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Posts 107
Chris Lane | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Aug 23 2021 4:54 PM

I am curious why I cannot construct a search containing "lemma:ἀποκάλυψις" and "lemma:φανερόω" that will return Romans 16:25-26. None of the following searches will return this hit:

  • lemma:ἀποκάλυψις AND lemma:φανερόω
  • lemma:ἀποκάλυψις NEAR lemma:φανερόω
  • lemma:ἀποκάλυψις WITHIN 15 WORDS lemma:φανερόω
  • ἀποκάλυψιν  NEAR <Lemma = lbs/el/φανερόω>
  • ἀποκάλυψιν  NEAR φανερωθέντος

Am I missing something? Do I need to reindex my NA28 & UBS5? Is this a bug?

Any help is appreciated.

Posts 89
Karl Fritz Jr. | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 23 2021 5:01 PM

<Lemma ~ lbs/el/ἀποκάλυψις> <Lemma ~ lbs/el/φανερόω>

^ that one worked for me if I changed the search to BASIC search (rather than BIBLE search) and then changed the resources from "all resources" to ESV.  Bible search would be searching for those two words *within the same verse* as I understand it.  Others will know better.

Posts 107
Chris Lane | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 23 2021 5:06 PM

Thanks for the help, Karl. This did work for me, as you said, in BASIC search, though the same syntax nor the same with "NEAR" added between the two search commands (which, in my understanding, should catch the words across the verse break) did not work in any other search mode (or whatever they are called). This is pretty perplexing. Can anyone shed light on this?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 23 2021 6:51 PM

Chris Lane:
Can anyone shed light on this?

Karl's answer was correct - A Bible search assumes "in the same verse". Switching to a basic search changes that to "in the same chapter"

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 107
Chris Lane | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 23 2021 7:31 PM

MJ, wouldn’t the NEAR or WITHIN X WORDS operators have circumvented the same verse constraint? If not, how does one do this in the Bible search (surely, there is a way to do this, no?)?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 23 2021 7:58 PM

Chris Lane:
MJ, wouldn’t the NEAR or WITHIN X WORDS operators have circumvented the same verse constraint? If not, how does one do this in the Bible search (surely, there is a way to do this, no?)?

No, the proximity operators do not change the scope. The way to do it is to run a Basic search, limiting to Bible text if you wish but I rarely find that necessary. Think of a Bible Search as a subset of a Basic Search - one in which a scope of verse and text of Bible text are preselected while the Basic Search is one with a scope of article and all text.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 23 2021 8:53 PM

Chris Lane:
... wouldn’t the NEAR or WITHIN X WORDS operators have circumvented the same verse constraint?

No (in Bible & Morph Search that currently has artificial verse numbering constraint). Caveat is some Bibles have verse numbering ranges instead of individual verses: e.g. Bible Search for uncovering WITHIN 18 WORDS known in The New Testament: An Expanded Translation by Kenneth S Wuest includes Romans 16:21-27 in search results.

Bible Search for <Lemma = lbs/el/φανερόω> OR <Lemma lbs/el/ἀποκάλυψις> OR <Lemma = lbs/el/ἀποκαλύπτω> in ESV includes Romans 16:25 and Romans 16:26 (along with other verses that have one of the Lemma's, but not the others nearby: can scroll search results looking for adjacent verses that have different color search results)

Chris Lane:
If not, how does one do this in the Bible search

Please vote for Feedback post => Add multiple search scopes for Bible search that has 41 votes with status "Needs your Opinion"

Caveat: new Feedback needs a separate login so please vote => Add the feedback website to the Faithlife SSO system that has 39 votes.

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 107
Chris Lane | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 24 2021 11:52 AM

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :):
Please vote for Feedback post => Add multiple search scopes for Bible search 

Thanks for the input & suggestion, Keep Smiling; vote added. Hopefull this gets upgraded from "Needs your Opinion" relatively soon!

Posts 107
Chris Lane | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 24 2021 11:54 AM

Thanks for the explanation, MJ. As always, you are a great help in these forums! I'm surprised that I have missed this for so many years!!

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