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Eric Goforth | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Mar 31 2021 5:56 PM

Any idea when the Greek Interlinear will be converted from ebook to Logos Research? As it is now, it is practically useless. Words show up in a single column instead of normal reading "flow". It won't link to other resources. You can't type a reference in the search box to go to a specific verse. This is the one resource that keeps me using WS instead of Logos at this point. I'm looking forward to having Logos with full functionality in all resources!

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 10 2021 4:28 PM

Bump - I hope someone provides the link to the status page for you.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 79
John W Gillis | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 10 2021 6:15 PM

Funny, I just went to look at the status of this on my "Your Wordsearch Library in Logos" page, and it's not there. It should be. I'm not sure why I'm missing it if others are seeing it in their library.

The Book ID for this is 0:191. I do show the OT volume (0:2825) as "In Progress" toward a Logos Research edition. The link for looking at the status of resources contained in your old WS library is https://www.logos.com/wordsearch/library-migration

I looked up the NT Interlinear on the "Wordsearch Catalog" status page, and it says Available as Ebook. Unfortunately, the status information does not provide insight as to whether this is currently - or ever - planned for a Logos Research edition, or if so, whether it is in progress or not. You'd think it would be, but the resource status information is very ambiguous. If it is being done, a targeted completion date is highly unlikely to be forthcoming.

The link for the status for the entire Wordsearch Catalog is https://www.logos.com/wordsearch/catalog.

Posts 79
John W Gillis | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 10 2021 10:00 PM

I did a little more digging on this, and found that the WS NT Interlinear (WS Book ID: 0:191) is being mapped to a work that is currently an EPUB, but is being converted to Logos Research, and it is currently in Pre-Pub: https://www.logos.com/product/198909/greek-english-interlinear-new-testament

However, there looks to be some confusion in WS to Logos mapping for UBS4-based resources.

Wordsearch had three resources built on the UBS 4 GNT:

  • 0:191, Greek-English Interlinear New Testament (this was converted to a temporary EPUB for some, although I'm missing it entirely)
  • 0:907, UBS Greek New Testament, 4th Edition (which has been mapped to Logos resource The Greek New Testament, Fourth Revised Edition (with Morphology), LLS:LOGOSUBS4).
  • 0:4720, UBS4 Greek New Testament with Friberg Morphology (which has been mapped to the same Logos resource as the un-tagged WS UBS4, LLS:LOGOSUBS4, which is tagged with a Logos morphology).

Mapping the WS plaintext UBS4 to the Logos-tagged LOGOSUBS4 is a nice little upgrade, but mapping 0:4720 to the same resource is not exactly apples-for-apples. The WS UBS4+Friberg is actually almost identical to the WS Greek-English Interlinear, other than obvious formatting differences. Apart from the fact that 0:4720 presents the tag information in a hover pop-up instead of an interlinear table, the biggest differences are that the interlinear provides a clickable "Talking Strongs" link to hear the lemma, while the UBS+F (0:4720) tagging displays information from the WS enhanced Strongs Dictionary resource (added from Thayer & BDB).

The WS 0:4720 resource is really quite nice, and is much more functional than the LOGOSUBS4 resource. I hope they can be de-linked, and 0:4720 be developed into a comparable Logos Research resource.

Some screenshots:

0:4720, WS UBS4+F

0-4720-1

WS 0:191 Greek-English Interlinear NT

0-191-1

LogosUBS4
Logosubs4-1

WS 0:191 Title page
0-191-2

WS 0:4720 Title page

0-4720-2

Posts 5
Eric Goforth | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 11 2021 7:44 PM

If you compare the WS screenshot above with this screenshot of Logos' current version of the Greek Interlinear, I suspect that the reason for my frustration/impatience will be clear.

 Interlinear Screenshot

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Mike Binks | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 12 2021 2:47 AM

Eric Goforth:
Any idea when the Greek Interlinear

Eric Goforth:
I'm looking forward to having Logos with full functionality in all resources!

Hi Eric

I am not a user of any of these resources - they must have entered my library on the coattails of other purchases.

When I search my Library if find that I have several alternative Greek interlinears...

Screenshot 2021-04-12 At 10.41.59

Pretty much all of them look like this...

Screenshot 2021-04-12 At 10.40.05

Have you tried searching or is 'the' interlinear a critical edition?

 

tootle pip

Mike

How to get logs and post them. (now tagging post-apocalyptic fiction as current affairs)

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 12 2021 3:06 AM

If it is the Friberg Morphology coding that is critical it is available:

Err 1

If it is the USB 4.0 that is important:

Err 2

What we need to know to ease your frustration is what piece of data it is that you are really after. Given the complexity of the conversion, I suspect that interlinears will be in later rather than earlier batches of conversions.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 5
Eric Goforth | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 12 2021 5:27 AM

Thanks, Mike. I don't appear to have any other interlinears (except the various Reverse Interlinears that are connected to many of the Bibles).

Posts 5
Eric Goforth | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 12 2021 5:41 AM

MJ, Yes, the parsing info is readily available for individual words. What I miss (and a reason I still use WS more than Logos if working with GNT) is the ability to see the 'big picture,' the entire verse at one time. I find it very helpful, when struggling with a difficult verse, to have the Interlinear available to get the overall meaning and flow of thought in the verse.

The layout of the version that Mike posted would be particularly helpful as it shows more than one verse at a time (which is a limitation in the WS version). I'm hopeful that the Logos version will look like that when it comes out.

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 12 2021 4:25 PM

Eric Goforth:
What I miss (and a reason I still use WS more than Logos if working with GNT) is the ability to see the 'big picture,' the entire verse at one time. I find it very helpful, when struggling with a difficult verse, to have the Interlinear available to get the overall meaning and flow of thought in the verse.

Welcome Big Smile

Alternate for 'big picture' is using Logos Greek Morphology visual filters to highlight words in Greek & English:

94B4 Logos Greek Morphology SBLGNT LEB Php4

Clicking "Rejoice" in Philippians 4:4 in Lexham English Bible (LEB) caused Information Tool to display parsing (my preference is click for Information update, can be configured for hover updating). Screen shot shows many verses while Chapter and Verse numbers are not displayed (were added ~500 years ago during development of concordance for word look-up, which has a number of alignment issues with original language thoughts: e.g. Philippians 4:6 is in the middle of a Greek sentence). Blue background for thanksgiving in Philippians 4:6 and rejoiced in Philippians 4:10 is corresponding word highlighting after clicking Rejoice in Philippians 4:4

Thankful for free Lexham Intro Collection (5 vols.) that includes Society of Biblical Literature Greek New Testament (SBLGNT) and LEB

Thankful for free Logos 9 Basic and Verbum 9 Basic that includes free use of LEB Reverse Interlinear (aligned to SBLGNT)

Logos Wiki Extended Tips for Highlighting and Visual Filters has

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 79
John W Gillis | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 12 2021 8:29 PM

MJ. Smith:
What we need to know to ease your frustration is what piece of data it is that you are really after.

Thanks - I'm not the OP, nor am I particularly frustrated with the way the WS UBS4 resources have been migrated, but I've had a robust Logos library for a decade or so now, and hardly need the WS resources in Logos, but not everyone is in that position. 

The point is not so much around which piece of data as about the integration of WS. Comparable tools exist in Logos, sure, but the Friberg AGNT would be a $70 add-on for somebody, and the UBS4 with Logos Morphology would be another, I think, $40 (I can't find it in the store tonight, but thought I saw it yesterday @ ~$40). Logos has been terrific about providing WS users with comparable resources in Logos, so they may want to know when they seem to have missed the mark on resource mapping.

The lexical elements baked into the WS resource are also quite different than the tags in the Logos UBS4, incorporating quite a bit of the entry's content from the WS enhanced Talking Strong's Dictionary, which provides a quick & easy but fairly comprehensive birds-eye view in a hover pop-up - no need to click-thru unless you want to dig deeper. The tagged UBS4s between WS & Logos are not really the same thing.

Posts 2384
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 13 2021 8:37 AM

Eric Goforth:
What I miss (and a reason I still use WS more than Logos if working with GNT) is the ability to see the 'big picture,' the entire verse at one time. I find it very helpful, when struggling with a difficult verse, to have the Interlinear available to get the overall meaning and flow of thought in the verse.

Eric, I am just a user so I do not know what plans the programmers have for traditional interlinears from WordSearch. In the meantime, have you considered opening a Biblical Language resource (UBS 4 shown) with the INFORMATION Pane? This would allow a user to see the flow of the original, with an easy glance to see the various ways the form has been translated along with pronunciation and morphology.

Image
You may have easier access if you select HOVER rather than CLICK in the 3 dot menu

Image

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 342
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 13 2021 8:56 AM

John W Gillis:
The lexical elements baked into the WS resource are also quite different than the tags in the Logos UBS4,

I've never had WS, but I'm hoping some of the conversion challenges (this thread as an example) will enhance the Logos stable. Yesterday, I accidentally found an analytical lexicon prepub that involved Maurice Robinson. I thought that was strange, since Logos is chock full of analyticals. More?? But it seems to be a WS, and offers an odd twist, that may be quite useful ... I'm still 'checking'. 

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David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 13 2021 1:44 PM

John W Gillis:
The tagged UBS4s between WS & Logos are not really the same thing.

Information on the UBS4Interlinear tagging identifies the morphological database as a Logos product.

a license to view UBS4 Interlinear with Morphology: product 

LLS:LOGOSUBS4INT
2015-04-14T23:01:02Z
LOGOSUBS4INT.logos4

may go a long way to el

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 79
John W Gillis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 13 2021 6:20 PM

David Thomas:
Information on the UBS4Interlinear tagging identifies the morphological database as a Logos product.

My point exactly, which is the biggest reason I contend that mapping the WS UBS4+Friberg to the Logos UBS4+Morph is not really apples to apples.

However, when Logos finishes the Wordsearch Interlinear New Testament, they should have a text that matches the WS USB4+Friberg almost exactly, except for formatting (the UBS4 base, the Fribergs' AGNT morphology, and the WS enhanced Talking Strongs for lexical tags). It seems like that should be fairly easy to convert to a non-interlinear format by displaying just the surface text and leaving the tags embedded to show up somewhere on click/hover (the little pop-up rectangle in the bottom of the Logos UBS4+Morph seems inadequate for the amount of info the WS resource embeds).

That would seem to me to be a much better Logos resource in terms of trying to provide like-for-like replacements in Logos for WS resources, without needing a ton of additional work.

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