Logos, Biblia.com by Faithlife, BibleWorks and Search Features/Functions: Help!

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Posts 47
Curtis | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, May 25 2021 7:49 PM

Greetings!

I encountered several "search" issues and at the bottom, I will include additional questions concerning searching in Logos, questions about Logos and BibleWorks, etc. 

I will be using the KJV Bible in these examples below:

In order to test a good "search engine" for the Bible, I do the following tests:

1.  Let's look up the words without quotation marks:  Jesus wept.

Three Scriptures should come up in the results:  Matthew 26:75; Mark 14:72 and John 11:35.

I can provide several screen shots of various Bible search engines that show these three Scriptures, but here is the one from BibleWorks:

BibleWorks passed my test.

Now I will try using Biblia.com by Faithlife.  Here is a screenshot:

As you can see, in the left hand column, you will find those 3 exact Scriptures when searching for the two words: Jesus wept (without using quotation marks).

Biblia.com by Faithlife also passed my test.

2.  Let's look up the SPECIFIC words: "Jesus wept".

One Scripture should come up in the results which is John 11:35.

Here is a screen shot from BibleWorks: 

Now let's look up the specific words: "Jesus wept" in Biblia.com by Faithlife.  Here is  a screenshot:

If you look in the left hand column, you will see that one result populated and it is the exact results.

Biblia.com by Faithlife passed my test.

3.  When I look up the two words (Jesus wept) in Logos OR if I look up the SPECIFIC WORDS "Jesus wept" ... this is what I found in Logos Bible Software and apps.logos.com, this is what happens:

Fuzzy results? 

This did not pass my test.

4.  Here is another example.  If I look up the word "Witty" in the KJV Bible in Logos, this is the fuzzy results:

This DID NOT pass my test.  It actually made it worse!

Here is what it looks like in BibleWorks:

Here is the result from Biblia.com by Faithlife:

As you can see in the left hand column, Biblia.com by Faithlife has also passed this test.

My Questions:

A.  How do you perform a specific word search and get the specific search result to come up such as the word "Witty" in the KJV Bible?


Note: In Logos, I received "Fuzzy Results" and then had to scroll down through many verses in order to find the reference with the word "witty" in it, which only appears once in the KJV Bible.

B.  What other ways can you search for specific phrases or words?

C.  It seems like to get the results I am looking for, I would need to use Biblia.com by Faithlife or other Bible search engines. 

But is there a way that Logos Bible Software could pull up the exact results I am looking so it can pass my test?    If so, how? 

D.  How many of you miss BibleWorks Bible Software?

E.  Would Faithlife ever consider purchasing or acquiring BibleWorks just as they did with WordSearch?

One of the biggest reasons I miss BibleWorks is because it was SUPER FAST to search for Bible texts, key phrases, and to hover over the Greek and Hebrew words. 

It's sad to see powerful Bible software to disappear.  I think BibleWorks would be a great additional Bible tool for Faithlife to acquire.  What do you think?

In the meantime, I created this post mainly to find out how I can use Logos Bible Software and to get the kind of results I get from Biblia.com by Faithlife as you have seen in the screenshots above.

If I can get the same results in Biblia.com by Faithlife, surely Logos could produce the same search results, right?

Any feedback, comments and recommendations would be greatly appreciated about anything that is discussed in my post. =)

Blessings,
Curtis

Posts 33841
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 25 2021 7:58 PM

Curtis:
I think BibleWorks would be a great additional Bible tool for Faithlife to acquire.  What do you think?

I asked in the forums around the time of the Wordsearch purchase. The response was that Faithlife had made an overture to BibleWorks but they were uninterested. Any effort to mediate a deal must start by pressuring the owners of BibleWorks.

Regarding your tests, isn't Biblia.com a legacy site? Shouldn't the tests be done against the web app for the current Logos search?

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 47
Curtis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 25 2021 8:12 PM

MJ. Smith:
Regarding your tests, isn't Biblia.com a legacy site? Shouldn't the tests be done against the web app for the current Logos search?

Hi MJ Smith: 


Yes, I performed the test in Logos Bible Software and app.logos.com and provided some of the screenshots in my examples.

Thanks for your follow up concerning Bibleworks and Faithlife.

When I look up key words such as "BibleWorks" in the forum, I get this message:

For some reason, I'm not getting great results from my searches in the Faithlife forum or from Logos Bible Software or Apps.Logos.com! 

Posts 12162
Forum MVP
NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 25 2021 11:51 PM

Curtis:
Any feedback, comments and recommendations would be greatly appreciated about anything that is discussed in my post. =)

The Fuzzy Search functionality sometimes may be helpful, in many cases it will return texts that are only loosely related to your search term. Help says: "Fuzzy Bible Search is a way to find specific verses or pericopes without relying on an exact phrase. It allows one to locate verses or pericopes for which they may only remember key words, small phrases, or translations." which hints at the fact that the Fuzzy Search algorithm is an inexact way of trying to find things which sometimes works well and sometimes less so. You can't compare Fuzzy Search results with exact search results of Logos or any other bible software.

I can confirm that the precise search for "Jesus wept" (or any other search term) does not work in app.logos.com - I suspect that's caused by the fact that this bible is brand new and possibly the necessary index has not been built up for the Web App, i.e. a temporary issue with this specific resource in the Web App. If this persists, it would probably good to raise it in the Web App subforum - the FL employees monitor it closely and react fast.

On the other hand, using the desktop version, all's well:

Image


Hope this helps a bit

Running Logos 9 latest (beta) version on Win 10

Posts 19430
Forum MVP
Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 26 2021 12:57 AM

Curtis:

A.  How do you perform a specific word search and get the specific search result to come up such as the word "Witty" in the KJV Bible?


Note: In Logos, I received "Fuzzy Results" and then had to scroll down through many verses in order to find the reference with the word "witty" in it, which only appears once in the KJV Bible.

WebApp and Logos/Verbum option is collapsing Fuzzy Results section (click triangle)

Jesus wept search in Logos Web App (with Fuzzy Results collapsed)

Verbum 9.5 RC 3 Search (with Fuzzy Results collapsed):

Lexham English Bible (LEB) is a modern language literal translation.

Curtis:
B.  What other ways can you search for specific phrases or words?

Logos Wiki includes Search HELP

Curtis:
One of the biggest reasons I miss BibleWorks is because it was SUPER FAST to search for Bible texts, key phrases, and to hover over the Greek and Hebrew words. 

My favorite feature in Logos & Verbum desktop applications (on macOS & Windows) is visual filter highlighting that can combine thousands of search results for simultaneous display: e.g. various Greek Morphology aspects highlighted at the same time in many words (caveat is taking awhile when opening resource)

Logos Wiki => Extended Tips for Highlighting and Visual Filters includes:

Curtis:
For some reason, I'm not getting great results from my searches in the Faithlife forum or from Logos Bible Software or Apps.Logos.com! 

Suggest trying an internet search engine: (DuckDuckGo, Google, ...)

site:community.logos.com BibleWorks

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 12162
Forum MVP
NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 27 2021 5:02 AM


That was then:

NB.Mick:
I can confirm that the precise search for "Jesus wept" (or any other search term) does not work in app.logos.com - I suspect that's caused by the fact that this bible is brand new and possibly the necessary index has not been built up for the Web App, i.e. a temporary issue with this specific resource in the Web App.

This is now:

Image

All's well for searches coming from the command/Go box as well as inline searches. 

Running Logos 9 latest (beta) version on Win 10

Posts 47
Curtis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 27 2021 5:27 AM

Awesome!

Thank you everyone for providing followup and feedback.  I truly appreciate it. =)


Blessings,

Curtis

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