David Duckitt | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 4 2021 10:21 PM

Thanks for your reply. I had fully performed my side of the contract when I paid them 10 years ago. Sadly, FL have not been able to do the same. When I first contacted them I said I didn't want to cause them harm. I didn't want to get money from them. I just wanted them to help me get use of an equivalent complete commentary set. The remedy they have imposed doesn't even put me back in the position I was in 10 years ago, let alone where I would have been now if they had been good to their word. More importantly, I still don't have access to such a commentary set.

Posts 5846
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 5 2021 1:31 AM

David Duckitt:

Thanks for your reply. I had fully performed my side of the contract when I paid them 10 years ago. Sadly, FL have not been able to do the same. When I first contacted them I said I didn't want to cause them harm. I didn't want to get money from them. I just wanted them to help me get use of an equivalent complete commentary set. The remedy they have imposed doesn't even put me back in the position I was in 10 years ago, let alone where I would have been now if they had been good to their word. More importantly, I still don't have access to such a commentary set.

When I signed up for EEC to me it was an investment in a project. So to me I was knowingly taking a risk on the project that already had a troubled start. FL did not hide that fact. And as a project I was also fully aware of the risk of it not meeting projected dates.

Am I disappointed with how things have turned out? Yes

Am I disappointed with FL and Bob Pritchett with their lack of communication on this project ? Yes

So I do get and respect your disappointment, feeling you have been left short changed by FL.

But entering into the investment knowing the risks I personally would not think of taking legal action. And so my response to your question.

In addition to asking on the forums what people think, you need to search your heart and pray about what the right thing is for you to do. 

 

Posts 440
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 5 2021 5:53 AM

DIsciple II:
Am I disappointed with FL and Bob Pritchett with their lack of communication on this project ? Yes

Agreed. But I'd suspect this whole project was never 'solid' .... meaning, commitments from busy professors were likely 'will try', and a long list of intervening events.  The WBC Daniel update, to me, spoke volumes on the problem of 'one more commentary' ... one more 'yet again'.

I'm not tremendously familiar with Baylor Handbooks, but the problem looks similar (without the customer full-on initial buy ... I wonder what that was about ... seems guaranteed fail).

Posts 2832
David Ames | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 5 2021 6:50 AM

I am glad that they opened the series up to non subscribers. And I understand how that upset subscribers.

My question on that change is did they need more funds to finance the set?

My comment is that the volume on Revelation will not be released until it is ancient history.

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