Christian Family Base Packages - now available!

Page 3 of 5 (85 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next >
This post has 84 Replies | 10 Followers

Posts 5968
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 11:08 AM

1Cor10:31:
This is flawed logic. The "so" simply doesn't follow. Just because the agreement has the same name "Terms of Service," doesn't mean nothing has changed. Obviously, the content inside has changed; otherwise, Faithlife wouldn't have put out a new contract. 

What I think you missed is that Dave quoted from the official explanation of the OLD Terms of Service, then called an EULA, in order to prove that the 2019 update did not change what you are accusing it to have changed.

Please use descriptive thread titles to attract helpful posts & save others time. Thanks!

Posts 5968
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 11:23 AM

Daniel Motley (Faithlife):
With five levels to choose from, there's a package to fit every family's study needs.

Now that the PDPs are set up correctly, the level that seems most attractive to me is Level 5. It includes six licenses for the Bronze Feature Set, and at the Library-only level, it includes six licenses for the Encyclopaedia Britannica Collection at a cost of only $50 USD more than said collection at regular price for a single license.

I can see some families, especially homeschooling ones, quite appreciating the above, whether or not they place any value on any of the other resources that it includes, such as a variety of Protestant Bibles (and two editions of the Tanakh), some commentary sets that on the whole will probably be most interesting to lay evangelicals, enough general Bible-related and other reference works to start off with, The Imitation of Christ, a bit of Greek and Hebrew stuff, two sets of the Apostolic Fathers, St. Augustine's Confessions, the eleven-volume G. K. Chesterton Collection, and a bunch of other books that might be interesting to some people (especially if Calvinists).

All in all, not a bad first stab (I think) at FL's apparent core target audience for these packages: families of anglophone American lay evangelical Protestants.

Bodes well for a future Verbum edition *cough*.

Please use descriptive thread titles to attract helpful posts & save others time. Thanks!

Posts 93
nl | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 1:01 PM

Greg Dement:

RE: Spouses.

I am optimistic that FL in good faith stands by their communication to us customers by their reps.  In late Aug of 2020 before I began utilizing Logos and made a large purchase, I asked about my wife using Logos.  I am paraphrasing but the communication was that although their written policy states that it is for single person use, as long as my wife was not using it professionally they understand and make an exception by extending the courtesy for a spouse to be able to utilize for personal use.  I have spoken to more than one rep about this and the answer has been consistent.  Either reps are going rogue (maybe possible for one rep but not likely for multiple reps) and misleading or they are instructed to communicate this corporately and is a genuine courtesy extended that they will stand by.  

Again, I am optimistic and believe I can trust them in good faith. 

When I was signing up to spend a lot of money on Logos I asked about this also and it was confirmed that they view my wife and I as one person and it is fine for her to use my Logos resources.

I will continue to encourage my wife to use my Logos when I'm not on it :)

Posts 27910
Forum MVP
Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 3:35 PM

SineNomine:

This is flawed logic. The "so" simply doesn't follow. Just because the agreement has the same name "Terms of Service," doesn't mean nothing has changed. Obviously, the content inside has changed; otherwise, Faithlife wouldn't have put out a new contract. 

What I think you missed is that Dave quoted from the official explanation of the OLD Terms of Service, then called an EULA, in order to prove that the 2019 update did not change what you are accusing it to have changed.

Correct!

Dave
===

Windows 11 & Android 8

Posts 224
1Cor10:31 | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 4:18 PM

Dave Hooton:

SineNomine:

This is flawed logic. The "so" simply doesn't follow. Just because the agreement has the same name "Terms of Service," doesn't mean nothing has changed. Obviously, the content inside has changed; otherwise, Faithlife wouldn't have put out a new contract. 

What I think you missed is that Dave quoted from the official explanation of the OLD Terms of Service, then called an EULA, in order to prove that the 2019 update did not change what you are accusing it to have changed.

Correct!

Here is the latest: https://faithlife.com/terms?__hstc=18058406.9496ffb8997fda4ca898bc7f6a6fad9b.1615055656636.1618151361303.1618527604639.8&__hssc=18058406.1.1618527604639&__hsfp=3392702037

Can somebody post the earlier one so I can compare latest (as given above) with the previous one? I'm sorry if you've already done so and I missed it.

See below response from Mark Smith, an active participant on the Forum, pointing out that Faithlife changed its user agreement in March 2019 and moved to one user.

Who is correct? Dave or Mark?

Mark Smith:

I had emailed Logos in Jan 2019 about my spouse using the resources I own. Here is what they emailed me: "Since you are her spouse, you would be able to share your Logos account with your wife with no problem. However, keep in mind that since you are sharing license, whatever notes, highlights or changes she makes to the software on her computer will also be reflected on your software in your computer."

Thus what I have can be accessed by my spouse already. So what is new that Faithlife is doing? I am sorry I am not able to see the subtleties.

By the way, sharing resources with people living with you under the same roof (including my child) should be allowed. If I buy a book in hard copy, of course, my children and spouse can read the book. Why is it different with digital resources? Maybe, I don't understand copyright laws.

I don't represent Faithlife so don't have an official answer. In the past FL looked the other way when a spouse who was not employed by a religious institution used resources licensed to his/her spouse. In March 2019 FL updated the Terms of Service. The relevant section is this one (the highlighting is my own).

Let me repeat the email I got from Faithlife verbatim: "Since you are her spouse, you would be able to share your Logos account with your wife with no problem. However, keep in mind that since you are sharing license, whatever notes, highlights or changes she makes to the software on her computer will also be reflected on your software in your computer." Does this email look like "Faithlife looked the other way" as Mark claims? Absolutely not. It is clear that Faithlife expected family to share resources.

So we are left with 2 choices. (1) If nothing changed in EULA in Mar 2019, then spouse can continue to use the resources. (2) If EULA changed in Mar 2019, then spouse can use the resources purchased before Mar 2019 but not resources purchased after Mar 2019.

Posts 27910
Forum MVP
Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 6:18 PM

1Cor10:31:
So we are left with 2 choices. (1) If nothing changed in EULA in Mar 2019, then spouse can continue to use the resources. (2) If EULA changed in Mar 2019, then spouse can use the resources purchased before Mar 2019 but not resources purchased after Mar 2019.

Incorrect! The March 2019 update is much more formal in its expression of the Terms, but it retained the single (one) user stipulation of the earlier Terms (then called EULA). I don't have a copy of that EULA, so I quoted a summary from the FAQ page. They both express the legal position.

1Cor10:31:
Let me repeat the email I got from Faithlife verbatim:

Whilst that may be consistent with what Mark stated, note that he also said "In the past FL looked the other way" and pointed to the (unchanged) legal position in the 2019 update. You can continue to justify your position based on the email, but it isn't the legal position (though it may be useful to prevent you being prosecuted!).

Dave
===

Windows 11 & Android 8

Posts 30531
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 7:04 PM

I encourage you to email Bob himself with your concerns. 

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 224
1Cor10:31 | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 7:14 PM

Dave Hooton:

Incorrect! The March 2019 update is much more formal in its expression of the Terms, but it retained the single (one) user stipulation of the earlier Terms (then called EULA). I don't have a copy of that EULA, so I quoted a summary from the FAQ page. They both express the legal position.

I've tried to be patient because I understand people are wired and endowed differently. But there is only so much a man can take of this consistently BS logic. I am tired of it.  

The FAQ is as of today, it is not before the EULA was amended in Mar 2019. So you still can't prove whether anything changed as of Mar 2019. 

Dave Hooton:

Whilst that may be consistent with what Mark stated, note that he also said "In the past FL looked the other way" and pointed to the (unchanged) legal position in the 2019 update.

Do you even read before posting?FL didn't look the other way was the point I was making with my previous post. So let me repeat one more time. what I said in my previous post. Maybe, you will read this time.

Let me repeat the email I got from Faithlife verbatim: "Since you are her spouse, you would be able to share your Logos account with your wife with no problem. However, keep in mind that since you are sharing license, whatever notes, highlights or changes she makes to the software on her computer will also be reflected on your software in your computer."

Does this email look like "Faithlife looked the other way" as Mark claims? Absolutely not. It is clear that Faithlife expected family to share resources.

Dave Hooton:

You can continue to justify your position based on the email, but it isn't the legal position (though it may be useful to prevent you being prosecuted!).

Get off your self-righteous horse. Again, do you read? I've said "My wife has NEVER EVER used Logos. I’ve been trying to suck her into it, but have not been successful thus far. Faithlife can look up my account and confirm that."

If you'll ever get to know my theology, you'll understand why it is in your own self-interests to be ethical. 

Also, check out Carson Wentz and his philosophy: #AO1

Posts 224
1Cor10:31 | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 7:18 PM

JT (alabama24):

I encourage you to email Bob himself with your concerns. 

Thanks JT. When my wife decides she wants to research using Logos, I will take the route you're suggesting. I just don't see it happening anytime soon. We work together professionally, we workout together,..., so we spend enormous amount of time together. I think she feels that doing Biblical stuff is one of the few things we can do separately, otherwise we will be in each other's face 24x7!

Posts 35777
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 7:19 PM

1Cor10:31:
Get off your self-righteous horse.

Name calling does not belong in the forums ... and I know Dave won't call you on it.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 224
1Cor10:31 | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 7:30 PM

MJ. Smith:

Get off your self-righteous horse.

Name calling does not belong in the forums ... and I know Dave won't call you on it.

I see how this forum works.

Impugning someone‘s character is ok, but calling out people who impugn others‘ character is not ok. 

Posts 35777
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 15 2021 7:32 PM

Big Smile

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 5968
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 16 2021 12:14 PM

1Cor10:31:

Dave Hooton:

You can continue to justify your position based on the email, but it isn't the legal position (though it may be useful to prevent you being prosecuted!).

Get off your self-righteous horse. Again, do you read? I've said "My wife has NEVER EVER used Logos. I’ve been trying to suck her into it, but have not been successful thus far. Faithlife can look up my account and confirm that."

Since your wife has never used Logos, you clearly couldn't be prosecuted right now for violating the ToS. Since you've "been trying to suck her into it", by your own admission, it is possible that she might use Logos in the future. If she were to use Logos in the future, then in the event that prosecution was later being considered for you for having potentially violated to the ToS, the email you've been quoting from in this thread "may be useful to prevent you being prosecuted".

I read, too. Wink

Please use descriptive thread titles to attract helpful posts & save others time. Thanks!

Posts 224
1Cor10:31 | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 16 2021 12:18 PM

SineNomine:

Dave Hooton:

You can continue to justify your position based on the email, but it isn't the legal position (though it may be useful to prevent you being prosecuted!).

Get off your self-righteous horse. Again, do you read? I've said "My wife has NEVER EVER used Logos. I’ve been trying to suck her into it, but have not been successful thus far. Faithlife can look up my account and confirm that."

Since your wife has never used Logos, you clearly couldn't be prosecuted right now for violating the ToS. Since you've "been trying to suck her into it", by your own admission, it is possible that she might use Logos in the future. If she were to use Logos in the future, then in the event that prosecution was later being considered for you for having potentially violated to the ToS, the email you've been quoting from in this thread "may be useful to prevent you being prosecuted".

I read, too. Wink

See below my response to JT

1Cor10:31:

JT (alabama24):

I encourage you to email Bob himself with your concerns. 

Thanks JT. When my wife decides she wants to research using Logos, I will take the route you're suggesting. I just don't see it happening anytime soon. We work together professionally, we workout together,..., so we spend enormous amount of time together. I think she feels that doing Biblical stuff is one of the few things we can do separately, otherwise we will be in each other's face 24x7!

Posts 1540
Kiyah | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 16 2021 2:17 PM

Daniel Motley (Faithlife):

Hello everyone,

I'm happy to announce a new line of base packages that we are adding to the familiar line-up: the Christian Family base packages.

These packages seek to serve families who want to do Bible study together by allowing one to purchase six licenses of any level of package for one price. With five levels to choose from, there's a package to fit every family's study needs.

To learn more or to purchase, check out our Christian Family packages page.

When I go to this page I can't actually see what is in each package. Has something changed? Are the packages being updated? Am I missing something?

Posts 5968
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 16 2021 2:32 PM

Kiyah:
Has something changed?

Yes. There was an option to see inside yesterday.

Please use descriptive thread titles to attract helpful posts & save others time. Thanks!

Posts 3004
Forum MVP
Jacob Hantla | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 17 2021 12:37 PM

Is it just me or am I doing something really stupid?


I can't figure out how to see what is in each of these packages. At the site: https://www.logos.com/christian-family I'm able to add any one of the levels to my cart and assign it to my family group. But I see no obvious way to see what is actually in each level. 

Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org

Posts 122
Greg Dement | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 17 2021 1:34 PM

Hmm, there was another link I used before to see Package contents, now it is not working.

Posts 2264
Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 18 2021 7:22 PM

Jacob Hantla:

Is it just me or am I doing something really stupid?


I can't figure out how to see what is in each of these packages. At the site: https://www.logos.com/christian-family I'm able to add any one of the levels to my cart and assign it to my family group. But I see no obvious way to see what is actually in each level. 

I cannot figure it out either.

Posts 269
LogosEmployee
Daniel Motley (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 19 2021 8:06 AM

Hi all,

There was a display issue regarding the product pages that forced us to take them offline. They're still available for sell via www.logos.com/christian-family. We're working to provide an alternative way to look at the contents of the package and should be up by end of day today or tomorrow. My apologies for the issues!

Product Manager, Faithlife

Page 3 of 5 (85 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next > | RSS