L4 Not for Me

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Posts 172
Chris Ease | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:34 PM

After downloading and indexing for another day of downloading and indexing, I think I'm up to date; however, as great as this program looks, my 7 yr old computer cannot handle this program.  The program is slow, not fast as advertised and seems to freeze with occasional crazy colors or blotouts in the background.  The program is totally inefficient with my computer and totally frustrating.  L3 runs so much better.  Yes, I have a 7 yr old computer than runs xp on 1 gig ram with a 3000+ athlon 32 bit processor and a 160 gig drive.  I have plenty of drive but something in the machine lacks.  I went to control panel and changed cache to 2000meg and changed for fastest performance, sacrificing viewing quality.  Still, that really didn't help and I have closed and opened program, including restarts and defragging computer.  I guess L3 is where I will be until I buy some kind of super processor.  Any suggestions for helping a new program not to run terribly sluggish are greatly appreciated.

Posts 2
Ingemar "Lloyd" Woods | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:50 PM

Your posting helped me. My system is a 1 year old emachine with about the same Ram, HD ectra. I just purchased Scholars-Silver 10/30/09 ironic that it was shipped on 11/02/09 and still in route. I really was not happy to have been told that Logos shipped the V3! Can any one give me advice? I can replace my computer ...just confused by being sent V3. Any advice is appreciated.

Posts 3883
Floyd Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:52 PM

For now I am leaning the same way.  I finally finished indexing after 36 hours, but I find the interface and the performance lacking.  I will continue to play with V4 to see if I can grow to like it.  I will use V3 as I work and then take some play time to compare the performance and capabilities to V4.   I will probably wait till some book that I want to acquire is available only in V4 before switching.  In the meantime, I will work on V3.

Blessings,
Floyd

Pastor-Patrick.blogspot.com

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:54 PM

Chris:
Any suggestions for helping a new program not to run terribly sluggish are greatly appreciated.

Well, there's not much you can do here without upgrading your computer, or getting a new one. But there are a few things to try. First, defragment your hard drive. Second, look at your background tasks and eliminate as many as you can (without breaking anything, of course). Someone got a bit of better performance by having their anti-virus ignore the Logos4 directory (and all subdirectories).

But some of your issues sound like video issues. If you have integrated video, it's especially problematic, since video calls are processed through the CPU, slowing down the system further. L4 has some video intensive operations.

There's a freeware utility called Glary Utilities that may help to get some things going. Be careful of optimizing your registry, but it may find old entries from programs you no longer need. Even optimizing the registry can help (allegedly). There's a startup manager that might help eliminate stuff you really don't need running all the time, a clean up utility, and a few other goodies. CCleaner is great for eliminating clutter as well.

I've never found a good formula that gave better results for cache management than letting Windows manage the cache. Some IT guys might shoot me, but I've just not found anything that gave better results.

When you say you're up to date, I assume you mean that you have all the XP updates and service packs too.

Getting a machine to run reliably for 7 years is quite an accomplishment. Good for you. If your finances can handle it, there are some really inexpensive computers out there that will do more for less than almost anything 7 years old. With Christmas coming up, try mastering that 'sad puppy dog' look. Ya never know.

But L3 is still around and will be supported for the next while at least, so, even if you can't jump on the L4 bandwagon, you've still got what you've always had. Not much consolation, perhaps, but try to be a 'glass half-full' kind of guy.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 172
Chris Ease | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:56 PM

V3 will run fine on your current machine.  I have no idea how L4 will react.  I use broadband for internet and have 8meg package which isn't shabby on the speed.  Also, I have Leader's Library with many add-ons, but still just under 500 resources.

Posts 1930
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:57 PM

Ingemar Woods:

Your posting helped me. My system is a 1 year old emachine with about the same Ram, HD ectra. I just purchased Scholars-Silver 10/30/09 ironic that it was shipped on 11/02/09 and still in route. I really was not happy to have been told that Logos shipped the V3! Can any one give me advice? I can replace my computer ...just confused by being sent V3. Any advice is appreciated.

Logos takes into account your purchase date for upgrade discounts, so after you install v3, go to the upgrade page.  You might get a VERY cheap (I have heard maybe even free) upgrade.

On a different note, L4 does demand more hardware than L3.  No one is forcing a move at this point.  The engine is free, so you can try both and see which works best for you.

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:07 PM

Ingemar Woods:
Your posting helped me. My system is a 1 year old emachine with about the same Ram, HD ectra. I just purchased Scholars-Silver 10/30/09 ironic that it was shipped on 11/02/09 and still in route. I really was not happy to have been told that Logos shipped the V3! Can any one give me advice? I can replace my computer ...just confused by being sent V3. Any advice is appreciated.

Logos designed version 4 specifically to run well on computers that are 2 years old or younger. Yours should do fine.

Check your upgrade price online (if you haven't done so already). Just log in under your account name. You may not be able to do this until after you receive and install 3.0. Your price will be reduced because of your very recent purchase. Remember that version 4 collections have more resources than the version 3 that you purchased, so you will not be able to get a completely free upgrade, I'm sure. You can download the 4.0 engine for free and for a small sum get some additional tools to work in 4.0.

Since you are new to Logos it hardly makes sense to spend time learning 3.0 and then soon after upgrading to 4.0. Some of us will run both for awhile because of some features not yet available in 4.0, but these will more than likely not be an issue for you since you are new to Logos (I'm assuming).

Logos will be fair to you and if you have problems with upgrade pricing call.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 2
Ingemar "Lloyd" Woods | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:22 PM

Mark,

Thank you.

Posts 738
Frank Sauer | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:24 PM

Just to add in, during testing there were quite a few, myself included, ready to toss v4 to the side. To be honest there are things that are not yet a part of the program that really annoy me because I use them frequently.

I believe everyone hates the indexing deal, but it is far improved from the early stages. I personally do not like the lack of user control.

However that aside, since no software company is going to please everyone. Version 4 could not be written with the power and functionality it has with 7 year old computers in mind.

I too have an old single core 2 gigs of ram, maybe 100 gig HDD system that "runs" Version 4, but does not RUN V4... My laptop however with a dual core and 3 gigs of ram runs it beautifully.

For anyone who wants to get discouraged or complain about Logos not having V4 capable of running on old systems - please look at any Operating System release and see if it is recommended to be installed and run on a system even 4 years old... You may say well that is an OS, well Version 4 is a Bible Study Software OS, it carries that much functionality and power.

So while I will continue to harass Bob, Bradley, George, Melissa and crew about the features I miss most and some other things, in a friendly manner as well; I will recognize their hard work and the fact that the product they put out is by far the most powerful and complete Bible Study System on the market today. (Yes I have tried the latest and greatest PC Study Bible, the only advantage there was the Early Church Fathers were in lower cost packages for guys like me who have a very very low budget for software. System, resources and program wise - no comparison!

I know I can't wait to upgrade the desktop system here. My wife and I are putting a few bucks aside here and there. You can get a tremendous upgrade on a 7 year old system for under $500 for a desktop... Version 4 will impress you beyond belief then!

Posts 600
Bobby Terhune | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:26 PM

Actually Bob has said that there is a free upgrade time frame for those who recently purchased a L3 package. He didn't define what that time frame was, but I'm sure Ingemar is within that time frame.

Posts 2
Ingemar "Lloyd" Woods | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:27 PM

Kenneth,

Thank you.

Posts 2
Ingemar "Lloyd" Woods | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:30 PM

Bobby,

Thank you.

Posts 172
Chris Ease | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:32 PM

Well, I turned my firewall down from stealth to standard, and L4 is fully accepted by McAfee in permissions.  Still, there is little to none on improvement while L3 is almost instant in function, except when initially opening program.  I think video acceleration could be an issue and a while back I searched and searched to update video driver and all I could find was an update from like 2004.  I will say this, this computer has never had the ability to run 3d on microsoft live maps and I knew then that the video card was far outdated, so I assume from the sluggish performance that I have a similar issue.  Since I have always used windows, I believe for the money I will use windows whenever my next purchase can be met.  I have always been skeptical of vista and I wonder if windows 7 is a major improvement?  I also think that when I can upgrade computers that I should settle for nothing less than 4 gig on the ram side.  Anyway, I will still visit the forum and listen to "yalls" trials and tribulations as well as your triumphs with L4.  Peace!

Posts 38
jcc | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:35 PM
Yup. Same thing here. I found that it's very slow and not very useable in that sense. Even moving the mouse around is laggy. Looks like too many fancy graphics and too many thing going on just by moving the mouse around. I hope they are able to address this in the future by allowing the fancy features to be turned off. (Or maybe I already can, someone can point me to how to do that would be nice.) I'm running it on an OQO, so upgrading the computer is out of the question (they went out of business, and there are no other computer like it.)
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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:37 PM

Chris,

Hope if and when you can afford a new computer you will find 4.0 to be your version of choice.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 172
Chris Ease | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:48 PM

Mark, I like what I have seen and I have noticed what Frank mentioned about lack of user controlled functions.  I figure this computer, if alive, will be at least 8 yrs old or another yr to go before I can make the upgrade.  I will def consider L4 at that time.  All I did was download the engine, so I didn't make an early purchase and I enjoy L3, but L4 looks sweet.

Posts 386
Clinton Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 7:13 PM

Ingemar Woods:

Your posting helped me. My system is a 1 year old emachine with about the same Ram, HD ectra. I just purchased Scholars-Silver 10/30/09 ironic that it was shipped on 11/02/09 and still in route. I really was not happy to have been told that Logos shipped the V3! Can any one give me advice? I can replace my computer ...just confused by being sent V3. Any advice is appreciated.

Hi,

Libronix V3 has a 30 day money back guarantee. I would guess if you phoned them up they would upgrade you to V4 for the price difference of what you paid and what the same v4 license costs today. If they don't you can always return it, get your money back then repurchase, but I don't think you would have to.

Regards,

Clinton

Posts 33
Randy Butler | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 7:20 PM

Chris:
1 gig ram with a 3000+ athlon 32 bit processor

One cheap thing you may try is upgrading your RAM if you've got the slots for it.  1GB sounds like it will struggle with more than just Logos.  (Check pricing online, of course - retail RAM will be way too expensive.)

One other thing is to check your graphics card.  At 7 years old, it may not be able to hang with the graphical nature of L4 (or it may use shared RAM, which could be a performance drag with only 1GB).  Decent graphics cards can be picked up on the cheap, too.

I'm currently running L4 on 2 systems.  My laptop (the lesser performance of the 2 systems) has 2GB with Vista 32-bit, shared video RAM, and runs just fine with plenty of room to spare.  Granted, it's a newer CPU (3 yrs), but it's no powerhouse (AMD equivalent of Core 2 Duo 1.6GHz).  My desktop is older (5yrs), but has a little more raw horsepower: XP with 4GB, Dual Pentium 3GHz, and dedicated 3D graphics card (I forget the video RAM, but it's not a high-end card).  Everything runs great.

In short, you may try a couple of inexpensive upgrades to your existing system that may make L4 serviceable.  Perhaps you have some friends from whom you can cannibalize some parts.

If you need to pick up a newer system, you won't need anything high-end (my laptop was a cheapy).  Just newer.

Posts 2
Ingemar "Lloyd" Woods | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 11:17 PM

Thanks ,

Clinton I believe I just set back a day or two and think this over. I am going to go buy some memory and get up to 4 GB of ram---instead of the 1 I have right now. I am looking forward to using this software (L3 or L4) I am finishing a degree with Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary so the money invested is sure to be well spent. Thanks all of you for the tips. These forms seem to be very helpful. God bless you all.

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 11:34 PM

Ingemar Woods:
I am going to go buy some memory and get up to 4 GB of ram

You should know that unless you have a 64bit version of Windows Vista or Win7, Windows can only use something just over 3GB. You can put in more, but  it won't actually help you. But RAM is pretty cheap these days. BTW, make sure you get the right type of RAM for your computer and that you either exactly match or completely replace the RAM you have installed now.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

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