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Blair Laird | Forum Activity | Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020 7:40 AM

Which lectionary can I buy from logos that will line up with the goarch website? None that I have in my library seem to line up 

https://www.goarch.org/

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jul 25 2020 2:12 PM

Blair Laird:

Which lectionary can I buy from logos that will line up with the goarch website? None that I have in my library seem to line up 

https://www.goarch.org/

Nor should they. What FL provides is the "international" version which is then modified/localized to fit a particular church. What you should expect is that one of the lectionary is matched most of the time and that the anomlies are explainable. IIRC goarch would be a new calendar Byzantine lectionary user ...but I don't recall their status on the revision. If you point me to a couple of discrepancies, I may be able to be more precise.

Today is a discrpancies because goarch shows the sanctoral cycle entry while Logos shows the liturgical cycle entry. I've never actually tracked down how the 12 mjaor feasts are handled in FL ... I would have guessed that both cycles would be shown.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Blair Laird | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 8:39 AM

Thanks.. 

Today the Byzantine Revised Julian lined up for the most part with only the epistle reading differing. I would assume the saints view on my dashboard is not going to end up lining up either since each church will celebrate their own saints? I wish I could customize it to line up with the Greek churches saints and lectionary readings exactly. I guess it's easier for a Roman Catholic in this instance with the logos platform 

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Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 9:24 AM

MJ. Smith:
Nor should they. What FL provides is the "international" version which is then modified/localized to fit a particular church.

I come at this from the Lutheran perspective. Just about all three year lectionairies that I am aware of are off-shoots of Rome's Vatican 2 lectionary, generally through the Revised Common Lectionary of the 1990's.

But as long as I can remember the RCL being available in Logos, besides the RCL itself, the United Methodist variant has been available. Now there versions of it from the Episcopal Church, USA, Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod, and my Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod that are available.

It appears that for the Catholic Daily Readings there are two versions available. Both are listed as coming from USCCB, but to me lit looks like there is both an international version and a US version - which makes sense since I have been aware for years that USCCB has decided to celebrate Epiphany and Ascension day on Sundays.

To me, this is as it should be. The international standard is there. And variants are there from large enough markets, or organized enough bodies that have been able to provide the computer files Faithlife needs to do this.

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

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Blair Laird | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 9:36 AM

Our church has a daily reading app https://www.goarch.org/-/daily-reading-app that I assume could be integrated to the home page. The nice thing about that type of setup would be there is not a constant update and keeping up for Fl. Others are handling the daily updates, saints etc. To be able to link to my library for further study would be amazing. It's not like I am not willing to pay for the feature. I am sure other churches have similar apps that could spark the interest of others and would make this lectionary stuff easy.  

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 11:14 AM

Blair Laird:
I guess it's easier for a Roman Catholic in this instance with the logos platform 

Sort of. Every different country has a slightly different sanctoral cycle, as does each different diocese and parish, as well as some provinces/states/cities.

Ken McGuire:
It appears that for the Catholic Daily Readings there are two versions available. Both are listed as coming from USCCB, but to me lit looks like there is both an international version and a US version - which makes sense since I have been aware for years that USCCB has decided to celebrate Epiphany and Ascension day on Sundays.

There is only one version of Catholic Daily Readings... and then there is the actual digitized lectionary used in the USA.

Also, only parts of the States celebrate 'Ascension Thursday Sunday.' Other parts still celebrate Ascension Thursday.

“God watches over the affairs of those who truly love him without their worrying about them.” - St. John of the Cross

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Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 11:35 AM

SineNomine:
There is only one version of Catholic Daily Readings... and then there is the actual digitized lectionary used in the USA.

My comment was based upon the version of Catholic Daily Readings I have had in my library since I think Logos 4 days (https://verbum.com/product/8743/catholic-daily-readings) as well as a separate version that is part of the actual mass books - https://verbum.com/product/180689/catholic-daily-readings. Not sure the differences since I only have the first one.

SineNomine:
Also, only parts of the States celebrate 'Ascension Thursday Sunday.' Other parts still celebrate Ascension Thursday.

I should have known better than to assume... Not that I think that having some small divergences on this is a bad thing.

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

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Blair Laird | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 3:10 PM

SineNomine:
Sort of. Every different country has a slightly different sanctoral cycle, as does each different diocese and parish, as well as some provinces/states/cities.

That being the case I can see why it would be hard to customize each person's logos for their parish. However, I think allowing each person to link up their own daily bible reading app might save a bunch of time and allow it to be more customizable. Having logos linked up with each person's daily study cycle would seem to be an important thing to focus on. Then again there are so many non-liturgical Christians that it might not be a priority. I used to be non-denominational and this sort of thing was never an issue for my studies 

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 26 2020 3:26 PM

Blair Laird:
I guess it's easier for a Roman Catholic in this instance with the logos platform

It is easier, yes, but Logos labels it as the US version and I expect discrpaniences where the west coast dioceses differ from the rest of the country and where my parish, a Dominican parish, follows the Dominican lectionary rather than the Universal dictionary.

Blair Laird:
However, I think allowing each person to link up their own daily bible reading app might save a bunch of time and allow it to be more customizable

Each link to an external software is an additional expense in maintainence - to the extent that it often is the major factor in stopping a project. What would work, however, is:

  • separate the ordo from the lectionary - this leaves the lectionary to have it's liturgical year and sanctoral cycles separate.
  • allow the importing of additional lectionaries for more specific groups - the various orders and geographic regions for the Western Latin Rite Catholics. These lectionaries only need to contain entries that differ from the universal lectionary.
  • allow the cloning of an ordo (regular secular calendar) for the universal lectionary, applying of needed additional lectionaries, and manual adjustments needed for your diocese and parish.

That may sound complicated but it is surprisingly straight forward once you really understand the gut workings of lectionaries. Faithlife would have to do two things:

  • broaden their coverage of lectionaries but without the ordo portion this would be far less maintenance than their current setup.
  • update the ordos periodically ... note the same ordo could be used for multiple lectionaries ... I'm not quite there but I suspect I can eventually get it down to 2-3 which would include Oriental Orthodox lectionaries, Eastern Orthodox lectionaries, Western Catholic & Protestant lectionaries, and the Jewish lectionary.

My approach to FL has been to assume that until the sermon editor supports liturgical dates and perhaps until workflows allow multiple passages, that there is not the support for reworking the lectionaries which, to be blunt, were originally designed in a manner requiring the maximum maintenance costs and minimal fit to what happens on the ground. Once the pastors are used to the system "just working" with lectionaries, it should be possible to build up support for getting them to work better and more widely.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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