Logos 4 startup

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Ed Blough | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Sep 5 2011 8:38 AM

I have two Bible programs and I often find I go to the other just because the startup is so much faster.

If I just want to do a quick concordance like search and neither Bible program is open I know going to my other program will enable me to be searching way faster than Logos. 

Perhaps I'm getting the IPAD instant access mentality but see the load time of Logos to be a real determent to using the program. And of course if I don’t use it I don’t upgrade, order new material and eventually I stop using it altogether.

I understand Logos 4 is a powerful program but is there anything being done to allow it to start up far more quickly than it presently does now?  Even if it would load enough for me to type in what I wanted to do and then combined finishing loading with searching would be better than the start up wait I now have.   Any suggestions?  Any hope for this to speed up in future?

 

 

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Mike Binks | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2011 1:07 PM

Why not just leave it running in the background? Then it is instantly available.

tootle pip

Mike

How to get logs and post them. (now tagging post-apocalyptic fiction as current affairs)

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2011 4:17 PM

Ed Blough:
Perhaps I'm getting the IPAD instant access mentality but see the load time of Logos to be a real determent to using the program.

Surprisingly few people actually comment on this aspect; might be interesting to know what hardware you have. However, it can be left running in the background, even while the computer sleeps. I rarely start it except for book and software updates.

Dave
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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2011 4:24 PM

Dave Hooton:

Ed Blough:
Perhaps I'm getting the IPAD instant access mentality but see the load time of Logos to be a real determent to using the program.

Surprisingly few people actually comment on this aspect; might be interesting to know what hardware you have. However, it can be left running in the background, even while the computer sleeps. I rarely start it except for book and software updates.

Likewise typically have Logos 4 running (open to something, including Home Page after using close all command).

Personally wish for => Improve Logos 4 Menu Responsiveness since use Logos 4 menus much more than starting program.

By the way, current # 1 Logos User Voice suggestion => Focus on Code/Performance Optimization includes: "searching, loading, opening, etc"

Keep Smiling Smile

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Mike Pettit | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2011 4:25 PM

On my dual core laptop Logos takes an age to start while on my quad core desktop it starts almost immediatly, a decent (i.e. up to date) computer makes all the difference.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2011 5:50 PM

Ed:

Don't know if Logos is planning to make load-up changes. I just keep Logos running in the background. Unless you are always powering down your computer that is the best 'work-around'.

Since Logos is much more than a simple Bible search program I am not sure they are too concerned about optimizing load time just to do a fast search. If I did a lot of those I'd find a small freeware program to use.

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 5 2011 8:52 PM

Ed ... I'm worse than you. As the above posters suggest, I keep Logos running in the background. But even then, I reach for my phone to do a quick search, or its equivalent on my PC. Or I pull up Libronix since it can quickly copy what I want.

Probably there's a lot of truth in powerful programs with significant load times, versus more simple ones that can get simple answers quickly.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 98
Ed Blough | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 10:16 AM

I'm on an old xp machine and Logos 4 takes a lot of resources even when it is doing nothing in background. In fact I sometimes have to reboot after running Logos 4 on my machine to totally free up needed resources.  However my laptop is a 2 gig second generation dual core and it still takes a long time to load. Longer than any other program I have.

Wordsearch on the other hand loads in what I would consider normal time and I usually just start it rather than bother with Logos.  I feel Logos is the stronger of the two and yields more useful information most of the time. But when I must choose between indepth info versus immediate or readily available info I usually go for the quicker of the two.

My problem is I often want to do simply concordance type searches where I don't need a lot of information and in this Wordsearch can be started, search keyed in and results read and copied or what ever I want to do with them long before Logos even comes up to my home page. That is a vast difference in time.

This to me is a Logos problem because the more I choose not using Logos because of this long load time the more I get use to my other program and when I have to make a decision which to update or add resources too the choice usually goes to the other program.

I also can decide to upgrade my machine but since my budget includes hardware and software any money spent on hardware is less money avail for software so Logos loses out again.  Not to beat a dead horse but Logos 3 while it took longer than my other program was close enough that I often went to it.

 

 

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Brother Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 10:56 AM

Ed, One of the optimizations for L4 that shaves off time to start on my laptop is to disable the homepage.  Interestingly, you need to navigate to the homepage, click Customize in the lower left, and deselect Show Homepage at Startup.

There are also a number of other optimizations you might give some thought to:

  • Be sure that you defragment your hard drive once a month
  • Try to start Logos before other applications.  This lets the application start as quickly as possible without competing for I/O and memory resources.
  • Check to see whether you have Terminate and Stay Resident (TSR) programs on your NT box that are eating your resources, then evaluate whether they are important enough to retain at the cost of speed of access.
  • I'm another advocate for starting Logos when the machine boots up, and leaving it on in the background

"I read dead people..."

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 12:15 PM

Ed Blough:
I'm on an old xp machine and Logos 4 takes a lot of resources even when it is doing nothing in background. In fact I sometimes have to reboot after running Logos 4 on my machine to totally free up needed resources.

I think you've simply run into a Logos 4 hardware requirements issue. Libronix will probably continue to give rough parity to Wordsearch on your machine, but not Logos 4. I suspect I'd have my patience taxed using Logos 4 on that machine even after it opened. If startup takes a long time and you continually run low on resources, Logos 4 is probably running very slowly. (It wouldn't seem to make sense for Logos to open faster if you are waiting forever once it is open.)

I know these are not words you want to hear, but I think you have to get used to the idea that you will either have to upgrade hardware or continue using Wordsearch. I don't think just fixing start-up so it is acceptable on your machine would make your Logos 4 user experience much better. You might consider something like e-Sword for quick searches on that machine. (I haven't timed the difference between that and Wordsearch but suspect it would be quicker).

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 98
Ed Blough | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 12:55 PM

Actually once Logos 4 is loaded it runs at an acceptable pace. Not fast mind you but acceptable.

I understand what everyone is saving but I fail to understand why Logos needs that much overhead. Short of the Logos' language capabilities Wordsearch and others offer nearly the same search abilities.  I can search everything in my Wordsearch library which is twice the Logos in number of volumes and have it done at about the same time as Logos. I can do concordance searches in one or two bibles in about the same time.  I can do topical searches of all my topical volumes again Wordsearch's are about twice the number of Logos in about the same time. The only real difference is the load or start up time with Logos.

And yes I can update or upgrade my hardware but again that is Approx $500-$800 I can be spending in software now spent on hardware. 

I try not to use any load and terminate programs and from the little I know there aren't any using up resources. Nor do I try to run multiple windows with the exception of perhaps a Word processor program along with one of the Bible programs.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 5:33 PM

Ed Blough:
I understand what everyone is saving but I fail to understand why Logos needs that much overhead.

I don't have the answer, but I do know Logos 4 is built upon the MS .NET framework and uses WPF (Windows Presentation Foundation) for at least some rendering. Those have been cited before as part of the reason Logos 4 is slower than, say, Libronix which uses neither.

The most requested improvement on Logos' UserVoice site is code optimization including sart-up. http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-4/suggestions/510143-focus-on-code-performance-optimization?ref=title Logos has made some big improvements in speed over the past two years, but that is evidence users (like you) would like more.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 8:06 PM

Ed Blough:
And yes I can update or upgrade my hardware but again that is Approx $500-$800 I can be spending in software now spent on hardware. 

We all make decisions that affect potential purchases, whether from Logos or another, but you will have to upgrade the hardware/OS sooner or later!

Unfortunately, we can't guarantee when Logos will optimise startup times, or that it will then be faster than Libronix. Please add your votes to the Uservoice suggestion.

Dave
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Posts 60
Rev. Nannette La Fosse | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 8:10 PM

I do have the same problem. I have two other softwares and many times end up getting there. I have a nice Platinum with extras that sometimes I do not have the time to wait for. I have a new updated laptop, but I can't leave it on for personal reasons, safety, ect. If I leave the program on too long, like hours without using it, It freezes the computer sometimes. Yes, I would like a faster startup. I though that it wa just me.

Posts 348
Ralph Mauch | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 6 2011 8:46 PM

Dave Hooton:

We all make decisions that affect potential purchases, whether from Logos or another, but you will have to upgrade the hardware/OS sooner or later!

There you have it, that's the case with many programs, not just Logos 4... once you've made the move to upgrade your hadware, you're going to ask yourself what took you so long! But even so, I think that Logos can make some changes on how their system uses our computer's resources.

blessings

rrm

 

 

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Brother Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 7 2011 5:25 AM

Dave Hooton:

We all make decisions that affect potential purchases, whether from Logos or another, but you will have to upgrade the hardware/OS sooner or later!

 

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Posts 98
Ed Blough | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 7 2011 9:02 AM

Added m vote. I wonder if using MS Net Framework and WPF was the wisest move? Both seem to have huge overhead requirements and from everything I can find both are known to be slooooooooooow.

Sometimes quick and dirty is not always the best way. I hope these were stopgap measures that are now being coded around and eventually no longer needed.

I really see the instant on, instant available mentality catching on. Think IPAD.  I believe in the future people aren't going to accept long startup times. I see them demanding instant access to applications.  Perhaps I'm odd in my thinking but I can understand having Logos take time to search through a massive library to find every occurance of a word. What I don't understand is when this process takes less time to complete than it does for the program to load initially. To me that makes no sense.

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